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Obama's speech to the Arab World

Discussion in 'Political Discussion' started by Patters, Jun 4, 2009.

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  1. Patters

    Patters Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I thought it was an amazing and intelligent speech. Although is call for women's rights was certainly impressive, I thought the overall intelligence of the speech was terrific. This part was especially powerful:

    Around the world, the Jewish people were persecuted for centuries, and anti-Semitism in Europe culminated in an unprecedented Holocaust. Tomorrow, I will visit Buchenwald, which was part of a network of camps where Jews were enslaved, tortured, shot and gassed to death by the Third Reich. Six million Jews were killed - more than the entire Jewish population of Israel today. Denying that fact is baseless, ignorant, and hateful. Threatening Israel with destruction - or repeating vile stereotypes about Jews - is deeply wrong, and only serves to evoke in the minds of Israelis this most painful of memories while preventing the peace that the people of this region deserve.

    On the other hand, it is also undeniable that the Palestinian people - Muslims and Christians - have suffered in pursuit of a homeland. For more than sixty years they have endured the pain of dislocation. Many wait in refugee camps in the West Bank, Gaza, and neighboring lands for a life of peace and security that they have never been able to lead. They endure the daily humiliations - large and small - that come with occupation. So let there be no doubt: the situation for the Palestinian people is intolerable. America will not turn our backs on the legitimate Palestinian aspiration for dignity, opportunity, and a state of their own.

    For decades, there has been a stalemate: two peoples with legitimate aspirations, each with a painful history that makes compromise elusive. It is easy to point fingers - for Palestinians to point to the displacement brought by Israel's founding, and for Israelis to point to the constant hostility and attacks throughout its history from within its borders as well as beyond. But if we see this conflict only from one side or the other, then we will be blind to the truth: the only resolution is for the aspirations of both sides to be met through two states, where Israelis and Palestinians each live in peace and security.
     
  2. maverick4

    maverick4 Banned

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    Obama should protect himself from assassination attempts by any extremist Muslim or Orthodox Jew. Remember Rabin.
     
  3. Leave No Doubt

    Leave No Doubt PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Almost all of his speeches are good;)
     
  4. maverick4

    maverick4 Banned

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    I found out recently Obama's speechwriter, right now and during his campaign, is a 26-year old kid who writes Obama's speeches while sitting with a laptop at Starbucks.
     
  5. Leave No Doubt

    Leave No Doubt PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    For real? That's too funny:D
     
  6. PatsFanInEaglesLand

    PatsFanInEaglesLand In the Starting Line-Up

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    #37 Jersey

    I was going to post this earlier that Obama compared Palestinians to Holocaust victims, and how unbelievably ignorant and insulting it was. Not surprised by who agreed with Rev. Wright's protege.
     
  7. Patters

    Patters Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I guess Obama's efforts aren't going to win support from Al Qaeda or American right wingers, but he's hoping to connect with moderate and independent minded people. I think he knows he can't connect with extremists. They have their own agendas.
     
  8. IcyPatriot

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    #87 Jersey


    Newt liked the speech ... so :confused2:
     
  9. BelichickFan

    BelichickFan B.O. = Fugazi PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #24 Jersey

    That's not what I heard on Hannity's show. Newt wasn't critical just to be critical but he has some serious issues with the stuff obama said about Iran/Isreal and his continual negativity of the U.S.
     
  10. scout

    scout Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal

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    #15 Jersey

    I figured as much. I was surfing listening to the rave reviews, then went to FOX. Charles Krauthammer was doing his usual drawling spiel, followed up by the thumbs down opinion of the remaining cast. Then I read the typical right wing posts here followed up by emails from my Texas friends. Sometimes I forget that his popularity is at 65%. Regardless, my opinion of him hasn't changed. He'll serve two terms and make a great impact on this country and the world. Tho, the above people will never acknowledge it.
     
  11. PatsFanInVa

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    It's a juxtaposition, not a comparison. Comparative suffering is a losing game from square 1.

    I found it realistic, and am not surprised at the usual right wing knee-jerkers throwing it on the pile of random attack-notes.

    PFIEL, we sometimes agree and more often disagree, but it does not honor the memory of the Holocaust and those who suffered and died in it, to cut off legitimate approaches to peace.

    This is a Muslim extremist's nightmare: A charismatic moderate who can drive a wedge between the extremists on all sides, and the people of good will who will cautiously edge toward peace when given the slightest opening.

    When was the last time you heard cheers in Cairo for lines from the Talmud -- and all it took was juxtaposition with the Torah and the Quran.

    I agree with our president's central premise, that in the end, the Palestinians will and must have their state. I agree that Palestinians have suffered, and I agree -- as this president had the stones to say in the middle of Cairo -- that Israel has the right to exist and that right must be supported by her closest ally, the U.S.

    I cannot begrudge a suffering people acknowledgment of their suffering simply because they are not Jews, nor because they are present adversaries of a Jewish state -- just as I'm opposed to idiots using "anti-Zionism" as a cover for antisemitism, I'm against unnecessary suffering for any people.

    As is clear to all, of course, the devil will be in the details. But Obama's done something very difficult, which is kindle hope for peace with Israel in the Arab world.

