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  1. patfanken

    patfanken Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

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    ....after watching most of the NFLN Replay of the game I have the following observations....so bear with me. :D

    1. Well folks there really IS a blueprint to beat the Pats offense, and I'm a little embarassed that I didn't think of it before hand. BTW its not anything new, in fact we should be very familiar with it, because we USED IT in 2003 to stop the Colts. (only we were better at it).

    Simply put, you hold and grab in tight man coverage underneath and then keep 2 deep safeties over the top to make sure that you don't get beat deep. You tell your guys to get physical with the receivers, grab if you have to. Do it EVERY play and DARE the officials to call it.

    Ultimately after watching the Ravens VIOLATE the Pats WRs for most of 4 quarters, they finally called a few at the end of the game. Frankly I think it was a brilliant strategy and it ALMOST worked.

    2 Unlike a lot of fans, I have no problem with opponents fans being upset when contraversial calls go against them. However in this game there were NO CONTRAVERSIAL CALLS! I don't see how a good football fan could possibly have a problem with the key flag on the Ravens. It was a text book case for THREE penalties, Holding, Illegal contact, and PI. Not only did Ivy make contact down the field, he was grabbing him the whole way. PLUS the fact Ed Reed hit Watson WELL before the ball got there.

    3. What I REALLY have a problem with, and I've had this problem ALL SEASON, is how the national media presents the Patriots and what happens in the games. What I don't see is, WHY or HOW these media pukes can watch that play over and over again and then call it CONTRAVERSIAL. There was NOTHING contraversial about that play.....NOTHING, Yet they leave you thinking that it was like the Samuel, Hobbs, or Moss Phantom calls that we've seen go against us. UNREAL :mad:

    4. The same goes for the Raven's fans and other assorted haters. How they can ***** when EVERYONE of those defensive calls were UNDENIABLY correct, with a straight face. The same goes for those players. I heard Rolle (I think) say in a post game interview that the flag wasn't thrown until AFTER the ball hit the ground, when CLEARLY it was throw WELL before Brady even threw the ball. These guys have no sense of reality down there.

    5. Speaking of the behavior of the Ravens players, is it ANY wonder why, with one of the most talent laden teams in the NFL they haven't even had a SNIFF at a superbowl since 2000. Clearly they are HORRIBLY put together, have ZERO discipline, no class, and all of them play to the INDIVIDUAL spotlight. They are a true reflection of their HC, and they have paid the price for it for this entire DECADE. Their window has officially CLOSED!

    6. I have several rules I would love to have change. I'd like to eliminate the rule that says the ground can't cause a fumble. To that I ask, "WHY NOT". Not only would it eliminate a lot of loose ball handling, it would take another judgment call away from the officials, along with thos mind numbing replays.
    I'd like to see the clock stopped until the sticks are set after a first down in the last 5 minutes of each half, among others.

    However I will add a new one to the top of my list. I would like to see the play continue after a false start, illegal motion or procedure. Way too often it is the DEFENSE that ends up being penalized, just like the Ravens did last night. I say throw the flag, but let the play continue, AND THEN let the defense decide what they want to do, JUST like it is done when the defense goes offside and there is a free play for the offense.

    What do you think?

    7. Sorry guys, but I think the refs DID blow the call on Jabbar's TD catch. It was a wonderful effort, but I don't think he had control of the ball going out of the endzone. I understand why they COULD call it a catch. I understand why there wasn't enough visual evidence to over turn it. However using the old eyeball test, I didn't think it was a catch.

    That being said, what goes unnoticed is that there was a flag on that play for holding and I doubt if the call was overturned it would have changed the final outcome of the game. First and goal from the 4, and I take my chances with plenty of TOs and time for at LEAST 4 more plays.

    8. I saw a picture of Richard Seymour on my milk carton this morning. I think its time to start wondering if we are EVER going to see Seymour at a probowl level again. Can anyone remember the LAST TIME we say Richard play a dominant game? It wasn't in 2006 I can tell you that. Could it be that injuries have started to take a toll on his effectiveness??

