Neil deGrasse Tyson - Admits Mea Culpa -While Still Not Quite Getting it Right

[ausbacker]

The attention seeking television/media whores have come running from all corners of the globe to be seen commenting on LeakGate. Isn't humanity wonderful?

 

[letekro]

NDT's primary talents are writing and oration. His job is to explain science to idiots in an entertaining way, not to be the world's greatest scientist, which he clearly isnt.

 

[chasa]

As @Patters was commenting in another thread, the only real opposition to the science has been from these two television personalities.

Having Tyson admit publicly that he made a mistake in his calculations was rather a big deal I thought.. it just wasn't as much as I was hoping it was going to be.

Nye's interview and subsequent video just has to be a joke. I'm thinking they were both meant to be taken tongue in cheek with his terribly unscientific observations being revealed as a joke when he yells Go Seahawks in conclusion.

I think the fact that its on funnyordie.com should clue people in that its not serious.

 

[memento]

At least DeGrasse actually used science (even if incorrect science) to back up his claims. Bill Nye's argument against Belichick was just embarrassing even if it was for for an argument on validity of a junior high school experiment. I mean Nye's strongest argument that Belichick's explanation was wrong was "Go Seahawks!".

Welcome to the twitter age. I still wish I could see the full video of Bill Nye without the Good Morning America jump cuts.

 

[Danger Zone]

I think the fact that its on funnyordie.com should clue people in that its not serious.

Agreed.

You know the sad thing is, I love this kind of subtle but utterly obvious, intellectually self-depreciating humor and almost always get it.

The fact that I couldn't tell it apart from all the other horribly ignorant things the rest of the media is actually being serious about is even sadder.

 

[Joker]

Argh, plenty of other scientists disagree with Tyson, we disagree with Tyson, but I'm pretty sure neither his race nor Boston's racial history has anything to do with his rejection of the Patriots explanation.

In an undated interview at Howard Hughes Medical Institute, Tyson talked about being black and one of the most visible and well known scientists in the world. He told a story about being interviewed about a plasma burst from the sun on a local Fox affiliate in 1989. “I'd never before in my life seen an interview with a black person on television for expertise that had nothing to do with being black. And at that point, I realized that one of the last stereotypes that prevailed among people who carry stereotypes is that, sort of, black people are somehow dumb. I wondered, maybe ... that's a way to undermine this sort of, this stereotype that prevailed about who's smart and who's dumb. I said to myself, 'I just have to be visible, or others like me, in that situation.' That would have a greater force on society than anything else I could imagine."[54][55]

In 2005, at a conference at the National Academy of Sciences, Tyson responded to a question about whether genetic differences might keep women from working as scientists. He said that his goal to become an astrophysicist was “hands down the path of most resistance through the forces … of society.” He continued: "My life experience tells me, when you don’t find blacks in the sciences, when you don’t find women in the sciences, I know these forces are real and I had to survive them in order to get where I am today. So before we start talking about genetic differences, you gotta come up with a system where there’s equal opportunity. Then we can start having that conversation.”[56]

In a 2014 interview with Grantland, Tyson said that he related his experience on that 2005 panel in an effort to make the point that the scientific question about genetic differences can't be answered until the social barriers are dismantled. "I’m saying before you even have that conversation, you have to be really sure that access to opportunity has been level."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neil_deGrasse_Tyson

Funny...I have NEVER EVER heard of Stephen Hawking going beserk about the inequities of suffering from ALS and demanding "a conversation" on it before anyone can "move forward".

 

[karguy85]

Let's get Kip Thorne on this issue! I trust him more than Tyson (though I do like Tyson). Maybe Thorne will write "The Science of DeflateGate" as a companion book to the Super Bowl.

 

[Hoodie]

In an undated interview at Howard Hughes Medical Institute, Tyson talked about being black and one of the most visible and well known scientists in the world. He told a story about being interviewed about a plasma burst from the sun on a local Fox affiliate in 1989. “I'd never before in my life seen an interview with a black person on television for expertise that had nothing to do with being black. And at that point, I realized that one of the last stereotypes that prevailed among people who carry stereotypes is that, sort of, black people are somehow dumb. I wondered, maybe ... that's a way to undermine this sort of, this stereotype that prevailed about who's smart and who's dumb. I said to myself, 'I just have to be visible, or others like me, in that situation.' That would have a greater force on society than anything else I could imagine."[54][55]

In 2005, at a conference at the National Academy of Sciences, Tyson responded to a question about whether genetic differences might keep women from working as scientists. He said that his goal to become an astrophysicist was “hands down the path of most resistance through the forces … of society.” He continued: "My life experience tells me, when you don’t find blacks in the sciences, when you don’t find women in the sciences, I know these forces are real and I had to survive them in order to get where I am today. So before we start talking about genetic differences, you gotta come up with a system where there’s equal opportunity. Then we can start having that conversation.”[56]

