Offensive Line Play for Giants, Week 17

Discussion in ' - Patriots Fan Forum' started by unoriginal, Jan 27, 2008.

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  1. unoriginal

    unoriginal In the Starting Line-Up

    The Giants' strength, defensively, is obviously that defensive line.
    They one-gap and the linebackers fill their gaps very aggressively behind them, and they are all fast.
    Osi Umenyiora and Michael Strahan, the ends, are the headliners, but in week 17 it was actually the tackles who had the best game.
    Barry Cofield, who I believe left the game with an injury, is very good, but perhaps the best pass-rushing performance came from Jason Tuck.
    Tuck is their 3rd DE; he played inside for most of the night and did as much damage overall against our interior line as Strahan did against O'Callaghan.

    If there is one matchup I'm not so worried about in the Super Bowl, its Osi Umenyiora against Matt Light.
    Light acquitted himself very well in this game.

    When the Giants did blitz, they patterned their blitzes after the Jets, sending nickel backs in from wide against the short defensive line.
    Spagnola also seems to like to blitz his linebackers on run downs, but that's beyond the scope of this thread.

    Relevent Reiss postings:
    Positional Groupings
    Offensive Particpation

    First, the pass play listings.
    I tried to be more informative as to what was going on on each play.
    Short screen passes, which are significant in that the o-line doesn't really have to pass block, are marked, as are plays when O'Callaghan got help either from Wesley Britt or Ben Watson as tight ends.
    Contrary to popular belief, Britt was normally brought into the game as a run blocker, and Watson didn't do much chipping on Strahan; for the most part, O'Callaghan had Strahan one-on-one.
    I also marked plays with play action - you can see that most of the times Britt helps O'Callaghan are on these plays.

    Demerits on plays on which multiple failures occurred are listed in chronological order.
    Thus, when a "Pressure" occurs before a "Sack," you can assume that the pressure helped cause the sack.

    Time	Down	Info
    10:52	1 & 10	(play action)
    10:18	1 & 10
    09:04	2 & 10	(screen pass)
    08:55	3 & 10	(screen pass)
    08:08	4 & 2	[COLOR="DarkOrange"][B]Koppen: knockdown[/B][/COLOR]	(Tuck)
    07:01	2 & 10	
    05:42	2 & 8	[COLOR="Orange"][B]Light: pressure[/B][/COLOR]
    05:30	3 & 8	
    03:36	1 & 10	[COLOR="orange"][B]Mankins/Koppen: pressure[/B][/COLOR]	(OC + Britt)
    		[COLOR="orange"][B]Hochstein: pressure[/B][/COLOR]
    02:51	3 & 14	[COLOR="orange"][B]Mankins: pressure[/B][/COLOR]
    		[COLOR="Red"][B]Koppen/Hochstein: sack[/B][/COLOR]
    02:28	1 & 10
    01:50	1 & 10	(screen pass)
    00:35	2 & 10
    15:00	2 & 4	[COLOR="Orange"][B]O'Callaghan: pressure[/B][/COLOR]	(play action)
    14:04	1 & 10	(screen pass)
    12:59	1 & 10	(screen pass)
    11:28	2 & 13	(play action + screen pass)
    10:45	3 & 14
    07:02	1 & 10	
    05:16	2 & 6	[COLOR="orange"][B]O'Callaghan: pressure[/B][/COLOR]
    04:07	1 & 10	(play action)	(OC + Britt)
    02:56	2 & 6	(screen pass)
    02:10	3 & 4	[COLOR="orange"][B]Koppen/Hochstein: pressure[/B][/COLOR]
    15:00	1 & 10
    13:50	3 & 7	[COLOR="orange"][B]Light: pressure[/B][/COLOR]
    		[COLOR="DarkOrange"][B]O'Callaghan: knockdown[/B][/COLOR]
    08:30	2 & 12
    07:41	3 & 8	[COLOR="#ff8c00"][B]O'Callaghan: knockdown[/B][/COLOR]	(Torbor)
    		[COLOR="Orange"][B]Mankins/Koppen: pressure[/B] [/COLOR](Tuck)
    06:53	1 & 10	
    06:14	1 & 10	[COLOR="DarkOrange"][B]Light: knockdown[/B][/COLOR]	(Watson rub)
    05:39	2 & 6	(screen pass)
    04:19	2 & 8	[COLOR="Orange"][B]O'Callaghan: pressure[/B][/COLOR]
    04:10	1 & 1	[COLOR="orange"][B]O'Callaghan: pressure[/B][/COLOR]
    00:30	1 & 10	[COLOR="orange"][B]O'Callaghan: pressure[/B][/COLOR]
    14:19	3 & 9	[COLOR="orange"][B]O'Callaghan: pressure[/B][/COLOR]
    13:37	1 & 10	[COLOR="orange"][B]Faulk: pressure[/B][/COLOR]
    13:31	2 & 10	(screen pass)
    12:59	3 & 11	
    11:29	1 & 10	[COLOR="orange"][B]Mankins: pressure[/B][/COLOR]
    11:25	2 & 10	(Britt + OC)
    11:15	3 & 10	[COLOR="DarkOrange"][B]O'Callaghan: knockdown[/B][/COLOR]
    		[COLOR="Orange"][B]Hochstein: pressure[/B][/COLOR]
    		[COLOR="orange"][B]Faulk: pressure[/B][/COLOR]
    09:53	1 & 10	[COLOR="orange"][B]Hochstein: pressure[/B][/COLOR]	(play action)	(OC + Britt)
    		[COLOR="orange"][B]O'Callaghan: pressure[/B][/COLOR]
    09:31	1 & 10	(play action)	(OC + Britt)
    08:58	2 & 20	(Watson rub)
    08:20	3 & 11	(OC + Watson)
    06:16	3 & 9	[COLOR="orange"][B]Hochstein: pressure[/B][/COLOR]
    05:26	1 & 10	(screen pass)
    A pattern in these demerits are that O'Callaghan seemed to wear down as the game went along, while elsewhere it seemed the Giants defensive line wore down.
    I take that as a result of O'Callaghan not being in game shape, and the Giants' running themselves ragged rushing Brady early.

