Welcome to PatsFans.com

My new Patriots mock

Discussion in 'Patriots Draft Talk' started by DocE, Apr 6, 2008.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. DocE

    DocE Rookie

    Joined:
    Feb 5, 2008
    Messages:
    513
    Likes Received:
    1
    Ratings:
    +1 / 0 / -0

    I am projecting the Patriots trade no. 7 overall to the Cincinnati Bengals for the no.9 overall and the no.77 overall. The Patriots actually "win" this trade on the draft value chart giving up 1500pts but getting back 1555pts. The reason I believe this trade is realistic is that the drop off between Sedrick Ellis (who the Bengals will take at no.7) and the next available DT is huge. The Saints also want Ellis and pick just one spot below the Bengals at no.10. The Bengals know that if they don't move up for Ellis, the Saints probably will.

    9(from Bengals). Derrick Harvey DE/OLB Florida- There still is nobody on the board of great value for the Patriots at no.9. I can't see them being the first team in the draft to take a corner and I believe they want an impact front 7 guy in the first round. It all depends on whether or not they believe Harvey can play OLB in the 3-4.

    The Patriots trade no. 62 overall and no. 77 overall (from Bengals) to the Broncos for no. 42 overall. Broncos "win" the points by 9, and recoup the pick in the 3rd round that they traded away last year.

    42(from Broncos) Aqib Talib CB Kansas- I think one of 3 CB's will still be on the board at this point: Brandon Flowers, Antoine Cason, or Aqib Talib. I am projecting that Talib will be the one still on the board and the Patriots move up to get the big corner with ball skills.

    69. John Carlson TE Notre Dame- I think TE is a need not a want at this point with both Watson and Thomas coming off injury.

    94. Josh Barrett SS Arizona State- Boom or Bust pick with the size and speed to be a perfect successor to Rodney Harrison in the Pats defense. Great as a JR, benched for awhile as a SR.

    128. Trae Williams CB South Florida- really like this kid, will probably be in every mock I do for the Pats.

    165. Brandon Keith OT Northern Iowa- Huge Right Tackle prospect, he had a sub 5.00 40 at his pro day at over 340lbs

    199. Ben Moffitt ILB South Florida- Maybe a bit small (6'1 234) for the Pats, but he's got better speed than the other ILB's likely to be available.

    239. Kevin Robinson WR/KR Utah State- Need to draft a returner somewhere and Robinson has been really productive. He might be too one dimensional for the Patriots though as the reports I've read question his ability to help at WR.


    Feel free to rip away, just keep in mind the following:

    No players, except Talib, were taken at a spot that was lower than they were projected to go using the sources available to me (draft scout, war room, pfw).

    These are not my favorite players, but players I think could interest the Patriots in terms of value and fit at their specific draft selections.
  2. theKrafty1tar

    theKrafty1tar Rookie

    Joined:
    Dec 8, 2007
    Messages:
    77
    Likes Received:
    1
    Ratings:
    +1 / 0 / -0

    ehh, I like the trades that you project... and the positions that you chose for each pick, but I'm not crazy about the players you picked.

    I don't think Harvey will ever be an OLB, Talib was burned badly in College by Jordy Nelson, who ran a 4.6(?).. and I think we'd go with more of a blocking-style TE in the 3rd- Brad Cottam comes to mind.

    Very good attempt though! I don't think I could come up with a better mock.

    just my .02 cents
  3. Ochmed Jones

    Ochmed Jones Rookie

    Joined:
    Dec 21, 2004
    Messages:
    5,750
    Likes Received:
    9
    Ratings:
    +14 / 2 / -0

    #12 Jersey

    Very nice trades. Well thought out and some very excellent players that fit our scheme.
  4. patchick

    patchick Moderatrix Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2004
    Messages:
    11,484
    Likes Received:
    245
    Ratings:
    +541 / 6 / -0

    Like others, I like the thought that went into it and the overall structure even if I don't agree with some of the players. Personally, Moffitt makes me very queasy from a character perspective. (And come to think of it, from a PR perspective...Patriots drafting the ultimate cheater wouldn't exactly make my day.)
  5. jeffbiologist

    jeffbiologist Rookie

    Joined:
    Dec 17, 2007
    Messages:
    1,433
    Likes Received:
    1
    Ratings:
    +1 / 0 / -0

    Like most responding, I like your effort more than the results. Your ideas are sound, but I think you are making things overly complicated with the trades.
    If its our idea to try and move back up in the 2nd then adjust our trade in the first rd.....If we traded with say Denver(12) we could swap both 1s and 2s. I think Harvey is a boom or bust type, so is Groves. We dont like to take chances in the first rd and like linemen. No DL needs, so our best bet at 12 is likely Albert, hoping to get Avril in the 2nd.
  6. DaBruinz

    DaBruinz Pats, B's, Sox PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2005
    Messages:
    24,059
    Likes Received:
    132
    Ratings:
    +207 / 16 / -38

    #50 Jersey


    Ok.