In a 2014 interview with Grantland, Tyson said that he related his experience on that 2005 panel in an effort to make the point that the scientific question about genetic differences can't be answered until the social barriers are dismantled. "I’m saying before you even have that conversation, you have to be really sure that access to opportunity has been level."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neil_deGrasse_Tyson

Funny...I have NEVER EVER heard of Stephen Hawking going beserk about the inequities of suffering from ALS and demanding "a conversation" on it before anyone can "move forward".

Let's keep on topic here. I'm saying he's not disagreeing with the Patriots because he's black. Nowhere in this does he say, "I'm black so I hate the Patriots and Boston therefore believe they cheated."

 

[Joker]

why not just lay EVERYTHING BARE and get Sharpton's take on Deflategate?...expect fair and unbiased takes from his panel...take a look...I'm just shocked DeGrasse isn't on this "panel' too, to exacerbate the credibility of accusing "those dirty Patriot cheaters"...(1 minute 44 seconds)

http://www.msnbc.com/politicsnation/watch/inside-the-patriots--deflategate-controversy-386349635742

DeGrasse has an agenda just like Sharpton...in fact, the clip following, Sage Rosenfels and some "guy" Terence Moore, continue the screaming declaring "they did it!!!"

http://www.msnbc.com/the-ed-show/watch/deflate-gate-dominates-super-bowl-xlix-389853763860

It's public lynching by the mob...

 

[Bobsyouruncle]

NDT's primary talents are writing and oration. His job is to explain science to idiots in an entertaining way, not to be the world's greatest scientist, which he clearly isnt.

I agree his talents are writing and oration. You can't claim to be good at explaining science if your explaining incorrectly.

It does not take a PHD to do some research on the very narrow case football inflation or do an experiment before speaking. I'm not going to fact check his life work. It may be he doesn't care enough to look, (though he volunteered his opinion) which is fine.

The lesson IMO is just because someone has expertise at one field does not make them experts in all fields. Credentials cannot replace rigor.

 

[Joker]

Let's keep on topic here. I'm saying he's not disagreeing with the Patriots because he's black. Nowhere in this does he say, "I'm black so I hate the Patriots and Boston therefore believe they cheated."

Then why doesn't he keep his goddamned mouth shut, do HIS business and catch the rest on ESPN? YOU stick your head in the sand all you want to...when I see bigotry I react.

 

[kkpat]

http://www.reddit.com/r/askscience/comments/2ts1o6/are_bill_nye_and_neil_degrasse_tyson_wrong_on/

Assuming constant volume, constant amount of gas, by the ideal gas law we know P1 / P2 = T1 / T2 when we use absolute temperatures and absolute pressures.

Note, atmospheric pressure is 1 atm = 14.7 psi. When a pressure gauge reads 12.5 psi, that means the absolute pressure is 12.5psi+14.7psi = 27.2 psi. Similarly note that absolute zero in Fahrenheit is -459.67F, so to convert a temperature in Fahrenheit to an absolute scale (the Rankine), you need to add 459.67F

• Initial Pressure = 12.5 psi + 1 atm = 27.2 psi
• Initial Temperature = 80 F
• Final Temperature = 50 F
• Final Pressure = 27.2 psi (50 + 459.67)/(80 + 459.67) = 25.7 psi = 11 psi + 1 atm

Hence, you can get 2 psi lower than the initial indoor pressure measurement (if the ball is slightly warmed above room temperature by friction).

To summarize:

• If you started at 70F, the 12.5 psi football would have lost 1 psi of pressure at 50F.
• If you started at 80F, the 12.5 psi football would have lost 1.5 psi at 50F
• If you started at 90F, the 12.5 psi football would have lost 2 psi at 50F.

 

[kkpat]

Bill Burr - Deflategate

Listen to this

 

[Hoodie]

Then why doesn't he keep his goddamned mouth shut, do HIS business and catch the rest on ESPN? YOU stick your head in the sand all you want to...when I see bigotry I react.

Joker the Patriots have been skewered on every news, sports and late night comedy show in this country and yet you seem to be particularly upset over Tyson and Sharpton. Underlying issue there?

 

[Joker]

Underlying issue? You accusing ME of being the racist here? When I see a person jump out of his realm of expertise to make nationally known his scientific opinion that BB, Kraft and Brady are public liars...AND he refutes the already published explanation by a Boston College academic in the same field, I question his MOTIVE. I GAVE you his direct quotes on HIS POSITION about the "racist scientific" community. I don't have the agenda, HE CLEARLY DOES.