    Another thing you might notice is that there is not a demerit that I couldn't attribute to one player or another, i.e. there is no play where I simply list "Pressure" without assigning it to a player.
    That supports my earlier assertion that the Giants weren't creating scheme problems with blitzers,
    rather that the defensive line was beating their matchups.

    Here are the totals:
    Name		Sack	Knock	Press	Hold	False
    Light		0	1	2	0	0
    Mankins		0	0	4	0	0
    Koppen		1	1	3	0	0
    Hochstein	1	0	5	0	0
    O'Callaghan	0	3	7	0	0
    Faulk		0	0	2	0	0
    Those are very high totals for everyone, except Light, who is right where he's been at since I started keeping track of this.
    Even Faulk had more trouble that usual making blocks.

    Also notice that there were no penalties called on the offensive line, a first since I've been keeping track.

    O'Callaghan obviously had a rough night, though interestingly he seemed to do consistently worse in goalline situations than anywhere else on the field.


    You can see that he kind of loses balance and leverage moving to an inside position on Strahan there.
    Meanwhile, Evans misses his block and kind of gets away with a hold.

    In the first half of the game, the Giants had Strahan doing inside power rushes against O'Callaghan and/or stunting down the line as part of their plan to get pressure up the middle.
    As the game went along, Strahan began taking wider, Osi Umenyiora-like rushes against Brady; the adjustment the Patriots made, starting midway in the 3rd, was to bring Watson in motion towards Strahan and wham/chip him.
    They did this maybe 2 or 3 times all game.
    Here is the first play they did it, at 6:10 in the 3rd quarter:


    As you can see, Umenyiora gets away from Light here; he goes on to smack Brady in the head as he runs past.
    Hopefully Umenyiora will continue to play tag with Brady in the Super Bowl instead of playing football.

    As I said earlier, most of the pressure early on came from the Giants' defensive tackles.
    They are even more embarrasing than the one of Strahan schooling O'Callaghan above.
    Here is Jason Tuck blowing by Dan Koppen at 8:06 in the 1st:


    Koppen makes a lunge at Tuck's inside hip, and Tuck swims right over top of him.
    In the bottom part of the pictures, you can see Mankins swinging out behind Light to pick up a blitzing linebacker.
    Obviously a man-to-man protection scheme was called at the line.


    This is probably the single most impressive pass rush of the game, coming at 3:36 in the 1st quarter.
    Barry Cofield swims over both Mankins and Koppen in succession.
    If you watch the video it kind of looks like he's running a slalom course. Koppen isn't even in the last screenshot.
    • Like Like x 1
    Last edited: Jan 27, 2008
  2. unoriginal

    unoriginal In the Starting Line-Up

    Line Play, cont.