    9. it is hard to criticize an offense that plays its WORST game of the year and STILL manages to put up 27 points. However I think we will NEVER see Laurence Moroney reach his potential until we see him get 10-15 snaps with Brady under C and Moroney behind him. Almost EVERY running play he gets is a slow developing play. He is a fast back. We have an athletic OL. Why is it that the sweep has been blackballed?

    I think its telling that Moroney's best play came on that PAP, when he WAS lined up behind Brady, and a threat to run. With teams going to a tough man to man underneath, throwing to Moroney out of the backfield while a number of DBs are engaged with WRs can be VERY effective....as we all saw.

    Please get this memo to Josh.

    10. Myth of the night: Brady was sacked 3 time last night, and the media made a big deal out of every one. Just like the Philly game where the reality was that Brady was hit ONLY 5 times in over 50 throws. The same goes for This game. True Brady was under pressure on Monday, but I GUARANTEE that there is NO QB in the league who would have LOVED to be under that same pressure week in and week out. It went almost WITHOUT notice that Boller was being hit almost EVERY pass play. So the myth comes out that the Pats had trouble protecting Brady, and their defense couldn't pressure Boller.

    BTW- Boller can add his name to those mediocre QBs who had a career day against the Pats....except for one play. ;)

    11. Myth II - This is one that been purpetrated all season. the Myth is that he Pats are suddenly made up of morre superstars that have ever been put together in the NFL. How quickly everyone seemed to forget that his is the same team that had exactly ONE position player elected to a probowl the last 3 years. Yes, Moss is a true Superstar, and Thomas made it to one probowl as a position player, but they are the only ones who are superior talents. The rest of the team, as usual is made up of a LOT of very good players, who are better as a team than they are as individuals.

    There are still a number of teams in the NFL who have the same if not BETTER talent as the Pats. DON'T lose sight of the fact that what makes THIS team 12-0 is. HOW THAT TEAM IS PUT TOGETHER, and how they PLAY TOGETHER. Still after 7 years, this team is STILL greater than the sum of its parts. AND if you want to see what the opposite of that looks like, you just had a chance on Monday, when the Pats won a game against a team that is LESS than the sum of its parts.
     
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    Last edited: Dec 5, 2007
  2. fnordcircle

    fnordcircle ( o Y o ) PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Re: Not of nothing but....

    With all this complaining about holding by DBs on our awesome receiving corps I guess it's official that the Patriots are now the 2003/2004 Colts.
     
  3. Canada's #1 Pats Fan

    Canada's #1 Pats Fan Rotational Player and Threatening Starter's Job

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    Re: Not of nothing but....

    Excellent post. A tonne of thought went into it and it was a good read.
     
  4. Joker

    Joker PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Re: Not of nothing but....

    how can we be? Did B.B. move to change rules with his authoritative position on the competition committee?...oh that's right...the Patriots are the OBJECT of all the rules changes...
     
  5. He Ban Me

    He Ban Me Banned

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    Re: Not of nothing but....

    Some good thoughts, nice post.
     
    Last edited: Dec 5, 2007
  6. JR4

    JR4 In the Starting Line-up PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Re: Not of nothing but....

    "
    7. Sorry guys, but I think the refs DID blow the call on Jabbar's TD catch. It was a wonderful effort, but I don't think he had control of the ball going out of the endzone. I understand why they COULD call it a catch. I understand why there wasn't enough visual evidence to over turn it. However using the old eyeball test, I didn't think it was a catch."

    which eyeball were you using ... try the other one :)

    did he not have both hands on the ball when his first step of two
    steps was inbounds.
    was he in the process of tucking it away?
    to make such a move ... don't you need to control the ball....
    .. I mean if the ball is heading to under his arm pit and his left hand
    is directing it there... doesn't that mean he is controlling the ball?
    Also there is no clear shot of his right hand during the process of
    tucking it.
    I would also like to have seen what the refs saw under the hood.
    Did you? :confused:
     
  7. Hollywood_Brady

    Hollywood_Brady On the Game Day Roster

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    Re: Not of nothing but....

