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Not U.S.-born... just the U.S. president?!?!?

Discussion in 'Political Discussion' started by PatsFanInVa, Aug 12, 2008.

  1. PatsFanInVa

    PatsFanInVa PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    After all the wailing and keening I hear from the right wing about "thabiasedlibrulmedia," it's interesting the things we DON'T hear a peep about regarding John McCain.

    For example, I've been treated to speculation about whether Obama's American enough to be president, because he had vacations on Hawaii (where he has family,) or because his father is Kenyan. I hear the Fox-ites say his middle name a good couple dozen times per "news" hour... we worry about whether he is "safe" and whether a potato-pound is a "terrorist fist jab."

    How many of us know that McCain's middle name is Sidney (no, really, Sidney), that he flip-flopped from Episcopalian to Baptist, or that he was not born in the United States? Yah you got it right. He was born in the Panama Canal Zone -- leased land, not owned.

    This is how it appears in the NYT online - God only knows if it ever hit print. Squashed, I would imagine, by the right-wing media:

    http://www.nytimes.com/2008/02/28/us/politics/28mccain.html?_r=1&oref=slogin

    Pretty funny that I haven't seen this on Fox, MSNBC, the real networks, or of course, these pathetic blogs.

    Hey Lou Dobbsians, where's the outrage?!?!?!? How are you going to trust a guy born in Panama on immigration?

    Why does McCain hate Episcopalianism anyway?

    Since he spent most of his childhood anywhere but America (Navy kid,) how could he have any real connection with the American people?

    Why are the networks silent on these important questions? :rolleyes:

    Now: imagine that the networks were abuzz with this utter tripe.

    You would have their putatively "fawning" coverage of Obama.

    So I don't ever want to hear a wrong-winger whine ever again about thalibrulmedia or I'll freaking rip your spine out wrap it around your neck and strangle you with it figuratively of course because I'm a peace freak.

    Respeck*

    PFnV

    * any similarilty between this closing and the Ali G show is purely coincidental. Big up yourself.
     
    Last edited: Aug 12, 2008
  2. IcyPatriot

    IcyPatriot ------------- PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #87 Jersey

    That story has been around for a while.

    http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/23415028/

    from 1998 ... http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/politics/campaigns/junkie/archive/junkie070998.htm

    http://www.factcheck.org/askfactcheck/how_can_panamanian-born_mccain_be_elected_president.html
     
    Last edited: Aug 12, 2008
  3. PatsFanInVa

    PatsFanInVa PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Sounds like "it depends what the meaning of 'as' is". As in, "shall be considered as a natural born citizen," not "shall be considered a natural born citizen," or "is defined as a natural born citizen."

    But I understand what you're saying, he's just a reverse "anchor-baby." Just as you can come to the US, deliver a baby, and be a bouncing baby U.S. natural-born citizen, you can leave the country, have the baby elsewhere, and whereas he would have claim to call himself Panamanian if he so desired, he chose to call himself American.

    According to the Times story, however, the constitutional issue is not definitively settled by your website. I doubt there would be a constitutional challenge were he to be elected, but it would tickle me.

    But to the point; You cite an article from 1997, and we have this Times article from 2007... but where is the constant bleating coverage of these subjects like we see on Obama's middle name, "terrorist fist-jab," father's nationality/religion, etc.?

    What we have (assuming the courts agree, in McCain's case,) is two Americans... yet somehow we have leave to question the patriotism of the one born here rather than the one born abroad. We question the "American-ness" of a guy going to Hawaii where he has family, but not a guy spending his youth almost exclusively on military bases abroad.

    It's this loaded set of expectations that underpins damediuh. Because the right is so rabidly jingoistic, they "take their half," (i.e. the assumptions loaded in favor of the right,) and then whine and cry if there is insufficient bleating about one subject or another deleterious to Obama.

    Again, the subject here is really the myth of "thalibrulmediah", that old stalking horse of cryptofascists everywhere.

    It's old hat to you, you say, that McCain is foreign-born. I learned about this today -- I have seen stories day after day about Obama's religion, his middle name, his early upbringing, whether he attended a madrassah, blah blah blah. Why is this reserved for one candidate only? Answer: because there is a built in subjective bias to worship the military on the part of the media. Nothing more than rooting for the home team; they all do it.

    But it's deleterious to objective observation.

    PFnV
     
  4. PatsFanInVa

    PatsFanInVa PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Oh by the way, this from your support link:

     
  5. BelichickFan

    BelichickFan B.O. = Fugazi PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #24 Jersey

    Honestly, it takes a special kind of (fill in the blank) to consider someone not eligible to be President because he were born out of their country because his Dad was serving in the military overseas.

    Where's the throw up emoticon ???
     
  6. IcyPatriot

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    #87 Jersey

    Last edited: Aug 12, 2008
  7. PatsFanInVa

    PatsFanInVa PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Yeah everything is reducible to "because it was connected to the military."

    News flash: connection to the military does not change every law and every situation. Connection to the military does not immediately equal gold-plated and God-annointed.

    Do I thank guys in the services? Hell yes. Do you just say "because his dad was in the military" and make the issues raised go away? Hell no.

    Why are the media not abuzz with this crap? Why are we constantly seeing these frivolous stories on how "American" Obama is or is not?

    Why do the media focus on questions of race, questions of his father's nationality, questions of his religion... and then we're treated to the bleating of wrong-wingers who must repeat in unison "wahhhhh he gets positive coverage nobody asks the tough questions dalibrulmediah has a crush..."