    I don't feel that Harvey, Carlson, Keith or Moffitt really help the Patriots.

    Harvey is a prototypical 4-3 DE and not a 3-4 OLB.

    Carlson can't really block and the Pats already have 2 pass-catching TEs.

    Keith has questions about his attitude and willingness to WANT to play football.

    Moffitt. Why bother even picking an ILB at all. He's more of a Larry Izzo special teamer than someone who can come in and help the Patriots on regular downs.

    If the draft went like this, then I'd have to say that BB and Pioli were planning on splitting and tanking the team on their way out.
  7. DaBruinz

    DaBruinz Pats, B's, Sox PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2005
    Messages:
    24,059
    Likes Received:
    132
    Ratings:
    +207 / 16 / -38

    #50 Jersey

    Only Barrett and Williams fit the Pats schemes. The others don't. Not even in the most remote sense. OK. maybe in the most absolute REMOTE sense, but not nearly the way you claim.
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2008
  8. wiggins!

    wiggins! Rookie

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2008
    Messages:
    502
    Likes Received:
    1
    Ratings:
    +1 / 0 / -0

    Anyone who wants to work out 2nd rd trades and beyond is ok in my book!

    Harvey at 9 jumps out at me though. 2 things, like others have said, 4-3, not 3-4. Secondly, I think it's a waste of the 9th overall pick to use harvey there. Me personally, I don't think he has value at 9. mid teens, if he were to fit, sure. Not that high though.
  9. dryheat44

    dryheat44 Rookie

    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2004
    Messages:
    6,369
    Likes Received:
    33
    Ratings:
    +78 / 2 / -0

    #75 Jersey

    My favorite pick in this mock is Kevin Robinson. An elite returner (and he is the best returner in the draft) is well worth the seventh-round pick.

    Oh, and Talib at 42 is a steal.
  10. VJCPatriot

    VJCPatriot Rookie

    Joined:
    Apr 28, 2006
    Messages:
    12,344
    Likes Received:
    28
    Ratings:
    +46 / 1 / -4

    Now... tell us how you REALLY feel!! :)
  11. DocE

    DocE Rookie

    Joined:
    Feb 5, 2008
    Messages:
    513
    Likes Received:
    1
    Ratings:
    +1 / 0 / -0


    Harvey was said to have an amazing positional workout at OLB at his Pro Day in Gainsville. I personally have my doubts about him as an OLB as well. I did put the caveat in that he'd only be the Pats pick there if they believed he'd fit at OLB.

    Carlson is the most polished TE in the draft. The Patriots have a long history under Belichick of drafting Notre Dame players. If the Patriots feel like they need a TE to come in and start, Carlson could very well be the pick. There is not a dominant blocking TE in the mold of Kyle Brady in this draft.

    As for Keith, do your research on the big men. If you are picking a guy who is absolutely massive, there are almost always questions about his desire. I realize Keith quick the OU program twice, but he's also 6'5 340lbs and ran a sub 5 40 yard dash and put up over 30 reps on the bench. I am picking the guy with a very late 5th round draft pick. The reward far out weighs the risk at that point in the draft.

    If Moffitt becomes Larry Izzo, then he's a great late 6th round pick. He fits the scheme as well as Bruschi does as an ILB. Anyone taken this late in the draft will have to make there mark on special teams to even make the roster. If you are expecting a late 6th round pick to come in and help the Patriots on "regular downs", I think you'll be disappointed.
  12. DaBruinz

    DaBruinz Pats, B's, Sox PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2005
    Messages:
    24,059
    Likes Received:
    132
    Ratings:
    +207 / 16 / -38

    #50 Jersey

    Carson is a lousy blocker and hardly the "most polished" in the draft. He's got good route running skills and that's the only thing that is polished about his game.

    I did my homework on Keith. Its why I believe he's a horrible fit for the Pats. A sub 5 40 doesn't mean JACK for lineman. What makes a difference is their agility scores. His 3 cone and shuttle scores are amongst the worst for O-linemen.