    9. based on maroney's play lately... i think he is turning out to be a 3rd down back ala kevin faulk... he doesnt have the toughness to shed tackles and doesnt have the patience/instinct running through holes...that is why i think he is taking less snaps... but he is very good in space, he bailed brady out catching passes and came up with big plays.... to me,if he doesnt turn out to be the RB we want him tobe, at least he looked good as a 3rd down back maybe a better 3rd down back than faulk in the future...

    11. i agree with you... after 2 major signings (moss, thomas) then suddenly everybody is considering us one of the most talented team... patriots 2006 are like wallflowers(exaggeration) and suddenly patriots2007 are primetimeboys...
    i think its about exposure, we had a great offseason and the randy moss trade took us to the moon (when it comes to media attention)... now the everybody cant get enough of the pats... every pass, tackle, sack, int is amplified 10x over... but actually its the same patriots with just different receivers...
     
  8. Disco Volante

    Disco Volante Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

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    Re: Not of nothing but....

    The same Patriots with just Randy Moss, Wes Welker and Donte Stallworth.
     
  9. psychoPat

    psychoPat Role Player PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Re: Not of nothing but....

    If you have an agenda, you must exert steely self-control to be sure that
    you do not let facts overtake your agenda.

    Once you've got that down ... you can lead the sheep wherever you wish.
    The sheep are
    all people who let others do their thinking for them ...
    who adopt the most recent interpretation of events they have heard
    ... or who care principally about remaining in step with whomever they view as their peers or models.



    Until this past week the Ravens have been largely a mystery to me.
    Now ... having focused on their antics ... i hold them in the same contempt you do
    and for the same reasons.






    Respectfully suggest you squirt some Windex on your tv screen and contact lenses.
    None of the half-dozen replays i've viewed seem to be anything less than
    a marvelously athletic catch.




    8. I saw a picture of Richard Seymour on my milk carton this morning. I think its time to start wondering if we are EVER going to see Seymour at a probowl level again. Can anyone remember the LAST TIME we say Richard play a dominant game? It wasn't in 2006 I can tell you that. Could it be that injuries have started to take a toll on his effectiveness??


    Alas, #93 seems to be in process of becoming the poster child for
    Satisfaction Stagnation.
    I imagine it'll be a while before the Piolichick f/o succumbs to histrionics like Richard's again.

    I.e, ... no blowout contract for Asante.





    I delivered it personally. He sends Thanx.

    But ... after the Steelers game, where this may come into play again ...
    don't count on seeing the Maroney DumpOff trump card again
    until the playoffs.





    Shhh !
    Leave them in their ignorance, f'r petesake.




    Very sage insight!
     
  10. ClevTrev

    ClevTrev Rotational Player and Threatening Starter's Job

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    Re: Not of nothing but....

    Agree with the Gaffney observation. I was concerned, as I saw the ball move away from his hands as he stepped out of bounds. Look at it this way, had the ref called it incomplete, there would not have been indisputable evidence to the contrary to change it to complete after the review. Because the replay showed only a partial image of the ball, it was not disputable. That's the situation, and the judgment by the ref on the field was going to be the final word, complete or incomplete. So be it, as it's good to be fortunate for a change.

    As usual, good post by PFK.
     
    Last edited: Dec 5, 2007
  11. ATippett56

    ATippett56 Pro Bowl Player

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    Re: Not of nothing but....

    Are you sure that Richard Seymour's injuries over time have not taken its toll? As for Asante, that all depends on the contract situation for Randy Moss in 2008.
     
  12. ATippett56

    ATippett56 Pro Bowl Player

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    Re: Not of nothing but....

    Sorry but the facts that otherwise.

    http://www.coldhardfootballfacts.com/Articles/11_1902_Patriots_27,_Ravens_24:_What_we_learned.html

    4. New England's offensive line showed again that it struggles against top defensive fronts. As we pointed out last week, the Patriots have faced some of the worst Defensive Hogs in the business this season. But against Philly, Dallas and now Baltimore (all in the top 10 on our Index when they played the Patriots, with Baltimore No. 1), New England allowed 10 of their 21 Negative Pass Plays on the season (sack or INT) and ran for 213 yards on 69 carries (3.1 YPA).

    http://www.coldhardfootballfacts.com/Article.php?Page=1135
     
  13. upstater1

    upstater1 Pro Bowl Player

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    Re: Not of nothing but....