    We'll see where it leads. For a man to stand up in a university in Cairo and shout in Arabic "we love you!" at an American president -- who has just insisted on the sovereignty of Israel -- seems like an excellent start.

    PFnV
     
  12. IcyPatriot

    IcyPatriot ------------- PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #87 Jersey

    A Palestinian state is needed to help end the problems. Yes, those people are suffering and they deserve to live better. But there has never been a Palestinian land ... never. Palestinians are Arabs who are being exploited by others. The Jewish people can trace their heritage on their land back a few thousand years. The Palestinians can not say the same because they are Arabs ... Egyptians and Jordanians perhaps. Just saying that's all because the Palestinian thing is all messed up.
     
  13. PatsFanInVa

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    Icy, It's not 1948 and it's not 1966... and beginning even before the six-day war the scales had tipped for this people toward a national consciousness. It's certainly interlayered with pan-Arabist thought and pan-Islamist thought, but Palestinian nationalism is a real phenomenon. Does the Islamist extremist think so? Of course not. Does the Palestinian who, while Muslim, prefers peace, think of himself as Palestinian or Arab? I think both.

    Palestinians focus most publicly at differences in Israel. But there is certainly no love lost between Palestinians and the Jordanian authorities, whom they tried to overthrow. It's clear that state structures mean something in the Arab world, despite the rhetoric. The "United Arab Republic" -- Egypt -- is so named because at the height of Arab nationalism, Egypt united with Syria and (I think) Libya (though it may have been Iraq) in this "pan arabist" nucleus. Until about 10 minutes later, that is, until Pan Arabism went by the wayside as various nationalist aspirations -- or the despots in various nations, if you prefer -- came to the fore.

    It is not a contest. One people finds peoplehood consistently over 3000 years -- but statehood only again becomes a necessity by the actions of surrounding peoples. Another people lives with a consciousness of a larger identity for millennia, and then finds itself alone, occupied and living in deprivation. That experience, I believe, has made Palestinian consciousness distinct from say, Jordanian consciousness.

    Just as I am a Jew and not an Israeli, I think a Palestinian Arab sees himself as distinct from a Jordanian.
     
  14. IcyPatriot

    IcyPatriot ------------- PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #87 Jersey

    Good post ... I just have never understood why they don't also get a piece of Jordan ... the Arab world stands behind them so much and yet what have they given them aside from money for Hamas. So in the end they get their own land ... but really it won't solve anything IMO because really this is over Jerusalem (religious significance) isn't it?
     
  15. BelichickFan

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    #24 Jersey

    55% which isn't that good as it's just his popularity, not the number who would vote for him next time. His "Strongly Approve-Strongly Disapprove" is at +2% compared to +28% on inauguration day.

    Rasmussen Reports: The Most Comprehensive Public Opinion Data Anywhere

    He'll . . . make a great impact on this country and the world.[/QUOTE]
    Unfortunately . . . it'll be a great negative impact.
     
  16. Patters

    Patters Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Obama seems to be that rare combination of pragamtism and idealism. I think he has a good chance of being one of the greatest presidents, and is slowly moving the center to the left. So far, the Republican Party is trying to stay where it is, but even there, there are more and more signs of movement. Just as the American right was once pro-slavery or against a woman's right to vote or opposed to civil rights, someday we'll say the American right was once against Muslims or opposed national health care or opposed gay rights. Change is in the air. 20 years from now, BF will be saying that he was always for gay rights and national health care ;)
     
  17. BelichickFan

    BelichickFan B.O. = Fugazi PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #24 Jersey

    And I (honestly) think he has a good chance of being one of the worst and being remembered for bankrupting the country.

    I'm already for anyone's right to be gay. Health care for people who to nothing but eat, breath and sh!t ? Nope.
     
  18. PatsFanInVa

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    It depends. Someone in Damascus can say "yes! You go! Martyr yourself!" and someone in Gaza can say "nothing to lose, and Paradise to gain." Suddenly Paradise looks very real, when this world offers nothing.

    Give a man something to lose and he behaves very differently.

    Is this over Jerusalem, in the end? For many. For many others, and yes they scare the sh** out of me, it's about killing Jews and creating a Judenrein middle east. For some Jews it's about killing Arabs.

    For most it's about getting up in the morning and not being afraid of what happens at the bus stop, or out of the clear blue sky.

    Good post to you too. I'm about out of hope for the region and have been for a while. I'm a little less so tonight.

    What Obama does is say look, I'll be fair to you. I'm a grown-up. Can you be fair to me, or are you a child?

    From the reaction in Cairo, I think the center exists everywhere... and the center consists of people trying to solve problems not chase each other to the fringes.

    None of us know what we'll see when we look back in a few years, but I am hoping, even praying that we look back and see the beginning of a time of peace.
     
  19. IcyPatriot

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    #87 Jersey

    ;););)............
     
  20. shmessy

    shmessy Maude Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #75 Jersey


    Ironic that the two groups most P.O'd about this speech today is Al Qaeda and American Neo-Cons.

    Think about it for awhile and you begin to see that they have more in common with each other than they'd like to admit.
     
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