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Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by eifmp, Dec 7, 2006.

  1. eifmp

    eifmp Rookie

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    Just to let you konw I am a Jets fan.

    I need a very honest opinion from all of the Patriot fans on two secific things:
    1) Do any of you give the Jets credit for the win in foxboro? I heard some Pats fans say that the only reason the Jets won is because of A) the bye week they had and B) the field during the game. I was wondering if most of you felt that way too?

    2) Do you consider the Jets a real threat at all in the AFC playoff race?

    I think the Pats are good...but there is something up with Tom Brady. He is just not playng his best ball right now.

    I hope our teams meet in the playoffs...
    -Chris
  2. unoriginal

    unoriginal Rookie

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    1) I would say the bye week was an advantage for the Jets, along with The Penguin's familiarity with the Patriots' system. I believe several Jets players are on record confirming that that particular game plan was their best so far this season.

    Of course, to quote Moltke, no plan ever survives first contact with the enemy. The Jets players played better football that day then the Pats. End of story.

    2) I would say the prevailing opinion among Pats fans is that the Jets are irrelevant, because destiny is squarely in the Pats hands at this point, and this team hasn't collasped down the stretch before. Now, are the Jets a threat in the playoffs if they lock up, say, the sixth seed and the Pats get the third? I personally would be a little nervous, but two days out of three I say the Pats win that game.

    Tom Brady is playing good ball right now. His interceptions have by and large been the result of tips, and his completion percentage has shot up recently. It was tough for him earlier, but now as newer receivers like Caldwell are becoming proficient in the system, I think you'll see a more consistant aerial assault. Right now the only thing stopping this offense from scoring in the 30's on a weekly basis is fumbles.
  3. RayClay

    RayClay Rookie

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    #75 Jersey
    It was sun spots!
  4. CheerforTom

    CheerforTom Rookie

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    I've been guilty of thinking that the terrible field had a lot to do with it. Then again, you guys played on the same field too.

    We definitely got outcoached, though. That's very clear in hindsight.
  5. patsox23

    patsox23 Rookie

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    Chris, MANY of us give the jets credit. They played well, we did not. Brady hasn't been quite himself this season - for various reasons - but all things considered, he's done okay. The jets have done a good job. congrats.
  6. SWelker

    SWelker Rookie

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    The Jets have looked good this season, and with the rest of their schedule vs terrible teams, I'd expect them to run the table and win the wild card, hopefully we can take care of our business though, but the Jets have been a surprise.
  7. edzo44

    edzo44 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I'll give the Jets plenty of credit for playing a lot better then anyone anticipated this year. The game in question was closer then expected and the better team that day won it. The AFC East next year is going to be a killer of a problem for everyone outside the division and a hellacious battle in the division because we're all starting to even out again. 2007 will be very interesting though I still think Pats have best chance of holding their ground due to depth.
  8. BelichickFan

    BelichickFan B.O. = Fugazi PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #24 Jersey
    No it's not. We outpassed them, outrushed them, out everythinged them. We just tossed the ball away more than them. We weren't outcoached, the players just f*cked up.

    And, no, I don't give the jesters credit for anything other than being on the field that day.
  9. PATSNUTme

    PATSNUTme Paranoid Homer Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #75 Jersey
    The JEST played hard and smart that day but they didn't WIN the game - the Patriots lost it. Yet, the Jest celebrated as if they had won a championship instead of a regular season game.

    And the JEST fans at JI, made more noise about how the Patriots sucked instead of celebrating the JEST win.:mad:

    That is why the JEST will aways be losers and haven't even gone to the SB since the AFL-NFL merger. :eek:

    That's my honest opinion.
    Last edited: Dec 7, 2006
  10. Murphys95

    Murphys95 Rookie

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    I absolutely think the Jets are a realistic threat in the AFC. New York is a team that believes they can win. They have a gritty character, as they have shown in both games against New England, as well as their close losses to Indy and Chicago.