    #6. Early movement on the line. Ref throws a flag. The offense scores a TD to go ahead late in the game. The ref is about to call false start when, all of a sudden, the head ump suggests that he saw the defender feign to draw him into the neutral zone with slight movement. The refs confer after awhile, will they effectively take the winning points away?

    This is the exact scenario the NFL dreads. We always see refs discussing who moved first. If such sometimes arbitrary discussions can take points off the board, that's a nightmare for refs. Plus, it can potentially give a huge advantage to domed teams such as the Colts.
     
  14. ALP

    ALP Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal

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    Re: Not of nothing but....

    people complain about the holding call? are u kidin me? go to the nfl recap, go to 8:10, and then watch it, over and over and over again, if thats NOT holding wut is?
     
  15. Deus Irae

    Deus Irae PatsFans.com Retired Jersey Club PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Re: Not of nothing but....


    Once again, you ignore the rule change in order to attempt to make a equation that's been invalid. It's the little detail that makes all the difference in the world.
     
  16. He Ban Me

    He Ban Me Banned

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    Re: Not of nothing but....

    No rule change. In the books at the time. Point of emphasis. Case closed. No more response about this topic. Move along. Nothing to see here.
     
  17. shmessy

    shmessy Maude Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Re: Not of nothing but....

    Amen. I saw Matt Light look like he was out of his league the past two weeks. Multiple breakdowns in his play BOTH ways: being overpowered AND outquickened.

    What really is troubling is the 4th and 1 QB sneak that got stuffed (but saved by Rex Ryan's blooper TO). Watch it. Replay it several times.

    Remember that play, to that point, was THE most important play of the season.......and Matt Light got blown up. The DE almost pancake blocked HIM.

    Combine that with the inexcusable early movement flags he got against the Eagles (that "noisy Gillette stadium crowd must've drowned out Brady's calls") and one has to wonder if he is at the top of his game at this point.
     
  18. shmessy

    shmessy Maude Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Re: Not of nothing but....


    Yessir, Mr. Polian.
     
  19. PonyExpress

    PonyExpress In the Starting Line-Up

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    I agree that the Seymour is playing like a JAG. Since the bye week, Seymour has 0 sacks, 0 passes defensed, 6 tackles, and .5 tackle for loss. He has not been an impact player, and that is what he's supposed to be. Right now he is the 4th best D-lineman on this team, and has been for some time.

    Sorting Maroney's snaps: When Maroney is in the game, prior to the Raven game, the offense telegraphs "run". He said as much, that he is the "running back" and Faulk is the "passing back". Why not get Maroney more involved in the passing game, when he has repeatedly shown a talent for explosive receptions? He did it with limited opportunities vs. Denver, Chicago, Green Bay, Minnesota, Washington, and Baltimore.

    One possible way to take advantage of the attention paid to Welker and Moss, is send Moss deep, run Welker on a slant toward Moss' side of the field, and hit Maroney on the opposite side in the flat with a swing pass. You will destroy teams all day long that way. Faulk is a nice player but Maroney is a gamebreaker.
     
  20. cstjohn17

    cstjohn17 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Re-watching the game I don't have a diatribe but some observations.

    1) The run defense looked worse the second time around. D Line pushed off the ball, big on the edge, poor LB tackling, etc., etc. At first I thought well it is because McGahee is an excellent back, but then Musa Smith ripped off some good runs. Obvious area of emphasis going forward.
    2) Faulk played a great game, he is a really instinctive shifty runner. He had a drop and then for some reason ran out of bounds before picking up the first down on the final drive but overall he was the offensive spark plug.
    3) The offense really didn't play up to their potential, 10 real possessions, 5 punts and and four 3 and outs. On the plus side they did get 27 points in a hostile environment, in bad weather and are very very skilled.
    4) Ravens play calling in the fourth quarter was questionable.
    5) Said it before but Ngata is an absolute beast.
     
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