    This one is from shortly thereafter, at 2:47 in the 1st:


    Basically everyone screws up on this play, except Light.
    Tuck beats Mankins cleanly by defeating his arms, and Brady has to twist away from his rush.
    Koppen and Hochstein can't maintain their double-team on Fred Robbins, and don't even block the blitzing Antonio Pierce, who end up combining on the sack.
    It's likely Strahan would have gotten on the scene sooner if he hadn't run over a prone Jason Tuck.
    Osi Umenyiora, meanwhile, continues his sprint training with great success.


    This one looks like a quick running back screen that was defeated by wide pressure, coming at 13:43 in the 3rd.
    Light lets Umenyiora right around him and seals down on the tackle.
    Faulk chips the blitzing corner and turns around to face Brady.
    The play is defeated by speed from Umenyiora and from Strahan beating O'Callaghan on the outside.
    An excellent illustration of why the Pats don't run RB screens anymore.


    Or maybe Matt Light just thinks he's on the bow of the Titanic.


    This is actually Moss' record-setting touchdown reception in the 4th, at 11:15.
    As you can see, the right side of the line disintergrates.
    Strahan drives Hochstein back, allowing Reggie Torbor to loop around O'Callaghan.
    Faulk misses his block on Aaron Ross.
    Hochstein and O'Callaghan are able to drive Strahan across Brady's face.
    But that leaves Torbor and Ross with a clean shot at Brady.
    At the bottom, you can see what kind of success Umenyiora has when he tries to rush inside.
    Last edited: Jan 27, 2008
  3. unoriginal

    unoriginal In the Starting Line-Up

    Reading coverages, and Kick coverages


    This play, from 6:59 in the 2nd quarter, illustrates a thread from earlier in the week about why the Pats split their backs out.
    I argued that it wasn't to create matchup problems but to help Brady diagnose the coverage.
    As you can see here, there is a corner up top on Evans, and he is playing outside shade and reading Brady's eyes.
    That's a pretty strong indication that's it's a zone coverage.
    Thus Brady knows he can throw right over the blitzing DB to Randy Moss, because that zone is likely to be vacant due to the blitz.


    Finally, on the subject of Hixon's 74 yard TD return, here are what good kickoff coverages look like. Note the people slamming into the wedge.


    And here is the TD return. Nobody got into the wedge on this one. Ventrone, in the top left, was knocked down, Woods left his lane to go wide left, and Eric Alexander did nothing. You could drive a truck through that hole.
  4. Patriotic Fervor

    Patriotic Fervor Rotational Player and Threatening Starter's Job

    Nice work. Please give us some more over the week, to help things go a little faster...and smoother!

  5. unoriginal

    unoriginal In the Starting Line-Up

    I think I'm gonna have to ask for a kindly mod to fix that. Goddamn it. I really should look up these names before I write.

    Anyways, I agree, he's a player. I noticed the Giants dropped him into coverage when they zone blitzed, probably on the theory that (a) Tuck is athletic enough to cover and (b) that it was better to bring pressure off the edge. They'd be better off dropping Umenyiora and stunting Tuck because Osi, in my opinion, gives you guys nothing.

    Stopping Tuck is definetly job #1 for the Pats up front in the Super Bowl. He got a lot of double teams in the 2nd half in week 17.
    Last edited: Jan 27, 2008
  6. kurtinelson

    kurtinelson In the Starting Line-Up

    #37 Jersey

    Once again terrific job, Unoriginal. How do you get the video screen shots of the game?
  7. Koettbulle

    Koettbulle Practice Squad Player

    No biggie but I'm watching this game again and I noticed Koppen IS in the last screenshot of the Cofield rush at 3:36. You can see his helmet behind blue 72.
  8. PonyExpress

    PonyExpress In the Starting Line-Up

    unoriginal is awesome.
  9. patological

    patological Practice Squad Player

    Bump. This excellent analylis deserves more commentary.

    Unoriginal, I'm intrigued by you're comment in the thread starter:
    "O'Callaghan seemed to wear down as the game went along, while elsewhere it seemed the Giants defensive line wore down. I take that as a result of O'Callaghan not being in game shape, and the Giants' running themselves ragged rushing Brady early."

    Clearly, the Giants went all-out aggressive, nothing to lose and a point to prove. But did they pay the price?

    If so, Coughlin and his D.C. would be fools to try a repeat that level of pressure. So, the question may be how conservative the Giants may be willing to go on defense to have something left in the tank. And, given his history, will Coughlin revert to his overly-cautious form?
  10. GhostOfFoxboro

    GhostOfFoxboro On the Roster

    Unoriginal, you are a credit to Pats fans everywhere. I lurk on other teams message boards at times before big games and I haven't ever seen an analysis this deep or well thought out anywhere else.

