Welcome to PatsFans.com

No point of RETURN????

Discussion in 'Political Discussion' started by NEPatriot, Nov 12, 2008.

  1. NEPatriot

    NEPatriot Banned

    Joined:
    Dec 14, 2004
    Messages:
    7,836
    Likes Received:
    11
    Ratings:
    +11 / 0 / -0

    I can't believe what I see in this country. It's unbelievable. It really SICKS.

    GlennSacks.com Blog Archive On Courts Ordering Boys to Pay Child Support to Women Who Statutorily Raped Them (Part III)

     
  2. PatriotsReign

    PatriotsReign Hall of Fame Poster

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2007
    Messages:
    27,314
    Likes Received:
    197
    Ratings:
    +559 / 6 / -24

    #18 Jersey

    There should be a massive negative reaction to this decision. We should all write to Michigan representatives to express our outrage. but I'm not really referring to Patsfans members but all US citizens.

    Hopefully this will go one more step to the Supreme court.

    When you think about it, there is no parallel when a young girl is statutorily raped by an older man. So this is precedent setting.

    Maybe we can get a lawyer member to comment. but I too find this beyond unacceptable.
     
  3. TheGodInAGreyHoodie

    TheGodInAGreyHoodie Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2007
    Messages:
    6,621
    Likes Received:
    25
    Ratings:
    +26 / 0 / -0

    Not sure what that would do. State reps are not really responsible or responsive to people who live outside their districts.

    Next step would be the Michigan Supreme court. I am not sure on what basis this could wind up in the US S. Ct.

    While I abhor the result. Without reading the decision I can understand why this decision was reached.

    The fundamental principle of family law is the "Best Interest of the Child." The principle is as simple as its name. We don't worry about which parent was right or what parent was wrong. How the child was conceived. Which parents infidelity led to the break up of the marriage. If the mother lied to the father that she was taking the pill. Or who raped who.

    Is it in the best interest of the child to receive support from both his biological mother and father? The answer is yes. So the child receives support.

    While I hate the outcome of the instance case, I hope it doesn't get overturned. Chipping away at BIC would be bad precedent.
     
    Last edited: Nov 12, 2008
  4. PatriotsReign

    PatriotsReign Hall of Fame Poster

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2007
    Messages:
    27,314
    Likes Received:
    197
    Ratings:
    +559 / 6 / -24

    #18 Jersey

    Don't mind the fact that I'm about to go off. It has nothing to do with you, but how men get the short end of the stick all the time in such cases.

    You said "Best interest of the Child" Well, the kid who was RAPED was a CHILD whent he kid was conceived. His best interests should take precedent over the child born to his rapist. Since he is a VICTIM and a CHILD, he bears NO responsibility what so ever for the consequences. 100% of the responsibility is born by the rapist, in this case, the mother.

    This decision is like saying that a man who statutorily rapes a young girl deserves visitation rights if a child is conceived as a result. Of course such a man would then bear child support responsibility.

    The bottom line is that the kid who was raped should now sue the woman who raped him in civil court for the exact value of the money he has been ordered to pay.

    There is NO moral reason why this man owes one cent to the woman who raped him. That is a stupid decision ignorat of the facts that brought the child into this world.
     
    Last edited: Nov 12, 2008
  5. TheGodInAGreyHoodie

    TheGodInAGreyHoodie Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2007
    Messages:
    6,621
    Likes Received:
    25
    Ratings:
    +26 / 0 / -0

    I don't disagree. The man got the short end of the stick.

    Not exactly. The man would certainly owe child support. But he phrase "visitation rights" is some what a poor term. The issue in the example you give is not if the father would "deserve" them or not. The question would be "is it in the best interest of the child to have a relationship with his/her father?" Under most circumstances the answer to that question will be no.

    But I could imagine situations where the answer would be yes. The issue would not be does the "victim" mom want the father to see the child. The issue would be is it in the best interest of the child for the child to have a relationship with the father.

    I would not be surprised if his atty tries that.

    The man does not owe one cent to the women who raped him. He owes money to the child. Child support is owed to the child not the parent.
     