    The media is not touching McCain's questionable aspects with a 10-foot pole. There is a question of the constitutionality of his run. They won't touch it. There is a question of his motives for becoming a baptist, if we use the yardstick of media coverage applied to Obama. There is the question of what they hell his parents were thinking when they called him Sidney -- to use the same yardstick.

    McCain was not born in the United States. I am not shocked by this fact. I am shocked that I only heard about this fact today, and I watch a lot of news, and read the paper every day... the LIBERAL paper, or so I hear.

    And I'm the only one who thinks he got a pass on this?

    Screw you, I'm voting for the guy from America!

    PFnV
     
  8. BelichickFan

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    #24 Jersey

    There is no issue. He was born there because his country told his father to be there. End of story. You're acting like McCain killed someone and is trying to get away with it because he Dad was in the military.

    You are some kind of wretched, partisan cretin.
     
  9. Real World

    Real World Moderator Staff Member

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    This issue already had it's day in the media, and the concensus is that McLame is legally eligible.
     
  10. IcyPatriot

    IcyPatriot ------------- PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #87 Jersey


    [​IMG]
     
  11. PatsFanInVa

    PatsFanInVa PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Actually, it didn't have its day in the media. It showed up on a couple of websites. I wonder if it will show up during the post-convention run, but I doubt it. Obama doesn't campaign like that, and the so-called "mainstream media" (i.e., the objective media) don't fixate quite so much as the Republican network on such minutiae.

    To repeat: the subject here is the free pass McCain gets as compared with Obama in the media.

    The secondary subject is the idiotic lockstep critique of the media as "liberal", when in point of fact, they are no such thing.

    It's out there, and it was raised most recently in February 2008. Yet there is no avalanche of psuedo-"coverage" about the subject.

    Belichick Fan, you're a twit. If it's an issue where a guy's dad is from, it's an issue where you were born. If it's an issue that your middle name is Hussein, it's an issue that your middle name is Sidney. If it's an issue that people think you might be Muslim but you're Christian, it's an issue that you for some reason rejected the Episcopalian church, didn't bother saying anything for a few years, and then surfaced as a Baptist.

    If I'm "The anti-Fox", I ask: Why did he reject the Episcopal church? Is McCain anti-Epsiscopal? Was it born of... political convenience?

    If I'm "The anti-Fox," I ask: Is he really eligible to be president, since he was not native-born? The whole question is whether he is "considered as native born" for the purposes of the presidency.

    All this points to the simple fact that the Republican network, and even the real networks, gobble up these sorts of scare questions about Obama, without a second thought to parallel issues surrounding McCain.

    Regardless of the website proffered, I do not recall the Supreme Court ruling on the subject in McCain's case, or in the case of any other foreign-born candidate.

    The subject is not closed unless the court challenge is raised and ruled on.

    Me? I'm just sick of the jingoistic, one-sided, right-wing media.

    PFnV
     
    Last edited: Aug 12, 2008
  12. BelichickFan

    BelichickFan B.O. = Fugazi PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #24 Jersey

    And you're a partisan hack who can't see past his hatred for McCain and Republicans - just like Patters.
     
  13. IcyPatriot

    IcyPatriot ------------- PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #87 Jersey

    I thought liberals were supposed to be the compassionate ones?
     
  14. patsfan13

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    From wiki:



    Both McCain's parents were US citizens.


    Since you are concerned about the subject of US citizenship and eligibility for the presidency, I would draw your attention to the forged certificate of birth for BO.

    I wonder why he doesn't present an actual birth certificate.

    numerous articles on the forerged document. His father wasn't a citizen, his mom may not have been for the purpose of constitutional requirements for the presidency (due to the amount she spent outside the country).

    http://web.israelinsider.com/bin/en...tTopics&enInfolet=ViewTopic.jsp&topicId=473
     
  15. BelichickFan

    BelichickFan B.O. = Fugazi PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #24 Jersey

    These ultra partisans change their position based on the candidate. Patters is still unsure whether to support infidelity or not based on Edwards and McCain.
     
  16. DarrylS

    DarrylS PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Israeli insider??? Is that the best you can do, sounds piss poor as a reliable source.. nothing on Worldnet, Newsmax or LGF???
     
  17. Harry Boy

    Harry Boy Look Up, It's Amazing PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Thank you, from now on I will refer to him as "John Sidney Mccain".

    George Walker Bush
    John Sidney Mccain
    Nancy Skank Pelosi
    Harry Weasle Reid
    John Fonda Kerry
    Albert Boob Gore
    Barack Hussein Obama

    :bricks:
     
  18. PatsFanInEaglesLand

    PatsFanInEaglesLand In the Starting Line-Up

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    #37 Jersey

    Suit yourself.......................
     
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2008
  19. patsfan13

    patsfan13 Hall of Fame Poster PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Youdidn't think Olbermann was going to investigate the story did you? I mean it was little green footballs and free republic who uncovered the dan rather cbs forgeries, not the MSM, and who uncovered the Edwards mess not the MSM.
     
  20. STFarmy

    STFarmy In the Starting Line-Up

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    PFinVA, are you talking about the legality of McCain being president, or just the abstract "not connected enough to America"? If you're questioning the latter, fine. But legally he can be president. It was covered all those months ago in the NYT (it was printed, not just on their website), but it disappeared quickly. It did so not because the media is giving McCain a free pass, but because it was so quickly decided by many that he could legally be president that it seemed silly to continue to harp on it.

    I personally think that the amount of leeway the candidate is given depends on the media source. NBC is definitely in the tank for Obama, and Fox will obviously be more harsh on Obama than they will on McCain. The bias thing is annoying but people should try to counter that by reading as many sources as possible.
     

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