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Obama Schools McCain on Energy Policy

Discussion in 'Political Discussion' started by shmessy, Jun 23, 2008.

  1. shmessy

    shmessy Maude Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #75 Jersey

    Keep in mind, folks, that the past week McCain's solution has been "more drilling" - - which, if started tomorrow, would take anywhere from 10-20 years to have an effect. Meanwhile, Obama said "go after the speculators, tighten the margin requirements and regulate the oil commodities markets like EVERY OTHER commodities market".

    What do the experts say?:

    http://www.marketwatch.com/news/sto...x?guid={D3EC8E90-A28A-40D2-9687-DBE0518F6D48}
  2. PatriotsReign

    PatriotsReign On the Roster

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    Don't you do investment advising for a living? If so, what are your thoughts?

    I think it would provide more economic stability to a quickly deteriorating and shaky market. Just my op.
  3. otis p. driftwood

    otis p. driftwood Rookie

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    Where were you when I posted this last week? LOL...there's an article over at marketwatch about the oil bubble. I even said "hat tip, Shmessy" when I posted it...:D

    I can't fault anything about that approach (Obama's). It would be a good time to be long DUG...lol.


    I also believe that if we were agressive about developing alt. energy sources the price of oil would go down pretty rapidly, as OPEC got scared. Can you imagine? Suddenly little Hugo Chavez has nothing to threaten us with...but a lot of people still think "drill".

    And drilling isn't bad either....
  4. BelichickFan

    BelichickFan B.O. = Fugazi PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #24 Jersey

    You can find people on the other side too, I've heard both sides of the speculators thing.

    Regarding drilling, it could go much faster than the numbers they're giving but Granny Pelosi would have to get Congress to expedite all the paperwork. The 10-20 years thing isn't for drilling and piping, it's mostly for paperwork, beaurocracy and waiting.
  5. shmessy

    shmessy Maude Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #75 Jersey


    Not an Investment Advisor, but a CFP (Certified Financial Planner) - - more like big picture stuff for individuals (investments, retirement planning, budgeting, insurance protection, etc) - lots of future value analyses, i.e. at such and such return minus CPI, factoring in goals, will you be able to reach your goal?, etc.

    When it comes to individual securities and forecasts, by the time I know something - - it's too late. I rely and 4 and 5 star rated Morningstar Mutuals and ETFs and let the experts on Wall Street (and their 20-30 deep analyst teams) do the picking - - the market IS stacked against the individual.

    That being said, from what I see, the margin requirement for oil trading is around 10%, whereas for most other commidities and stocks it ranges between 20-40%. The Commodieis Futures Trading Commission curretnly has a record 60+ investigations in process for oil price manipulation by traders.

    Perspective: "In January 2000, speculators controlled 37 percent of contracts to buy West Texas Intermediate crude oil on the New York Mercantile Exchange, with the rest held by physical hedgers, including refiners and airlines that need to hedge against delivered fuel costs.

    By this April, speculators controlled 71 percent of the contracts, according to data provided to the House Energy and Commerce Committee by the Commodity Futures Trading Commission."

    source: http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601103&sid=aYHQQHa4LO3M&refer=news

    Meanwhile, we have US Energy Secretary Sam Bodman saying margin req.s are no big deal, while Fadil Gheit of Oppenheimer (THE expert on oil along with Dan Yergin, IMHO) and Chakib Khelil, president of the Organization of Petroleum Exporting Countries, say otherwise.

    I'll take Gheit, Khelil, Yergin and the CFTC over Sam Bodman anyday on this issue.
    Last edited: Jun 23, 2008
  6. shmessy

    shmessy Maude Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #75 Jersey


    Sam Bodman? George Bush? Dick Cheney? Larry Kudlow?
  7. otis p. driftwood

    otis p. driftwood Rookie

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    What's wrong with Kudlow?

    Besides the fact that I can't stand him, I mean...
  8. shmessy

    shmessy Maude Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #75 Jersey

    Definitely, a., you are on the ball on the subject - - and I've learned lots from your posts on this stuff - - much appreciated!

  9. shmessy

    shmessy Maude Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #75 Jersey


    Ummm, the "Goldilocks" economy comes to mind.

    He has been so wrong so often over the past two years running and is so in the bag to his oil company friends, that I LOVE to watch him on CNBC each day in the late afternoon.

    Why? Because I watch him while running on my elliptical machine - - it gives me GREAT workouts as I gnash my teeth and run harder. I keep setting Personal Bests!
    Last edited: Jun 23, 2008
  10. PatriotsReign

    PatriotsReign On the Roster

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    Investment advisor, CFP...same thing, at least to me. You had to pass a series of 10 exams or something like that, right?

    I have been saying for months (but not here) that oil prices shouldn't be controlled by speculators and should be regulated. Otherwise, the wealthy are controlling a commodity whose price affects the least wealthy the most.

