NFL officials [mergedx4]

[QuiGon]

Re: NFL officials

Watch that Super Bowl again, especially when Hasselback got called for an illegal block after the interception (when he was trying to make a tackle) by a supposedly all-star crew and tell me again how that game wasn't poorly officiated. When you watch it as an unbiased observer, it's hard not to notice that the calls were extremely one-sided....

I never said the game wasn't poorly officiated. I agree it was poorly officiated. I said there is a problem amongst NFL officials who are favoring home teams and home crowds in playoffs. There were 11 horrible calls from that year's playoffs and 10 of them favored the home crowd (and the Super Bowl was definitely a Steelers "Home Crowd").

BUT, having said all that, there are MILES of difference between "poor officiating" and "the league is trying to get certain teams to win and certain teams to lose for financial gain."

 

[richpats]

Re: NFL officials

When you brought up the subject of dynasties. You seem to believe that the league sees dynasties as a bad thing. The best way to demonstrate the fallacy of that reasoning is by showing how, in the past, dynasties have not been a bad thing.

So you demonstrated fallacy of my reasoning by using your own opinion? You should have just said "I disagree so you're wrong." That's about as much reasoning as you've given so far.

I think we have discovered the flaw in your reasoning. Parity is not designed to "bring every team to the middle." Parity is designed to give every team a level field on which to compete. There's a salary cap, so teams like the Pats, Cowboys and Redskins cannot outspend the Colts, Bills and Packers into oblivion. A full 7/8th of the schedule is determined by a certain formula - and the remaining 1/8th is determined based on the previous year's final standings.

You're making it sound like they give cap relief to crappy teams like Detroit and Cleveland and punish winners like NE and Indy. That just ain't the case.

I never said that they give cap relief to anybody - that's YOU putting words in my mouth. Who said that parity is NOT designed to bring every team to the middle? Oh, I see, you disagreed so you must be right

 

[RobertWeathers]

Not So OT: Fixed NFL Games by Officials

As most of you know, the details are coming out that NBA ref Tim Donaghy used his officiating influence during games to impact over/under scoring totals and in the process making some wiseguys pretty happy. Additionally, It looks like he actually bet on the same games as he actually officiated in. Lastly, what is just as intereting is that over the last 3 years, he led all NBA officials in technical fouls called.

For the sake of discussion, do any of you think that potentially past & present NFL refs have been on the take and made erroneous calls (pass interfrence, holding calls, etc.) to impact a game's outcome?

Obviously, with the advent of instant replay and much tighter officiating controls, the NFL IMO would be the toughest pro sport to fix the outcome as far as spreads and over/unders at the officiating level. Hockey and baseball would be tough too.

But with fantasy football now the big thing and the amount of money that it generates, could refs or even entire officiating crews be tempted to be "on the take" and maybe call a few more incidental contact penalties or holding penalties than normal so certain players do/don't get their yards or TDs?

Oliver Stone, President of Conspiracy Theorists signing off...

Thoughts?

 

[QuiGon]

Re: NFL officials

So you demonstrated fallacy of my reasoning by using your own opinion? You should have just said "I disagree so you're wrong." That's about as much reasoning as you've given so far.

No. The fallacy of your reasoning comes from your lack of understanding of the true purpose of "parity" as it exists within the NFL.

With all due respect, you really need to work on your reading comprehension.

 

[richpats]

Re: NFL officials

No. The fallacy of your reasoning comes from your lack of understanding of the true purpose of "parity" as it exists within the NFL.

With all due respect, you really need to work on your reading comprehension.

You need to work on getting a clue, then coming up with some legitimate reasoning for your claims.

 

[Pats726]

Re: NFL officials

The NFL is hip to this possibility and views it as one of the most significant threats to the goose currently laying golden eggs.

I do think the NFL sees the integrity of the game as important..very important. But I think they have failed to do ANYTHING at all with improving the officials situation with technology or any other aids. PFT has addressed this head on. I think it has to be addressed or teh conspiracy theories will take more hold. There have been some weird calls at key times..and one needs only one call to change the tide of the game. True, there are many officials involved, but only one of those needs to make a call at the wrong time to change the game. Again..appearance is soooo IMPORTANT!! In 05, the officiating in the playoffs was totally hideous. I am not saying there's any element of officiating thats in the take, but the league needs to do ALL it can to improve the officiating. I do not believe they have done this at all...in fact, it needs updating and quick.

 

[QuiGon]

Re: NFL officials

You need to work on getting a clue, then coming up with some legitimate reasoning for your claims.

Brilliant retort... boy you sure showed me...

