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Oh my God! Felger had an excellent point

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by spacecrime, Jun 5, 2007.

  1. spacecrime

    spacecrime Rookie

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    One that all of us missed.

    Talking tonight on Fox's Two Loonie's show (yes, I broke down and watched it), he points out that one reason Samuel is not getting much support is that he is treating an $8 million dollar year paycheck as an insult. He then listed all the solid Patriot players who never got $8 million in any year. It was quite a list.

    Not used to Felger actually thinking something out instead of saying whatever will shock people most and make them listen to his radio show to see what outrageous thing he'll say next.

    Good job, Felgie.
  2. mgteich

    mgteich PatsFans.com Veteran PatsFans.com Supporter

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    It is this logic that will lead to losing Samuel. It makes absolutely no difference what past patriots were paid. What matters is the current market and what the patriots believe his value is.

    Our #3 TE is pocketing over $3M this year.
    Our #3 WR is pocketing over $6M this year.

    Surely, this is crazy! Surely, we've never paid our backup TE's and receivers that much. Had we considered what we paid in the past, we'd probably not have signed these two or Stallworth. We wouldn't be a better team, but we would have treated these players more fairly, within the context of what we paid past players.

    As with Branch and Givens, I am not saying that the patriots should offer more than they have. Heck, if I were in the front office he'd have been traded already. I guess I don't have tthe pateince to wait until the end of July when he will likely be traded.

    Me, I don't understand why we didn't use our draft choices. Branch and Hughes would look awfully good right about now, or Branch and Bush.
  3. BelichickFan

    BelichickFan B.O. = Fugazi PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #24 Jersey

    That's very misleading because both of those players are getting that money including a signing bonus that's spread over multiple years. Welker is making less than $3M a year, K. Brady less than $1.5M.

    Samuel's $8M is for one year and he would get another monster paycheck next year either through another tag or a signing bonus.

    Bad examples.
  4. zippo59

    zippo59 Rookie

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    Samuel doesn't seem to give a crap about his teammates. Otherwise he would have gone to Hill's funeral.
  5. mgteich

    mgteich PatsFans.com Veteran PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Samuel doesn't give a crap about Hill or Hill's family, or he would have gone to the funeral.

  6. makoute

    makoute Rookie

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    Is it a crime if he doesn't? Is it even wrong if he doesn't?
  7. mgteich

    mgteich PatsFans.com Veteran PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Welker will get another $6M next year. Yes, we have rights to ALL three players after 2007. The 2008 contract price for Samuel is the 2008 franchise price. If Welker really plays until 2011, then your analysis is spot on. Ther reality is that he better be really good or we will have overpaid a lot.

  8. BelichickFan

    BelichickFan B.O. = Fugazi PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #24 Jersey

    I didn't know about the $3.5M bonus next year for Welker but it's still disingenuous to compare a one year payment of $8M as a one year contract to a one year or two year payment in that vicinity as part of a 5 or so year deal.
  9. Bella*chick

    Bella*chick Addicted to the light

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    #12 Jersey

    Certainly not a crime, but it doesn't make him look very good.
  10. rabthepat

    rabthepat Rookie

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    Adios Asante...we won a SB without Ty Law on the field and we can win one without YOU!!!!!!!!! Say hi to Deion Branch for us!!!!!
  11. DarrylS

    DarrylS PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I agree seems as though he is already distancing himself from the mainstream expectations of this team.. easier to say good bye.
  12. betterthanthealternative

    betterthanthealternative Rookie

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    Felger's comment, and the lead to this thread, aren't about logic, they are about insults. That's in the emotional realm.

    It is thinking that this has something to do with logic that will create problems.

    Responding to an emotional situation as if it is a logical situation is a common, and very costly, mistake, and ironically it is usually an emotional act on the part of the person doing it, albeit below their level of awareness.
  13. Patriot_in_NY

    Patriot_in_NY Rookie

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    I'm sure thats the plan. I'd be happy with a second for him. Oh yeah, and I'd make sure its a trade to obscurity too. Someplace like Detriot, or Oakland. :cool:
  14. PatsMyBoyz!