    The Jets beat the Patriots in Foxboro because they played better and appeared to want it more.
  11. PatsWickedPissah

    PatsWickedPissah PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I was at that game front and center. Jets were better prepared, had a better game plan, didn't let the field bother them as much (Brady tripped & fell twice for drive killing sacks), and played harder and better than the Patriots.

    The Jets cannot be a threat because the Pats have a 2 game lead in mid-December. Only critical player injuries, to Brady etc. could cause the Pats to lose two. Meanwhile the Jets would need to win out. Ain't gonna happen.

    There is nothing wrong with Brady. He's transitioned to his totally new 1st & 2nd WRs by now.

    I would love to defeat the Jets in the playoffs.

    Are you young enough to possibly live long enough to see the Jets win their 1st ever NFL Championship?
    Last edited: Dec 7, 2006
  12. PatsDeb

    PatsDeb PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    1 - I give the Jets credit for the win in Foxboro; you guys made the plays and we didn't, and you won the game fair and square. I also give the Jets credit for being as good as they are this season. Pennington has made a nice recovery and Mangini has exceeded expectations (a lot of us thought he would fall on his face having been a little shaky here as DC last year).

    2 - I don't consider the Jets a real threat in the playoff race. I think you might get a wildcard if you win out and the AFC West teams cancel eachother out. But if you have to face us again, I think the Pats will not take you lightly and we will win.

    Brady has been playing steadily better; there's nothing wrong with him. We need Ben Watson and others to stop fumbling and we will start to blow other teams out (ex - we had 4 turnovers against Chicago inside the 20 yd. line. If we held onto the ball and only kicked gimme FGs on those possessions, we would have won by 12 pts more).

    Good luck and I hope we meet in the playoffs too.
    Last edited: Dec 7, 2006
  13. CTPatsFan

    CTPatsFan Rookie

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    No, it was a fluke, and no. ;)

    Tom is still getting used to his new toys.
  14. AndyJohnson

    AndyJohnson PatsFans.com Veteran PatsFans.com Supporter

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    The Jets get credit for winning because they won and therefore deserved to win.
    Was it the typical example of the way each team would play on any given day? I would say not. Does that matter? No, you play a game once.

    If you are asking who is the better team, I think there is little doubt.

    Do I consider the Jets a legitimate contender? No. They could make the playoffs, but my guess now will be no. If they do get in, they wont be in long.
    They have way outperformed what everyone expected, and what their talent says they should, but they are not good enough yet to be a playoff threat.
  15. scott99

    scott99 Rookie

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    Your opinions have some flaws (a nice way of saying your full of sh*t). The Jets were the better team that day, PERIOD. We were outcoached, outplayed, out-everythinged. Hell, we were lucky to beat them the first time (a great comeback by them). The Jets are a good young team with a fine coach, and they should be an up and coming team for the remainder of this year and next. Mangini has them believing. Luckily for us, we have a two game lead. They actually have an easier remaining schedule than we do, so don't be surprised if they wind up only one game back, or even tied at the end of the year with us. If it's a tie, I believe we win due to more points scored in our games against them. Don't get me wrong, I truly believe in this Patriot team, but we didn't just lose the game, the Jets won it.
  16. PatsFanInVa

    PatsFanInVa PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    1. The Jets scored more points. They won the game. Football can not ever be about "who should have won." (Sorry, Seahawks fans!) The Jets did what they needed to do to win. The Pats did not.

    2. The Jets have a soft schedule going forward, so are a good candidate for a wild-card. It would take a Pats meltdown to lose the division itself to the Jets, but the playoffs are another story.

    The playoffs are not played in a fantasy format, a best-of-seven series format, or any other format. They are not decided by sour-grape stories written in the home towns of losing teams, stating they "should have won." They are played in a lose-and-go-home, sudden-death format. Any team that enters the playoffs is a threat to the Pats.

    If players forget that, they watch the game on TV with us fanboys in February.

