Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by pats1, Jun 30, 2010.
Players union looking at six-year CBA deal with NFL - NFL News - FOX Sports on MSN
This area of the NFL isn't really my area of expertise, but I've gone on record before and I'll do it again: there is NO CHANCE IN HELL that there will be a work stoppage in 2011.
Yeah, it kind of would be the ultimate example of "bite your nose to spite your face," wouldn't it? But people have acted a lot more irrationally before, so I'll wait until the deal is signed before I celebrate.
The deal is probably a good ways off from actually being signed, but this is great news for football in 2011.
Smith should spend more time talking to the owners and less to the media.
If you read the article, no one is trying to finalize anything. He is still demanding the owners open their books before negotiating begins.
I've belonged to several unions, been through two strikes, one with the UAW, and I would not bet on any owner opening thier books to the players. Not just the players, but to ANYONE otgher than the IRS.
This is just yet another stupid ploy on SMith's part. Maybe it will work. Maybe not. But I am sick of him already. Should lock him and Goodell in a room together, then never open it up.
Glad negotiations heading forward now
I wish I was as optimistic as you all are. I'm thinking no football in 2011. They are just too far apart right now.
N.Eman - Negotiations aren't moving forward though. As spacecrime pointed out, the NFLPA wasn't the NFL to open the books for all teams before negotiations begin. You can't have it both ways..
One of the telling things is the mentioning of the Packers books. How, even though revenue when up 12.1 million, player salaries went up 14 million.
And I question the claim that the split was only 52-48 in favor of the NFLPA..
Especially for the Pats. I kind of see a lot of their rebuilding as coming together that year (not that I've given up on great things in 2010). I think a lot of us (myself included) are in denial about the impact of Tommy losing that season as he approaches 35, both for the team and for his own personal record book (would mean that he lost two of his prime seasons, one to injury and the other to a strike).
Much of what they say for public consumption is rhetoric. But I thought I sensed a rhetorical shift and softening of DeMaurice's stance when he was interviewed at the rookie symposium the other night and he said he was aware that among players there is no support for a work stoppage...but you still have to try to find a fair settlement...
Based on that I think a settlement or decertification will be the ultimate end game and either way the games go on. And therefore likely under terms that owners largely dictate. I think in the good old days there were fewer constituents in the NFLPA who knew which end was up and they largely bought into union rhetoric. I think today with the proliferation of information available to them via internet players are more likely to dig a little deeper and inclined to insure their half of the golden goose doesn't get cooked. I think the fact that the uncapped season has unfolded to be about as far from the player panacea their union predicted has opened a lot of eyes.
It is OVER A YEAR until the first day of the 2011 training camp. The players are already talking about a six year deal. The stumbling block is NOT about total monies but about how much financial information the owrners will divulge. The various percentages given for player revenue are there because different portions of revenue are counted, and some are not known. For example, is parking revenue counted?
Personally, I think that it is enormously positive that the nfl is doing very well and that the parties are even talking over a year before the end of current arrangement. The owners have cash flow protection from the contract with the networks, which they would pay back over time by giving credits to the networks. The players have cash flow protection through their strike fund.
As always, there will be the usual issues: percentage of revenues, which revenue are counted, free agency details (why bother with RFA when the teams don't bother), franchise tag details, pension amounts, full partial or no rookie pay schedule, cap details, potential team moves and league support for such moves, and league and player disciplinary policies. This is a normal list. The nfl has the CBA, so we are only talking about revisions.
If this were July 1st 2011, I would be mildly optimistic about the season starting on time and the effect of lost practice time on player development. With this being July 1, 2010, it is waaaaaaaaay premature to think that there will be the first player stoppage since 1987.
BTW, I would note that in the strikes of 1982 and 1987, the entire season was NOT lost. In 1982, weeks 3-10 were lost. In 1987, the first few weeks were played with replacement players and the players came back on October 15th to play the rest of the season.
It seems the most likely WORST CASE SCENARIO is a 10 week season.