  11. cavtroop

    cavtroop In the Starting Line-Up

    #87 Jersey

    This deserves a sticky, at least until Sunday.

    Unorig. is AWESOME. I love it when he posts, I learn something new (or lots of somethings) every time.
  12. unoriginal

    unoriginal In the Starting Line-Up

    I think they will repeat that level of pressure, on the theory that it would be advantageous to jar the Pats early and get them out of rhythm, or best case force mistakes and build an early lead. Actually, best case scenario would be to knock Brady and his "boot" out of the game early, and see lots and lots of Matt Cassel.

    If they could just get something out of Umenyiora like they got out of Tuck, it would be a pretty lethal defense.

    My bad. I try to shrink these screen shots for speed/making sure the host doesn't go down, but I just end up confusing myself. I'll stick with the super long image-chains in the future.

    I download a torrent of the game, pause the game and take screenshots of the player.
  13. fgssand

    fgssand Supporter Supporter

    #12 Jersey

    Unoriginal, you rock - thank you for giving us laymen a glimpse and a hint of what really goes on up front.

    What is great about our having played them a few weeks back is we really got a chance to see what they do and how they do it. When it comes to their scheme of pressure & blitz, there really is only so much they can do to change it up, whereas we will be able to prepare, much better for what they bring.

    I think the reaction preparation is a huge advantage for NE - not to mention the return of K. Brady, Neil & Kaczur!!

    Keeping Tom Brady clean is one obvious key to this football game.
    Last edited: Jan 31, 2008
  14. Mike the Brit

    Mike the Brit Minuteman Target Supporter

    Disable Jersey

    :yeahthat: .........
  15. PATSNUTme

    PATSNUTme Paranoid Homer Moderator Staff Member Supporter

    #75 Jersey

    Instead of Horst and O'Callahan we will have Neal and Kaczur playing in this game. They are strters so must be a little better than the other two. We will also have K. Brady which we didn't have last game.

    This should be better for protection. Also, if we come out in a spread and are able to execute to quick throws early, the Giants DL will get tired.
  16. Clonamery

    Clonamery Supporter Supporter

    Good bumpin' stuff.....
  17. unoriginal

    unoriginal In the Starting Line-Up

    While I agree it helps the Pats to have the recent experience of playing these guys, I hope what some of my analysis here demonstrates is that the Giants have some really good players.

    We'll see if Steve Spagnuolo is up to the task of working them into favorable matchups. Probably the most exciting matchup of the game, I think.
  18. BradyManny

    BradyManny Pro Bowl Player

    Awesome job as usual.

    BTW, I was unable to locate a torrent for the NYG game, I take it you were successful?

    Anyway, what I find most interesting is how even with the fact that our OL (with the exception of Light) seems to have performed below its standards, we still scored on 7/9 possessions. Certainly bodes well for Sunday.

    My Q's for you then unoriginal would be a) how do you think the Pats will involve K. Brady in the blocking? (either for rush or pass) and b) how much more success can we count on with Hoch and OCal replaced by Kazcur and Neal? (again in rush or pass situations)
    Last edited: Jan 31, 2008
  19. ClevTrev

    ClevTrev Rotational Player and Threatening Starter's Job

    Another great post. Football threads are back with this and the other one like it you posted earlier.

    I agree with your response to whether the Giants should be more conservative with their pressure in the Super Bowl to conserve energy and prevent fatigue. They can't afford to give the Pats a pass early, or they likely will find themselves down by a large margin. Remember, they were beaten up in the last game of the season, and they've gotten an extra week off before the Super Bowl. We'll see if this rest does them any good.

    Also, having K. Brady in combination with Neal and Kaczur and a two-week brush up on controlling the Giants front four should be beneficial to the Pats.
  20. unoriginal

    unoriginal In the Starting Line-Up

    Pats have only used their TEs for run blocking this year. If they do pass block, its usually because its a play action pass.

    For run blocking they like to use Brady on that "wham" trap block, along with the usual zone and power blocking.

    Kaczur coming in for O'Callaghan I see as being a big upgrade. He handled the Jags and Chargers ends well, and they are physically similar to Strahan. Of course, Strahan is a HoF level player, so don't expect pancakes. I would expect half as many pressures as O'Callaghan surrendered.
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