    PFnV
  17. PatsWickedPissah

    PatsWickedPissah PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #37 Jersey
    Not quite

    Two Clubs
    1. Head-to-head (best won-lost-tied percentage in games between the clubs).
    same
    2. Best won-lost-tied percentage in games played within the division.
    Each currently has 1 division loss
    3. Best won-lost-tied percentage in common games.
    Haven't looked it up. Still games to play.
    4. Best won-lost-tied percentage in games played within the conference.
    5. Strength of victory.
    6. Strength of schedule.
    7. Best combined ranking among conference teams in points scored and points allowed.
    8. Best combined ranking among all teams in points scored and points allowed.
    9. Best net points in common games.
    10. Best net points in all games.
    11. Best net touchdowns in all games.
    ************

    One more time, the bottom line is that the Pats control their own destiny. If we are a real playoff threat, we'll win Sunday and add another Division W.
    One more time, the issue is not the suddenly feared Jets, it's how well the Pats play their next games.
  18. psychoPat

    psychoPat Role Player PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Chris, put me down in the column that says the Jets played a better game that day, end to end.
    It was my maiden voyage to Foxborough. I didn't like what i saw.

    You find many Jets-haters here ... but not me.
    Actually, NYJ probably are my second-favorite team in the league - which is tough, in the same div
    as my real hands-down pet Pats.
    Partly, that is because of so much roster incest.
    Sometimes the teams seem like funhouse mirror images of each other.
    I'm rootin' for 'em whenever their game doesn't impact the Pats.

    Glad to see Penny rebound and Eric step up to the challenge.
    You win out too, like we're going to do ...
    and see you again up here next month!
  19. Patriotic Fervor

    Patriotic Fervor Rookie

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    I thought the Jets won Super Bowl III...Could be wrong, tho....
  20. PatsWickedPissah

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    #37 Jersey
    Wasn't an NFL Championship game.

    I've finally created a sig for the Jets fans.
  21. PATSNUTme

    PATSNUTme Paranoid Homer Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    You are delusional ( a nice way of saying that you are full of **** up to your ears).

    The first game we took it to them early and was ahead 24-0 . Two fluke plays got them close. That's all- revise history if you want but that is the facts. Nothing more and nothing less.

    The second game they played well and smart,as I said. But, we LOST it by making stupid UNFORCED mistakes. They didn't WIN it. Had we not made those stupid and UNFORCED mistakes we would have won - plain and simple.

    I really wonder if you watched either game and just saw highlights.

    And what I said about the JETS and a large group of their FANS is undeniable factual.

    So who's full of **** now?
    Last edited: Dec 7, 2006
  22. PatsWickedPissah

    PatsWickedPissah PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I dissagree.
    The Jets were better prepared with a offense supressing gameplan and their players executed better. Through some combination of circumstances had the Pats scored again to win, they still would have been outplayed on that field that day.
    It is what it is.
  23. Murphys95

    Murphys95 Rookie

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    I disagree too. The Jets played the Pats tight in both games. In week two, there was only one amazingly lucky play, and that was Cotchery's catch and run. Coles' touchdown late in the 3rd was a super effort against the Pats defense. I'd also point out that Pennington and the Jets converted 11 out of 18 times on 3rd down in that game - that's a phenomenal rate.

    The second time around their offensive strategy worked to a tee against the Pats defense and again converted a very good 6 out of 13 on 3rd down. The Jets beat the Pats fair and square.

    As for using turnovers as an excuse, New England lost the turnover battle (2-1) in both games against the Jets.
  24. 5 Rings for Brady!!

    5 Rings for Brady!! Rookie

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    The Jets get credit for what they are. A team that will be short lived in the playoffs after a good regular season.

    I'm not prepared to say that the Patriots will do any better, until I actually see them get into a rythym on offense.

    Brady will always be a better QB than Penny. He is not stuggling because he is having problems. He is struggling because the Patriots front office chooses not to coddle him with talent at WR, and his O-Line is wildly inconsistent as well. Brady slipped a few times in the mud, but mostly he didn't have a single guy open because the Jets took away his average to below average WRs. Nobody got open for Brady to make a play.