    He's not mobile and he's not a great blocker. That rules him out of the Pats Zone blocking scheme.


    BS Moffitt fits the scheme as well as Bruschi does. What the hell are you smoking? Did you steal Rickey's ganja or something?

    Fact is that your draft missed the boat in my opinion. You didn't do a damn thing to address the ILB position and you wasted picks on areas where the Pats are strong.
  13. DocE

    DocE Rookie

    Joined:
    Feb 5, 2008
    Messages:
    513
    Likes Received:
    1
    Ratings:
    +1 / 0 / -0

    Carlson is far from a "lousy blocker" and he is the most polished TE in this class. He's started a ton of games for Notre Dame and has been considered the no.1 TE in this class since before last years draft. He's started a ton of games and is the most ready guy to come in and start for the Patriots. If it's not Carlson, who is that guy? Certainly not Cottam if you need a TE to come in and start right away with his injury history. Certainly not Fred Davis with his issues and lack of blocking skills. Want Dustin Keller? Trade up in the 2nd round to get him. If (and I stress IF) the Patriots have to get a starting TE out of this draft due to injuries to Watson and Thomas, then Carlson is the safest choice. Not the most upside, not the most explosive, simply the safest.

    Your Keith opinions on his 3 cone and shuttle scores as it relates to the Patriots are simply wrong as well.

    Pats Draft pick Ryan O'Callaghan (5th round) 20 yd shuttle 4.83 3 cone 7.97

    Brandon Keith (my projected 5th round pick) 20 yd shuttle 4.84, 3 cone 7.91

    Looks like those numbers would not be a detriment to Keith being drafted by the Pats. Keith also broad jumped a full foot further than O'Callaghan.

    Bruschi is currently listed as 6'1 247 and is in his 12th year in the league. As a rookie, Moffitt would come in at about 6'1 234. I think it's very realistic to say that he fits the scheme size wise as well as Bruschi does. Oscar Lua was 6'1 236 last year and ran a 4.81 forty...and he was drafted by the Patriots.

    I think it's ridculous that you jump on a late 6th round pick like you have, but whatever.

    I "wasted" picks in areas where the Pats are strong? This team had ONE draft pick make it all the way through the season with the team last year. I picked an OLB, 2 CB's, a SS, an OT, a TE, an ILB, and return specialist/WR. Which one of those areas would the Patriots not look at?

    The Pats took 3 Olineman last year, none of them panned out. Lua didn't pan out neither did the RB Hairston (btw was RB a need with Maroney, Morris, and Faulk on the roster?). Did the braintrust tank the draft on purpose?

    It's fine to have strong opinions, but you look ridiculous in the way you go about sharing them.
  14. dryheat44

    dryheat44 Rookie

    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2004
    Messages:
    6,369
    Likes Received:
    33
    Ratings:
    +78 / 2 / -0

    #75 Jersey

    Is this a fact, or Urban legend? In the last six drafts, there's been two -- Dan Stevenson, and Mike Richardson. That's the same number that's been from Texas A&M, Illinois, Cal, Baylor, Fresno St, USC, and fewer than Florida and Miami. If you said that Belichick had a long history of drafting Baylor or Illinois players, people would probably look at you funny.

    He had two busts with the Patriots in his first draft (Jabari Holloway and Brock Williams), but that's hardly relevant now.
  15. cstjohn17

    cstjohn17 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2006
    Messages:
    5,026
    Likes Received:
    20
    Ratings:
    +32 / 11 / -4

    #54 Jersey

    I like it, good draft.

    If I were to nitpick I would take another TE instead of Carlson (Stevens from Cal or Davis USC) and think Moffitt is a little light, but the kid can make plays so for a 6th rounder beggars can't be choosers.
  16. cstjohn17

    cstjohn17 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2006
    Messages:
    5,026
    Likes Received:
    20
    Ratings:
    +32 / 11 / -4

    #54 Jersey

    The quote in bold pretty much assures that it is a good draft.
  17. DocE

    DocE Rookie

    Joined:
    Feb 5, 2008
    Messages:
    513
    Likes Received:
    1
    Ratings:
    +1 / 0 / -0

    There have actually been 3 Notre Dame picks (missed David Givens) in his last 6 drafts, and 5 in his 7 drafts. I still agree with your point though, it seemed to me that they had picked more than 5 Notre Dame guys in the Belichick era.

