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NEs D not as bad as some think

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by Triumph, Nov 30, 2010.

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  1. Triumph

    Triumph Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

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  2. Brettlax3434

    Brettlax3434 Third String But Playing on Special Teams

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    good post. I really don't believe yards should be the rating system, points should be. This stat includes both.
     
  3. Dufflebagz

    Dufflebagz 2nd Team Getting Their First Start

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    That's what I think they are...a middle of the pack D
     
  4. Triumph

    Triumph Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

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  5. ALP

    ALP Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal

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    but wait, the NFL told me the chargers have hte best defense in the NFL


    what a joke that stat is
     
  6. Nikolai

    Nikolai Football Atheist PatsFans.com Supporter

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    We get a lot of Giants games here and I think one of the reasons why the Giants are so bad on the bendability index might be the extreme amount of turnovers the offense produces. Usually teams don't have to drive that far to score points. I'm sure that factors in.

    By contrast, the Pats take care of the ball, which I'm sure helps.

    Neat link.
     
  7. sbpatfan

    sbpatfan Banned

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    Problem is, that stat doesn't account for the defense being put in a bad position.
     
  8. redsx8827

    redsx8827 Rookie

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    The pats D is average (and not really awful) partly because the offense is so good. BB traded moss because he knew the defense needed our offense to be efficient and safe, not explosive and turnover-prone. It works for this team...hopefully next year our D will be self sufficient
     
  9. TriplecHamp

    TriplecHamp Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

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  10. dhamz

    dhamz In the Starting Line-Up

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    The fact that this analysis includes points allowed by special teams and by the offense via fumble and interception returns for TDs makes it totally useless.
     
  11. MassPats38

    MassPats38 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    The formula is yards allowed/points allowed. That means the worse a team is at giving up yardage, the more points it can allow while staying off the bottom with this index. The Pats are 31st in yardage and 22nd in points - surrendering 10 ppg more than the Packers (it breaks with that point total, so it is not a true bend don't break defense). New England is last on third down stops (that tends to be a decent measure of a defense - teams do not want to give up first downs by design). The Pats are tied for second in the NFL in take away/give away differential.

    The Pats D is a work in progress, showing up at critical times this season and doing just enough to let the offense win the games. With all the youngsters and missing veterans, that is to be expected, and will have to be good enough this season. It has done well in terms of turn-overs. as has the offense, and that has helped to hide its flaws in other areas.

    It helps when visiting statistics pages to just click the down arrow instead of the up arrow to put the defense at the top of the list of other teams rather than at the bottom. You'll feel better. Teams win games, and the defense is an integral part of those wins (it does make stops, just not as many as most would like to see). The only relevant statistic is wins, and no statistical ranking offsets a loss or lots of losses.
     
  12. Triumph

    Triumph Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

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    Might as well beech and complain about the offense too.

    KO returns are included in their stats.
     
  13. MassPats38

    MassPats38 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Since this thread was on a defensive statistic, are you arguing that the formula is valid, criticizing the OP, or are you responding to a particular post in the thread? Not really sure where anyone claimed the offensive stats were valid in this thread.
     
  14. patsfaninpittsburgh

    patsfaninpittsburgh Banned

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    The special teams/defense scores are valid. As such, just subtract them.

    I believe we gave up 7 points of KO (CJ Spiller) so subtract and recalculate.

    Again, read their article, they say they are "attempting" to measure "bend but don't break".

    It's an attempt to measure "situational football".

    One area I like to review are numbers of drives and result. Also, long (starts outside FG range) TD drives is a good stat.
     
  15. ATippett56

    ATippett56 Pro Bowl Player

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    It’s defense that will tell if Patriots stand a chance - The Boston Globe

     
  16. patfanken

    patfanken Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

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    That's good info for the masses who are hoping that despite what their eyeballs are showing them, there is hope for this defense.

    This "bendability" stat also brings up a point I brought up in a recent thread. That the Defense is giving up yardage, very grudgingly. That while the defensive stats on 3rd down are horrid, it seems like the defensive stats on 1st and second downs are much better.

    That means, at least in my view, that the Pats are playing good defense on SOME PLAYS, but are too inexperienced to pull it together for 3 plays in a row. THAT'S what is so frustrating.

    You see them play 2 great downs on defense, then piss it away on 3rd down, Especially when they are so close on 3rd down sometimes to making the play.

    Maybe this defense IS getting better. We'll find out the next 5 weeks.
     
    Last edited: Nov 30, 2010
  17. ATippett56

    ATippett56 Pro Bowl Player

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    What I like to see is for Jermaine Cunningham to finish strong in the last five games, especially as a pass rusher instead of watching Kyle Arrington rush the quarterback.

    Re-Focused: Week 12, Patriots at Lions | ProFootballFocus.com

     
  18. Ochmed Jones

    Ochmed Jones Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

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    Our defense is NOT even a playoff calibre defense, let alone one of the better defenses in the NFL.

    However our defense has shown the amazing ability to step up in key moments. So while teams may run up and down the field at will on us, it is important to note that our defense can make a play in a key moment of the game.

    A key stop is not a stat that can be measured, but it is a very important and undervalued aspect of our team.
     
  19. HEY BRO! WHAT UP?

    HEY BRO! WHAT UP? Banned

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  20. MassPats38

    MassPats38 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I don't disagree with the idea of the index (although I did point out how it may not be a great measure at times), I was more questioning the prior comment.

    This team is tough to define with a single statistical index, but you get the general idea with a number of indicators that the defense complements the offense to the extent it has to and is capable of ending drives when it needs to do so. No matter how you manipulate the stats, the defense has flaws (I expected the D would start worse than it did and improve over the course of the season - with the schedule as it is the degree of improvement is tough to assess). The win total would itself seem to indicate the flaws are not as bad as they are made out to be. I expect much of the progress this season is better seen through highlight reels rather than stats (the when's things happen rather than the number of occurrences).
     
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