Not to beat a dead animal, but

[ColtsTroll]

I know the board is full of all the crap about the camera issue. Personally, I will wait until comment comes from ANYONE that is actually INVOLVED.
Since ESPN INCORRECTLY reported that the league found the Pats guilty (incorrect because the league has said no decision has been reached and ESPNs report was false) there are 100s of stories drawing conclusions based upon that incorrect fact. The media and internet housewives have added dozens of layers of speculation on top of reality, and reached a conclusion from that.

I have a question though, that I have not seen anwered.
From what I have read, I'm seeing it implied that Mangini knew of the possiblity this would happen, and alerted stadium and NFL security. It would follow that this alert was BEFORE the game. Security responded by confiscating the camera. WHEN did this occur?
If this is going to be called cheating and have Pat-haters imply that it influenced the game, wouldn't it be important to know how long the cameraman was taping?

Doesn't matter when it was confiscated. Just assume that the patriots did not benefit from that day's taping as it's virtually impossible being that it was confiscated.

The point is moot though because the issue at hand isn't that the Pats beat the Jets by cheating (sorry Jets fans, you guys lost on your own), the issue is that the Patriots cheat. Period. Using recording equipment is illegal. They knew it, they've been warned about it, they did it anyway.

It's not only insulting to Goodell and the rest of the league, it's actually just plain stupid. Only Belichick's hubris could blind him from making such an obviously horrible decision.

 

[DaBruinz]

Doesn't matter when it was confiscated. Just assume that the patriots did not benefit from that day's taping as it's virtually impossible being that it was confiscated.

The point is moot though because the issue at hand isn't that the Pats beat the Jets by cheating (sorry Jets fans, you guys lost on your own), the issue is that the Patriots cheat. Period. Using recording equipment is illegal. They knew it, they've been warned about it, they did it anyway.

It's not only insulting to Goodell and the rest of the league, it's actually just plain stupid. Only Belichick's hubris could blind him from making such an obviously horrible decision.

Sorry, but it is NOT ILLEGAL to use video recording equipment. However, there are rules that were just instituted THIS YEAR regarding not using video recording equipment. And they broke the rules. They didn't break a law.

As has been told umpteen times, the entire LEAGUE was warned about it, yet there are coaches who have come out and said the Pats did nothing wrong because everyone is doing it.

And, it is only cheating if the Patriots used it during the game, which, as has been attested to, is nearly impossible since there is no video playing equipment allowed in the locker-rooms.

 

[ColtsTroll]

Sorry, but it is NOT ILLEGAL to use video recording equipment. However, there are rules that were just instituted THIS YEAR regarding not using video recording equipment. And they broke the rules. They didn't break a law.

As has been told umpteen times, the entire LEAGUE was warned about it, yet there are coaches who have come out and said the Pats did nothing wrong because everyone is doing it.

And, it is only cheating if the Patriots used it during the game, which, as has been attested to, is nearly impossible since there is no video playing equipment allowed in the locker-rooms.

Alright, I ignored your comments on another thread because they were just too ridiculous to reply to but these actually sound like you believe them so let me just set you straight.

They broke the rules but not the law? I'm going to let you think about that one and work it out on your own.

And it isn't cheating only if they used the tape during the game, it's cheating if they used the tape period. And you have to assume that they were either a) planning on using the tape in the 2nd half but didn't get the chance cause they were caught or b) planning on using the tape for future meetings.

Either way, it is cheating. If they weren't going to benefit from doing it, why would they do it in the first place? Why blatantly break the rules if you aren't going to benefit from it? Think McFly, think!

 

[Metaphors]

Either way, it is cheating. If they weren't going to benefit from doing it, why would they do it in the first place? Why blatantly break the rules if you aren't going to benefit from it? Think McFly, think!

Riddle me this, Batman. Cameras are not allowed on the field (except broadcast guys obviously). Yet somehow this guy got on the field with a camera and filmed for 8+ minutes. Why didn't security stop him from ever taking 1 second of film? Is he a ninja capable of blending into the environment, yet reappearing when the Jet's defensive coaches are waiving their hands? Was his camera one of those James Bond special cameras that can be hidden in a belt buckle?

Well then how did the Jets and NFL security miss this guy for so long?

How about this. It isn't unusual for a team guy to have a camera on the sidelines. It took the Jets complaining about it to get NFL security to act. Why didn't the Jets get the guy booted immediately? No evidence to screw the Pats with. Give him enough time to get stuff on tape (but not enough to do anything remotely useful with it) and then get him.