The Players, as the other major stakeholders in and contributors to the success of the NFL, are entitled to know that the Owners' books show what the Owners say they show.
No matter how much the Owners protest that they aren't cooking the books, there are just too many ways they could play with expenses and alter their true profitability for public consumption.
The problem is, no doubt, that a lot of these owners have not had to be accountable to anyone for decades for how they manage their franchises. Spouses, heirs, vendors and minority partners may all have been kept in the dark about the true profitability of their businesses for reasons we can only imagine.
So, I can understand why the owners are reluctant to open their books to the public, but there has to be a way that an objective third party, like a big Accounting firm, could look at the books and issue an opinion as to whether they reflect the true state of the Franchise. This would be an added expense to the owners, of course, but they have only themselves to thank for it.
Ah, for the days of Tagliabue and Upshaw....
"We make a crapload of money, YOU make a crapload of money. Deal?"
Today I drove from central Wisconsin to Mackinaw area in Michigan via the Upper Peninsula. Stopped for lunch at a diner and read the local paper.
Local paper mill workers are picketing. Seems they have been negotiating a contract since 2008 when the old one ran out. They don't make much money, and aren't looking for a lot, but they want safer working conditions, and the oweners won't talk about it. I guess they figured 2 years was enough and are trying to get the owners to the table.
It really contrasted with the NFLPA's "We are making millions a year but the owners are keeping 40% of the money for themselves. GIMME MORE GIMME MORE."
I know the owners make a lot, but is that different than any other industry? Is Haynesworth life twice as good because his signing bonus was $40 Mil instead of $20 million dollars????
I don't know, reading the paper just bummed me out.
On a happy note, I drove right by Green Bay on the bypass and didn't stop to find Bret Favre Way. Good on me.
First of all, good on ya for not stopping to kiss the ass-phalt of Lord Favregaard's highway!
As for the NFLPA, I guess I disagree with you. These are exceptionally talented athlete-entertainers who generate billions of dollars of revenue.
They work for years even to get to an NFL training camp. They risk career-ending injury every day. Few of them actually become really rich. The average player plays for just over three years. Many don't even play long enough to get a pension. Many earn a good living and put away some money while playing and build good careers after they retire. Others suffer from orthopedic and neurological illnesses without adequate insurance or care. More than a few of their employer's are building billion dollar businesses off of their labors.
I have no trouble with them getting everything that a free market and our laws allow them to earn.
As for your story about the mill. It's hard not to empathize and feel the starkness of the contrast, but it doesn't change the situation of the players as far as I am concerned. Society is full of un-redressed injustice. I wish we could address all of them. Personally, I'd start with the salaries of teachers, police and firefighters.
I would hope that any agreement includes some sort of proper medical provision for ex-players.
whether it is badly or well timed the Chris Henry story is frightening.
Two of the most important issues often lost in discussions and negotiations:
1) provision for former players, including medical.
2) pension and other retirement benefits, critical to the jags and lunchpail players
And historically the NFLPA has shown little inclination to trade off much of anything in the present to fund the past or the future. Upshaw was on record saying retirees were not part of the NFLPA constituency. And jags and lunchpail players were told that trickle down would take care of them...
Playing a sport professionally is a privilege, not a right. Even low-round rookies make more than most doctors and lawyers and if you're lucky enough to last two or three years in the NFL at any level, chances are you're set for life financially. The orthopedic/neurological problems are prospective hazards of the trade, and any player who's worried enough about that can always quit and work 9-5 like the rest of us. Even our own Tom Brady said football players are way overpaid for what they do, and I agree. Our value system is out of whack, especially for gifted athletes who lack a real-world perspective.
We're not in the 90s anymore, Dorothy.
Things have changed. Really changed. Just like the traditional print and network TV media no longer control and spin the news exclusively, current players today have easy access to non-traditional media and can see where there 7 and 8 figure futures are at risk. As long as even a minority of players inform themselves, word will spread and the stranglehold on information once possessed by owners and union leaders is gone.
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