  6. PatriotsReign

    PatriotsReign Hall of Fame Poster

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2007
    Messages:
    27,314
    Likes Received:
    197
    Ratings:
    +559 / 6 / -24

    #18 Jersey

    Ok, there is no moral reason for the rape victim to owe child support to the child of his rapist.
     
  7. NEPatriot

    NEPatriot Banned

    Joined:
    Dec 14, 2004
    Messages:
    7,836
    Likes Received:
    11
    Ratings:
    +11 / 0 / -0

    why did she not go to prison for raping a child? Why did she not register as a sex offender?

    Why is she allowed to be with the children?
     
  8. TheGodInAGreyHoodie

    TheGodInAGreyHoodie Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2007
    Messages:
    6,621
    Likes Received:
    25
    Ratings:
    +26 / 0 / -0

    Now this is interesting. The article references an appellate level case from 2004. By now that case should have made it to the MI S. Ct. So I wanted to find what the higher court said.

    The article does not mention the parties names which makes finding the case hard, but it does give a date and the lower court. I did some searching and the court of appeals did not make any ruling in that time frame on anything remotely close to this issue as best I can find.

    So I am going to declare the whole thing ......

    Bull**** and a hoax
     
  9. Harry Boy

    Harry Boy Look Up, It's Amazing PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2005
    Messages:
    41,672
    Likes Received:
    277
    Ratings:
    +1,127 / 3 / -10

    Isn't there another "sh!t law" out there that prevents a women who has been raped from konwing if the man that raped her has AIDS---:confused:
     
  10. NEPatriot

    NEPatriot Banned

    Joined:
    Dec 14, 2004
    Messages:
    7,836
    Likes Received:
    11
    Ratings:
    +11 / 0 / -0

    IT IS NOT BS and It is REAL

    Here is another related case. It happens.

    The Columbus Dispatch : Boy's parents sue to get his baby from mom, 21
     
  11. Wildo7

    Wildo7 Totally Full of It

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2007
    Messages:
    8,876
    Likes Received:
    36
    Ratings:
    +49 / 16 / -3

    PR, just to play devil's advocate for a second, men also like to reinforce the double standard by creating this sort of macho atmosphere where statutory rape is seen differently through the eyes of the public depending on whether a man or a woman is involved.

    I don't know whether it's biological or cultural, but when you saw that attractive blond teacher get busted for having sex with one of her students all of the comments from people, especially pundits, seemed to be something along the lines of "lucky kid." Nobody seems to feel that an older woman praying on an underage boy is as predatorial as a man praying on a young girl.

    That being said, it has to be equal in the eyes of the law regardless of society's double standards and I agree that this seems clearly unfair. But the democratization of the judicial branch in this country is a truly bad thing, because judges must rule against the mob from time to time (another reason I don't think gay marriage or other civil rights should be voted on by the populace).

    Another aspect is that an underrage girl in this situation, who chooses to keep the baby, must bear at least part of the financial and parenting burden of the child she is now forced to raise, so in that sense mother nature seems to also have a double standard.

    In short, my initial reaction to this case is the same as yours; outrage. But I always find it best in legal matters to read the specifics of the case and the decision before responding with anger, since usually the sensationalist media misses something significant and the specifics of the case are lost in the simplification and negative reaction of the population. I think the Identity Theft case for undocumented immigrants that's being heard is a clear example of how complex, specific cases get generalized and distorted by angry, uninformed citizens.
     
    Last edited: Nov 12, 2008
  12. PatriotsReign

    PatriotsReign Hall of Fame Poster

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2007
    Messages:
    27,314
    Likes Received:
    197
    Ratings:
    +559 / 6 / -24

    #18 Jersey

    Of coures we react emotionally since we are emotional beings. But I agree that it is better to hold one's emotions in check until all the facts are clear.

    One note is that even if boys and guys like the thought of having sex with their teacher, it has no bearing (or should have no bearing) on the law.

    A kid can brag all he wants about having sex with his teach and his father can even say "atta boy son!", it's still against the law. The only relevant factor in question would be, "did an adult woman (or man) have sex with a child (commit statutory rape)?"
     

Share This Page

unset ($sidebar_block_show); ?>