I don't know what the guy was doing with the camera and neither does anyone else. Was he getting Jets defensive signals (among other things)? Seems logical. Also seems logical that the Jets played this out to bait and hammer the Pats...not to protect themselves from an unfair advantage. To suggest that NOBODY noticed this guy until the camera was seized is just stupid.

 

[Ring 6]

Alright, I ignored your comments on another thread because they were just too ridiculous to reply to but these actually sound like you believe them so let me just set you straight.

They broke the rules but not the law? I'm going to let you think about that one and work it out on your own.

And it isn't cheating only if they used the tape during the game, it's cheating if they used the tape period. And you have to assume that they were either a) planning on using the tape in the 2nd half but didn't get the chance cause they were caught or b) planning on using the tape for future meetings.

Either way, it is cheating. If they weren't going to benefit from doing it, why would they do it in the first place? Why blatantly break the rules if you aren't going to benefit from it? Think McFly, think!

When did you view the tape? You seem very certain of what is on it, and what the purpose of that cameraman being on the field was.
I guess since you are so certain, you must have seen what he taped.

The ONLY information about WHY he was there and WHAT HE WAS DOING is hearsay from the media. Given that the 'breaking story' from the media that Goddell found the Pats guilty was fabricated, why is there a firestorm over what HYPOTHETICALLY was taped?

 

[mgteich]

My newest nominee for the post of the week! The information could affect the NEXT play if the patriots wanted to use it in that way. Of couse, we are still talking about method, but a video camera with a live feed is much, much better than a set of binoculars.

That's actually not true. They could run the live feed from the camera straight to the coaches booth and the Pats could make adjustment play to play by seeing the Jets defensive signal, then speaking to Tom Brady over the headset to audible at the line based on the signal.

 

[mgteich]

The league cares more about breaking its rules that players breaking laws. Should they care more about laws? are they the police?

Sorry, but it is NOT ILLEGAL to use video recording equipment. However, there are rules that were just instituted THIS YEAR regarding not using video recording equipment. And they broke the rules. They didn't break a law.

As has been told umpteen times, the entire LEAGUE was warned about it, yet there are coaches who have come out and said the Pats did nothing wrong because everyone is doing it.

And, it is only cheating if the Patriots used it during the game, which, as has been attested to, is nearly impossible since there is no video playing equipment allowed in the locker-rooms.

 

[ColtsTroll]

When did you view the tape? You seem very certain of what is on it, and what the purpose of that cameraman being on the field was.
I guess since you are so certain, you must have seen what he taped.

The ONLY information about WHY he was there and WHAT HE WAS DOING is hearsay from the media. Given that the 'breaking story' from the media that Goddell found the Pats guilty was fabricated, why is there a firestorm over what HYPOTHETICALLY was taped?

No, I use common sense and simple reasoning.

But if you need to wait until tomorrow to read what Goodell found on the tape, then I'll let you be. Denial is a very understimated state of mind.

 

[DaBruinz]

Alright, I ignored your comments on another thread because they were just too ridiculous to reply to but these actually sound like you believe them so let me just set you straight.

My comments aren't ridiculous. My comments are perfectly logical if you stop showing your Pats hating bias for a change, performed a cranial rectal inversion on yourself and actually learned some reading comprehension.

OH, and you didn't ignore my comments. YOU did reply.

They broke the rules but not the law? I'm going to let you think about that one and work it out on your own.

There is nothing for me to work out there. You called it ILLEGAL. Illegal implies that there are laws against it. The only law there is out there is that you have to give your consent to have your likeness taken via video or photograph.

They are on a public stage with their pictures being broadcast. Their consent is implicitly given.

Let me give you another example that should tax your pea brain too much. You get upset with you Shift Supervisor while you are working the microwave at McDonald's. You tell him to F**K OFF. You get fired because you swore at your boss. You don't get arrested because you swore at the boss. Swearing at the boss is not cheating.

What the Pats did, while it may have been wrong, it wasn't cheating. And that is what you don't understand.

And it isn't cheating only if they used the tape during the game, it's cheating if they used the tape period. And you have to assume that they were either a) planning on using the tape in the 2nd half but didn't get the chance cause they were caught or b) planning on using the tape for future meetings.

NO, its not. And the league said it wasn't cheating by not punishing the Phins last year. Videos are used ALL THE TIME for future plannings and meetings.