    And it also allows people to profit greatly while our economy dies and inflation flourishes.
    Last edited: Jun 23, 2008
  11. BelichickFan

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    #24 Jersey

    Couldn't tell you - I watch enough CNBC that all the names get confusing to me. But I've seen enough to know there's no consensus on this.
  12. shmessy

    shmessy Maude Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #75 Jersey


    I'm not big on over-regulating anything. Obama is right, however, when he says to bring oil trading into the SAME margin requirement line with other trading.
  13. otis p. driftwood

    otis p. driftwood Rookie

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    LOL. I first started seeing him when he was on McClaughlin (I know I spelled that wrong) and I thought he was a moron then. And when I moved to an area I could get cable and started watching Kudlow and Cramer, now Kudlow and Bootlickers, holy crap.


    I've already admitted I'm not real strong as an economist, but that guy seems to know less than I do.
  14. PatriotsReign

    PatriotsReign On the Roster

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    Is there anything that is publically traded that is over-regulated?

    I agreed with you and still do.
  15. reflexblue

    reflexblue PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #91 Jersey

    "
    "And drilling isn't bad either."...Paul So which is it paul to drill or not to drill. At at around this time last week you were for drilling.then Sat. you weren't. You said we have to stop our addiction to oil.Now your back to drilling:confused: One would think you were reading the Jonny Mac book on flip flopping you waffle iron. :D
    Last edited: Jun 23, 2008
  16. otis p. driftwood

    otis p. driftwood Rookie

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    Can't you keep up? Alt energy isn't ready to step up and get us very far. We need a lot more investment and development. We should already be beyond the petroconomy, but we're not.
    I saw (and have read) some analysts who say that if the US was to make a concerted push--akin to the man to the moon--at alt. energy OPEC would collectively freak out and oil would be dirt cheap again.

    My idea is to drill the oil we know we've got here in this country--so there are two decades of oil in ANWAR--in another 25 years we should be well past needing petroleum for just about everything, so why not get our own and tell the OPEC $(*%*#(($** to #*$*%&#@ off?

    That's not flipping or flopping--that's been my position for years.
  17. Harry Boy

    Harry Boy Look Up, It's Amazing PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I am an expert and this is what I say:

    The drilling should have been done way back in the nineties, Billy Blue Dress vetoed it.

    What is the "Looney Democrats" obsession with Anwar is it a Democrat Holy Place, are they saving it for a "Loon Burial Ground" where they can lay Jimmy Carter and Dan Rather to rest, they showed Helicopter Views of it last night on Cable, it's a frozen wasteland, it looks like a frozen dump.

    I do agree with you though about drilling now, it's to late the batty democrats ruined all hope of us getting our own oil for this generation what we need now is "Nuclear Plants" and fast, don't listen to Prince Obama he'll say anything to get into the White House, Mccain is no better, they are scummy politicians, that Chicken In Every Pot crap is nothing but Political Bullsh!t.


    GOD DAMN AMERICA

    :bricks:
  18. shmessy

    shmessy Maude Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #75 Jersey

    Interesting, though:
    http://money.cnn.com/2008/06/23/news/economy/oil_drilling/index.htm?cnn=yes

    "Of the 90 million offshore acres the industry has leases to, it is estimated that upwards of 70 million are not producing oil, according to both Democrats and oil-industry sources.
    If all these areas were being drilled, U.S. oil production could be boosted by nearly 5 million barrels a day, up from about 8 million barrels a day currently.
    That compares to an increase of maybe 2 million barrels a day experts say opening up other coastal areas and the Alaska's Arctic National Wildlife Refuge might yield......"

    "Gheit hasn't seen the legislation proposed by Markey and others, but he thinks the government should revise the leasing process to encourage more drilling on existing areas before it puts more acres up for bid.
    "Government agencies should hold their feet to the fire," he said. And oil companies "should finish what's on their plate before they do back in line."
    _______________________


    Again, Fadil Gheit of Oppenheimer with the REAL solution, instead of the politicizing from both parties:

    1) No NEW areas for drilling (77% of the current areas legally available are NOT being drilled).

    2) Gov't SHOULD help encourage the oil companies to EXPAND their drilling on the lands on which they currently have leases (via tax credits, revised leasing policies and easier paperwork-bureaucracy for it, etc.).
    Last edited: Jun 23, 2008
  19. otis p. driftwood

    otis p. driftwood Rookie

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    It is, isn't it? I'd actually heard those figures for the first time on Friday or over the weekend and had forgotten, thanks for the reminder.

    And I would add this quote as well:

    Now why would they think prices may fall any time soon?
    Last edited: Jun 23, 2008
  20. Real World

    Real World Moderator Staff Member

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    Drilling has to be a part of the equation. If we drilled 8 years ago, guess what? We'd have more oil right now. Imagine if we did it 20 years ago. Imagine if we had a forward thinking energy plan at any point in the last 30 years. The people who think we shouldn't be drilling, or that it's not an option, are being naive.

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