 

[richpats]

Re: NFL officials

Brilliant retort... boy you sure showed me...

Wasn't the first time this thread...

 

[QuiGon]

Re: NFL officials

I do think the NFL sees the integrity of the game as important..very important.

I think that's a big understatement...

But I think they have failed to do ANYTHING at all with improving the officials situation with technology or any other aids. PFT has addressed this head on.

Except that's just not true. They experimented with instant replay, it went away, but then came back in its current form which is mostly popular. They are improving instant replay by now requiring the networks to use HD in all broadcasts. I mean, what more do you want them to do..? I think having a camera on each goal line is a good idea, but what else do you want..?

I think it has to be addressed or teh conspiracy theories will take more hold. There have been some weird calls at key times..and one needs only one call to change the tide of the game.

Unfortunately, you are always going to have sore losers complaining about bad calls and conspiracy theories. It's simply something that can never be eliminated.

 

[Pujo]

Re: NFL officials

Except that's just not true. They experimented with instant replay, it went away, but then came back in its current form which is mostly popular. They are improving instant replay by now requiring the networks to use HD in all broadcasts. I mean, what more do you want them to do..?

I think he was taking issue with penalties, which aren't reviewable.

 

[Jacky Roberts]

Re: NFL officials [merged]

Now that NBA official(s) is getting busted for fixing games, do you guys think it is possible that the same thing could be going on in the NFL? Like those "BS" pass interference and holding calls are not just judgement calls after all!

I dont even want to imagine what would happen to the game if something like this gets discovered. What do you guys think?

I bet the idiot Raiders fans are all of this stuff when they watch that Tuck Rule game.

 

[spacecrime]

Re: NFL officials

It wasn't a rule "change", it was a "re-emphasis" of an existing rule. THAT rule, not any other rule in the rulebook. Why would they do that?

Because someone pointed out the rule was in the books and it wasn't being followed? Yeah, it is a stupid rule, anbd the pointers out were crybabies who try to gain an advantage with rules and piped in music and junk like that, but it was still a rule, and once it was complained that the rule wasn't being followed, what was the league supposed to do? Say we don't really follow all the rules? No, they either change the rule, or they require it to be enforced. Because they want wide-open scoring more that defensive battles, the choice was obvious.

 

[Pats726]

Re: NFL officials

I think that's a big understatement....

Absolutely agree....

Except that's just not true. They experimented with instant replay, it went away, but then came back in its current form which is mostly popular. They are improving instant replay by now requiring the networks to use HD in all broadcasts. I mean, what more do you want them to do..? I think having a camera on each goal line is a good idea, but what else do you want..?

http://www.patsfans.com/12th/story/display_story.php?story_id=5995

Pro Football Talk had some big articles about that in Feb 06... http://www.profootballtalk.com/2-1-06through2-8-06.htm

Unfortunately, you are always going to have sore losers complaining about bad calls and conspiracy theories. It's simply something that can never be eliminated.

The problem gets larger when it looks so BAD..and yes, it can NOT be eliminated..but it can be reduced ...meaning getting the calls right MORE often. I do not think the NFL has done what it can. you might have people still complaining..but at least things will be done to reduce it..now, the NFL has done so little. I do not know what the answers are, but there are many roads and paths..now, it's
status quo. The 05 playoffs was just pitiful..and when that happens the conspiracy theories take hold. And THAT is the worst!

 

[QuiGon]

Re: NFL officials

Absolutely agree....

http://www.patsfans.com/12th/story/display_story.php?story_id=5995

Pro Football Talk had some big articles about that in Feb 06... http://www.profootballtalk.com/2-1-06through2-8-06.htm

I am not going to just go reading 2 articles to try and figure out what you are trying to say.... if you have a point to make, just make it...

The problem gets larger when it looks so BAD..and yes, it can NOT be eliminated..but it can be reduced ...meaning getting the calls right MORE often.

How can these problems be reduced..? Please don't give me the "full time refs" ridiculousness... There's nothing a ref can do in April and May to help him call a play in bounds or out of bounds in December. The "full time refs" people make it sounds like these problems just don't crop up in baseball, basketball or hockey, which is a ridiculous notion.

The only issue I have is there is a clear bias towards the home team in big playoff games. If the refs were more aware of their own subconscious biases, they could do better to overcome them.

 

[Pats726]

Re: NFL officials

I am not going to just go reading 2 articles to try and figure out what you are trying to say.... if you have a point to make, just make it....

It's there if you wish to read...