Also, since you are too stupid to realize this, there is not video playing equipment allowed in the locker-rooms. Or in the coaches booths. So how the hell could they use it in the 2nd half? Answer? They can't. Also, the amount of time they have (about 12 minutes) doesn't allow them enough time to tie the tape in with the plays, break them down and get that information back on the field in a timely fashion.

Either way, it is cheating. If they weren't going to benefit from doing it, why would they do it in the first place? Why blatantly break the rules if you aren't going to benefit from it? Think McFly, think!

You're wrong. Having the tape for future reference is NOT cheating. They were taping things for future reference for other planning sessions. They are allowed to do that. And it wasn't blatantly breaking the rules. Hell, it hasn't even been said if there was anything on the tape.

So, instead of telling others to THINK, you should follow your own advice because its clear that the concept isn't a strong suit of yours.

 

[DaBruinz]

No, I use common sense and simple reasoning.

But if you need to wait until tomorrow to read what Goodell found on the tape, then I'll let you be. Denial is a very understimated state of mind.

*ROFLMAO* No you don't. You wouldn't know what common sense was if it came up and bit you in the arse.

 

[ColtsTroll]

My comments aren't ridiculous. My comments are perfectly logical if you stop showing your Pats hating bias for a change, performed a cranial rectal inversion on yourself and actually learned some reading comprehension.

OH, and you didn't ignore my comments. YOU did reply.



There is nothing for me to work out there. You called it ILLEGAL. Illegal implies that there are laws against it. The only law there is out there is that you have to give your consent to have your likeness taken via video or photograph.

They are on a public stage with their pictures being broadcast. Their consent is implicitly given.

Let me give you another example that should tax your pea brain too much. You get upset with you Shift Supervisor while you are working the microwave at McDonald's. You tell him to F**K OFF. You get fired because you swore at your boss. You don't get arrested because you swore at the boss. Swearing at the boss is not cheating.

What the Pats did, while it may have been wrong, it wasn't cheating. And that is what you don't understand.



NO, its not. And the league said it wasn't cheating by not punishing the Phins last year. Videos are used ALL THE TIME for future plannings and meetings.

Also, since you are too stupid to realize this, there is not video playing equipment allowed in the locker-rooms. Or in the coaches booths. So how the hell could they use it in the 2nd half? Answer? They can't. Also, the amount of time they have (about 12 minutes) doesn't allow them enough time to tie the tape in with the plays, break them down and get that information back on the field in a timely fashion.



You're wrong. Having the tape for future reference is NOT cheating. They were taping things for future reference for other planning sessions. They are allowed to do that. And it wasn't blatantly breaking the rules. Hell, it hasn't even been said if there was anything on the tape.

So, instead of telling others to THINK, you should follow your own advice because its clear that the concept isn't a strong suit of yours.

If you want to dwell on the semantics of illegality versus cheating, go right ahead. Bellichick will not go to jail over this, you're right, he did not break the law. You happy?

Now live w/ the fact your team is coached by a bitter, cheater who is dumb enough to risk his hall-of-fame entry while ruining the reputation of a once proud and storied franchise.

And just so you know--since you apparently havn't been following the news--placing a guy on the sidelines w/ electronic equipment is strictly forbidden by the league. In some silly circles this is considered cheating. Who knew, right?

 

[Ring 6]

No, I use common sense and simple reasoning.

But if you need to wait until tomorrow to read what Goodell found on the tape, then I'll let you be. Denial is a very understimated state of mind.

Further underestimated is jumping to conclusion based on NO EVIDENCE.
Everything you know about this is what the media has told you, and no one involved has spoken to the media.

Denial is ignoring fact. There is no fact here.
Delussion is pretending someone with no knowledge of the situation is speaking fact.

 

[vyrago]

The NFL has done a terrible job at controlling this story. Just terrible. If they say that the Patriots cheated, that puts a stigma on the entire league for the last 6 years. There is now way the NFL can allow that to be believed.

But with the current media frenzy, if they just say that BB broke the rules, but they did not effect the outcome of any games, will the media dogs be happy?

The NFL should have come in early and stated the facts so this did not become a sideshow. This commissioner is becoming a joke.

I couldn't agree more. That the NFL is allowing this to get out of hand seems to suggest either an incompetent commissioner or an agenda/vendetta.

 

[maverick4]

Indeed, now it is time to find out just how involved Mangini as in this whole mess.

Did he tip them off before the game? I've heard he blabbered as soon as he got to the Jets last year. Also, how did this news first get leaked and reported on Jets Insider?