    Would you agree that the Patriots tend to prefer players from traditional power schools (Miami, Notre Dame, Florida, USC, LSU)?

    One interesting thing I noted when looking up the draft history the past 7 years is this: In 6 of 7 drafts we have drafted teammates (2 from Fresno State, 2 from Texas A&M, 2 from Notre Dame, 2 from Florida State, 2 from Miami, and 2 from LSU). Obviously this means very little (probably means nothing actually), but it's interesting.
  18. DW Toys

    DW Toys Rookie

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2007
    Messages:
    2,832
    Likes Received:
    5
    Ratings:
    +11 / 1 / -2

    Good job. I like your pics but have to agree with some others on a few choices. I would like to modify your list some and I am in favor of trades. These below make sense to all.

    I have the Pats trading #7 to the Falcons for the Falcons #34, #37 in round 2 and #103 in round 4.The rating numbers are almost a perfect match. It allows the Falcons to get their QB in Ryan at #3 but still get a most desired need in an OT like Clady at #7 or maybe even DT Sedrick Ellis which would be a huge day for Atlanta, and they still have #48 in round two, their own third and a third round comp pic. Blanks wants Ryan (don't they need a QB and from all accounts next years draft class will be QB poor?) and the new coaching staff want some DL or OL help. They need a CB too. This should work for them. They still can get maybe a OT Carl Nix, or a DT, or TE in round 2 or a CB like Tracy Porter in round 3.

    I think that Rivers will drop some after a poor Wonderlick (yes, I know...Vince Young). In my draft I think the Pats do LB Rivers at #34 if he gets though the Giants (or Packers?). I am thinking CB Cason at #37.

    Now the Intrigue. I think the Pats have one of the standing offers on CB Lito Sheppard from the Eagles (Adam S. of the NFL Network says there are six offers) for maybe one of our third rounders. I think the Eagles want more. Now that we have three second rounders why not send #62 for Sheppard? Our CB problem is now decent with Bryant, Cason drafted at #37 and Sheppard. We will be in better shape than last year at CB.

    I would go with your others except at the #103 which we get from Atlanta. I would see if I could pry ILB Bobby Carpenter from the Cowboys for #103 which is close enough to the third rounder they are looking for to move him. He starts eventually for Teddy.

    At #165 I like OL Jeremey Zuttah from Rutgers because he can play all five positions on the OL and has even caught some passes at Rutgers on the tackle eligible. He is athletic with a sub 5.0 40. He is very intelligent as the way BB prefers and could be a young upgrade to Hochstein to start his career if everyone remembers the SB disaster. Hochsteins' value is OG and C and Zuttah is considered a great prospect at both, but Rutgers is still considered a small school. But he can play many positions and BB likes diverse.

    69. John Carlson TE Notre Dame-yes

    94. Josh Barrett SS Arizona State-yes

    128. Trae Williams CB South Florida-yes (Alternate if we get Sheppard- Cory Byrd RB South Carolina. Morris is in his 30's, as is Falk. Byrd is the best RB receiver out of the backfield in the draft and at 6' 1" and 214 , with good speed at slightly under 4.5, he can run a bit too. This gets us help in both areas. He is moving up on the boards and was a sixth rounder. He's now rated mid 4th round.)

    165. Brandon Keith OT Northern Iowa (Alternate-J. Zuttah OL Rutgers?)

    199. Ben Moffitt ILB South Florida-yes (Alternate-J Lehman ILB Ill.)

    239. Kevin Robinson WR/KR Utah State-yes (Alternate-Dexter Jackson WR App. St.)

    DW Toys
  19. FreeTedWilliams

    FreeTedWilliams pfadmins PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2005
    Messages:
    5,281
    Likes Received:
    35
    Ratings:
    +85 / 31 / -3

    #75 Jersey

    I would like the Pats to take a shot at Moffit, he is from the "Wilfork" mols as far as the Pats are concerned. Already married with kids, (nothing keeps you grounded like a wife and kids). He actually used to commute a few hours a day to school and practice. He is cleary someone that football "is important to".
  20. patchick

    patchick Moderatrix Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2004
    Messages:
    11,484
    Likes Received:
    245
    Ratings:
    +541 / 6 / -0

    Unfortunately, that image of Moffitt blew up a couple of months back. It's hard to know the full facts, but it appears that he left his wife and kids during the past season (but let the school keep promoting the wholesome image), and his wife claimed that she had essentially done all of his schoolwork throughout college.
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page

unset ($sidebar_block_show); ?>