How can these problems be reduced..? Please don't give me the "full time refs" ridiculousness... There's nothing a ref can do in April and May to help him call a play in bounds or out of bounds in December. The "full time refs" people make it sounds like these problems just don't crop up in baseball, basketball or hockey, which is a ridiculous notion.

I don't beliece that it is ridiculous..There's nothing a ref can do to improve in the offseason?? Would you say that for athletes as well?? No..it sounds silly..so??? We are talking about the NFL and I think it's very possible that full time officials would help..[/QUOTE]

 

[QuiGon]

Re: NFL officials

It's there if you wish to read...

Well, if you want to make a point, it falls upon you to make it. Obviously it's not that great of a point if you simply refer to 2 other articles without elaboration.

I don't beliece that it is ridiculous..There's nothing a ref can do to improve in the offseason?? Would you say that for athletes as well??

No, I wouldn't but that's an absolutely ridiculous comparison. Furthermore, you are putting words in my mouth... I didn't say "there's nothing a ref can do to improve in the offseason"... There has to be meeting and rules discussions with the head of officiating... I just don't think putting in a 40 hour work week from February to August is going to solve the problem.

No..it sounds silly..so??? We are talking about the NFL and I think it's very possible that full time officials would help..

Yeah.. beause sports with full time officials never have these types of problems...

 

[Pats726]

Re: NFL officials

Well, if you want to make a point, it falls upon you to make it. Obviously it's not that great of a point if you simply refer to 2 other articles without elaboration.
No, I wouldn't but that's an absolutely ridiculous comparison. Furthermore, you are putting words in my mouth... I didn't say "there's nothing a ref can do to improve in the offseason"... There has to be meeting and rules discussions with the head of officiating... I just don't think putting in a 40 hour work week from February to August is going to solve the problem.
Yeah.. beause sports with full time officials never have these types of problems...

I see a lot of circular logic here...If you wish to learn and get many ideas about what the NFL can do, it's there..and I am sure there are MORE articles as well. Actually that comparison is NOT at all ridiculous..players use the offseason to improve should not officials?? OR would that be asking too much of them...We are NOT talking about basketball, hockey or baseball..YOU specifically asked about NFL officiating. And I think it would help..If you wish to talk about the officiating in other sports there are boards for those sports.

 

[QuiGon]

Re: NFL officials

I see a lot of circular logic here...If you wish to learn and get many ideas about what the NFL can do, it's there..and I am sure there are MORE articles as well.

I am sure there are too. But it does not fall upon me to research and support the point you are making.

Actually that comparison is NOT at all ridiculous..players use the offseason to improve should not officials??

Yes, it is a ridiculous comparison. Players are athletes. They have to maintain their themselves in top physical shape or they risk losing to the competition. Now a ref has to maintain himself in decent shape and he certainly should attend meetings during the offseason. But 40 hours per week of watching film ain't gonna help on a Sunday in December or January.

OR would that be asking too much of them...We are NOT talking about basketball, hockey or baseball..YOU specifically asked about NFL officiating. And I think it would help..If you wish to talk about the officiating in other sports there are boards for those sports.

Yes, but you are suggesting that full-time officials would solve the NFL's problems. I disagree with that statement. I reference other sports as evidence supporting my contention. That is purely a logical connection on display.

You're just like that other guy in this thread that thinks dynasties are bad for the league. I disagree with the statement, but I can't use evidence about the Steelers, 49ers or Cowboys...

 

[Pats726]

Re: NFL officials

I am sure there are too. But it does not fall upon me to research and support the point you are making. Yes, it is a ridiculous comparison. Players are athletes. They have to maintain their themselves in top physical shape or they risk losing to the competition. Now a ref has to maintain himself in decent shape and he certainly should attend meetings during the offseason. But 40 hours per week of watching film ain't gonna help on a Sunday in December or January.Yes, but you are suggesting that full-time officials would solve the NFL's problems. I disagree with that statement. I reference other sports as evidence supporting my contention. That is purely a logical connection on display.

You're just like that other guy in this thread that thinks dynasties are bad for the league. I disagree with the statement, but I can't use evidence about the Steelers, 49ers or Cowboys...

If you do not wish to read and learn it's YOUR loss...given you're narrow minded viewpoint you'd just trash any ideas anyways. ...I disagree about the full time officials....so let's use reverse logic...how much POORER officiating would it be in the other sports would be if they were part time???

 

[richpats]

Re: NFL officials

You're just like that other guy in this thread that thinks dynasties are bad for the league. I disagree with the statement, but I can't use evidence about the Steelers, 49ers or Cowboys...

BTW I recommend "How to win Friends and Influence People" - you need it.