    A good defense will always intercept Penny's lousy little floater balls. He throws like a limp noodle. The announcers in the Pats/Jets game couldn't get over the fact that the Pats defense didn't pick off more of his limp and often risky passes. But the Pats didn't get the job done on either side of the ball.

    The Jets played better that day.

    I can't say the Pats are a better team heading into the playoffs until I see Brady's lackluster skill players get it together, and his wildly inconsistent O-Line block better. But I know which QB wins superbowls. :rocker:
  25. TomBrady'sGoat

    TomBrady'sGoat Rookie

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    The jets won the game. They deserve credit for that. Excuses don't change the outcome.

    That said I do not at all consider the Jets a playoff threat. If the Jets make the playoffs and win a game there should be a parade. The Patriots lost to the Dolphins in '04 and the Redskins and Bills in '03; that didn't make them good teams, it meant they beat the Patriots in a game.

    I'd expect this year's Patriots team to beat the Jets 8 out of every 10 times they play. They simply got one of the two losses out of the way.
  26. Rob0729

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    I will give the Jets credit for the win. I feel the Jets defense beat us at our own game with their defense disguising coverages and moving on and off the line. I do feel that the field played a factor in the game and one of Brady's greatest strength (the ability to slide in the pocket) was hindered, but the Jets had to play in that same slop.

    As for the Jets being a real threat in the playoff race, they are a real threat to get in, but I don't know if they will be a threat in the playoffs. Yeah, they beat up on two bad teams the last two weeks, but I am not convinced they can beat a playoff team in the playoffs just yet. I did give the Jets credit for their victory against us, but I don't know if they can beat the Pats in Foxboro in the playoffs on the field turf. I also wonder if they can beat any of the top teams in the AFC.

    I think it is too early to be crowning the Jets a Super Bowl contender. They are the flavor of the moment, but they need to string some more wins together to prove to me they are even worth of playoff contention. It wasn't that long ago that the Jets lost to Cleveland and everyone had their season over.
  27. RayClay

    RayClay Rookie

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    #75 Jersey
    Very serious question. Why do you need a rivals opinion if your team is any good? Don't you trust your own opinion?

    I know a lot of people follow the accepted opinion of the day like sheep, but if you start to trust your opinion and test it against results you'll be much better off.

    Personally, I hope your franchise continues to turn two or three picks into one so they can overpay a player like Robertson and I hope your noodle arm quarterback never gains decent arm strength because he is very talented.

    As is your ungrateful traitorous coach who repaid the loyalty and favoritism BB showed him by putting him on the fast track by skipping town to our bitter rival, (of course your teams have sucked too much to really deserve that appellation) after undoubtedly forcing some overtime at Kinko's to copy every playbook and directive he could get his hands on.

    So let's see, a team from New York, in our division, with our former traitorous coach.

    All I can say is I wish you all the playoff success of that other great coach, Tony Dingy.

    And here's hoping you have the type of draft displeasure that has been immortalized on youtube.
  28. PATSNUTme

    PATSNUTme Paranoid Homer Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    OK- that "lucky" play resulted in 7 points. As you recall the Coles catch was good, but Sanders over ran the play resulting in a TD instead of a 20 yard gain.

    In the second game, I'm not making excuses. I'm am citing UNFORCED mistakes on the part of the Patriots which resulted in the JEST victory. And yes, the JEST did not cheat so their victory in the second game was "fair and square".
  29. PatsWickedPissah

    PatsWickedPissah PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #37 Jersey
    You forgot to mention his perfidious tampering with regard to our former WR who-is-dead-to-me.
  30. RayClay

    RayClay Rookie

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    That too. I suppose attempting, (unsuccesfully), to steal half our coaches wasn't taken to well by BB.

    Was the point of this thread for us to say:

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Golly, the Jests are looking really good and Eric's a really good coach.

    If we can't win it, it would be just peachy for the Jets to.

    Maybe we could meet in the playoffs and coach Bill could give him a big wet kiss after the Patriots victory.

    [​IMG]

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