This ends here. You keep believing these public personae are above reproach and questions. I question what I SEE when I SEE it. Free country still, isn't it? Or am I the one with a "problem" about that too?

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

Bottom Line:
Tyson as is his wont is blathering without having done his homework.
If you're going to opine on a scientific issue as a well known popular scientific figure you have the obligation to
(1) check your calculations
(2) get the actual starting & ending conditions right,
(3) at least comment on other variables at play, e.g. wet ball and finally and most importantly
(4) address experimental results that are not in line with your math model.

Tyson was 0 for 4.
He is a pitiful example of a scientist. Once he believes something, nothing will dissuade him.

Too bad because he's a decent popularizer of astronomy & cosmology 2 of my favorite topics.

 

[jsull87]

The main issue with the critiscm is. That the balls were only under inflated by 1 psi (last reports) not 2 psi. that means only under inflated by 7.5%. Which completely throws out the maths.

It also assumes that the guage was 100% accurate, the NFL actuallyt inflated the balls to exactly 12.5 psi, not 12.4/3/2 e.t.c

It is just a bit silly and not factual. It just feeds this media $#!t storm.

 

[chasa]

Funny...I have NEVER EVER heard of Stephen Hawking going beserk about the inequities of suffering from ALS and demanding "a conversation" on it before anyone can "move forward".

Last time I checked there were not as many ALS sufferers as there are african americans.

This is probably going to take the discussion into a whole new, terrible direction that will probably result in people getting banned, BUT I think it bares saying. There is a huge problem in the african american community, and it results in a lot of bad stigma, and stereotypes that feed off themselves, resulting in the kind of stupid ******** where "streetcred" is an important part of your personal character. It's resulted in the african community really being two distinct groupings And the negatives of one group causes all the positives the other group do to be harder to achieve.

For instance the Russell Wilson issue where hes "not black enough" is a pretty case in point, me pointing at the purple elephant in the room moment. The fact that someone could be "not black enough" to his peers highlights the issue exactly.

What Tyson is doing is hes showing kids that are growing up in that environment, "hey, you don't need to worry about street cred, you are made of star stuff" He is putting out positive vibes to everyone, and especially the Black community, to show kids that they have real legitimate options that don't include sports, or drugs, or music, that they can in fact be intellectuals, and to me that's a very positive message. Hes a role model, and uses science as his way of reaching the masses. Is he Stephan hawking smart? god no, but he doesn't have to be, what he IS, is Accessible to a HUGE majority of people of all races and gender.

With that said, hes comments on this mater really a not important, I promise you he a.) has not gone out and gotten any facts about what actually happened and b.)Did not put much effort into solving it. He was asked a question, he fired off an answer blindly, and then later updated it with a bit more info, but since he didn't do A, it was still mostly incorrect.

maybe put your pitchforks away on this one guys, as its really not a big deal anymore, deflategate is dead, lets as a fanbase move on, until such a time as the league is ready to apologize.

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

I'm not being critical but I think it's best if we just focus on Tyson in his role as a scientist commenting on football in this thread

 

[Bobsyouruncle]

Underlying issue? You accusing ME of being the racist here? When I see a person jump out of his realm of expertise to make nationally known his scientific opinion that BB, Kraft and Brady are public liars...AND he refutes the already published explanation by a Boston College academic in the same field, I question his MOTIVE. I GAVE you his direct quotes on HIS POSITION about the "racist scientific" community. I don't have the agenda, HE CLEARLY DOES.

This ends here. You keep believing these public personae are above reproach and questions. I question what I SEE when I SEE it. Free country still, isn't it? Or am I the one with a "problem" about that too?

I don't know man, I think you're hearing hoofs and thinking zebras here. Whether he is or isn't racist I'm not going to conjecture. But I think the underlying thesis here that Mass= long history of racism so his conclusions are biased is probably flawed. For one, I have never heard that Massachussetts is racist or was anymore than anywhere else. I'm not from mass, but I'm pretty well traveled, lived in many states and have never heard that.

People associate racism with the south, whether fair or not. It may be something people in Massachussetts believe, it may even be true to some degree but I think it's unlikely Tyson has drawn that distinction. It's certainly not a widely held belief. I bet if you took a poll of the most racist states in people's opinion Mass would be way, way down on the list. If he had made that connection for some reason he would almost assuredly be applying the same bias to the many, many places with a much more well known history. And at some point he'd just be wrong about nearly everything, and incapable of functioning in his position.

There's plenty of reasons he could be wrong, racism seems completely out of left field.