    PatsMyBoyz! Rookie

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    I saw that show also,and this is the comment I found interesting,though I'm no contract guru but some here def are:
    Felger brought up the past Shawn Alexander situation and how the Hawks worked it by promising not to franchise him the following year.He liked that,they agreed,and the Hawks went on to the SB with Alexander.
    Felger's thought was to offer Samuels a promise of no franchise tag next year,let him rip it this season,then let him go because Felger (among others) sees Samuels as pretty much a one-hit-wonder of sorts;not literally of course, just not as great as advertised during his contract year last season.
    The consensus was to find a way to keep him this year because we need him,but after that let him go.
  15. patchick

    patchick Moderatrix Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I have to agree with mgteich, I don't think Felger's point is much good at all. (Did he carefully adjust all those past contracts as percentages of the salary cap at the time? Or as a percentage of new contracts written to comparable players at the time? Or heck, even the cost of living?)

    Besides, we have no idea what exactly it is that Asante's insulted by. I'd guess it's more likely to arise from the long-term deal they offered than the franchise number. In that it could be any number of factors -- not just total dollars but structure, frontloading, etc. Maybe it was structured in a way that suggests they're not convinced he's for real and want to be able to cut him loose after a year or two. Who knows?
  16. marty

    marty Rookie

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    No offense to Felgie, (well actually...)Pats FO creative structuring of a deal has probably been discussed with Asante and his agent 10 different ways before Felgie even remembered the Alexander deal.
  17. patchick

    patchick Moderatrix Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    ...oh yeah, I forgot another plausible insult scenario: The Jets "offer" Asante an 8-year $80-million deal if only the Pats will be reasonable on compensation...knowing full well that this will never come to pass. So Asante says "see, I really am worth that much! Give me that much!" Then the Pats insult him by saying "that's a BS offer, they only made it because they knew they wouldn't have to honor it."

    This would also explain how Asante suddenly went from acting giddy like he was going to win the lottery with the Pats to being "insulted" and holding out.

    Ah, the insult possibilities are endless! :rolleyes:
  18. fair catch fryar

    fair catch fryar Rookie

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    No Jersey Selected

    Seems to me that Asante is not being very savvy and is painting himself right into a corner by making these claims right now and further distancing himself from the fans. I wonder how much of this is a ploy in connection with his agent because the Pats are smart to wait until the last minute. Would he not be worth more to a team come mid-July just before training camps open up?
  19. PatsMyBoyz!

    PatsMyBoyz! Rookie

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    I don't know how much communication has taken place lately,but no doubt the Pats have thought of every angle. Point is,I'm sure they haven't put every angle out on the table yet. Actually,if he's indeed a 1 year wonder as some claim,there's no reason to tag him next year anyway.
    All other stuff aside,I'm curious to see how he's performing in the 08 season.
  20. Brady'sButtBoy

    Brady'sButtBoy Rookie

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    Regardless of what Felger meant, and I think in general he raises a good point, the so-called emotional, non-rational, reaction from many of the lower paid guys in the locker room I'm sure will be only to look at their own bottom line and say, "Man, almost $8m for one year would be awesome." It's that simple and when they hear a dude being offered that much dough for one season say the way he's being treated, "is just not right," well, I'm sure plenty of guys roll their eyes and shake their heads.

    NY interested? Complete smoke screen by the Jest: after trading picks to get a first round CB this year, it seems mighty far fetched they would trade at least another 1st and 3rd (can't imagine BB taking anything less and he'd likely want more) to get a super high priced CB. It doesn't make much sense strategically. Now, pissing off Asante to dampen the love fest going on in Foxboro with the 'new' Patriots, that makes perfect sense. maybe Asante's agent will not let him be used like a tool.

    The holdout? Forget it, that would cost Samuel roughly $5m with no guarantee he won't be franchised again - something the Pats will never promise. Even if the Pat's did let him go next year and Samuel got a big deal somewhere else, he'd probably never recoup the $5m he lost sitting out. If Samuel makes up his mind he'll have to leave to get his money, then more practical tactics would be to show up and try to be just enough of a pain in the keester that BB has no choice but to run him out of town.
    Last edited: Jun 6, 2007

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