My Blueprint for the Defense

[mayoclinic]

Yes it is out of the question. There is 0 chance they'll make Hightower add 30 lbs and play DL.

I meant not out of the question that he could handle it. Not that the team would do it.

 

[stelfans]

I don't know why so many people want to so drastically change everything about Hightower. The guy hasn't had a bad game since the entire defensive debacle against the Texans last year. He's probably the only guy who can say he's played all 8 of those games without sucking it up in at least one of them. Let him keep doing what he's doing. It's working.

I dont want to change anything. It was an idea thrown out there that i found intriguing.
I completely agree that what he's doing right now is working and its something all of us wanted him to do, so keep doing it.

 

[captain stone]

I think Hightower is about as big as he gets already. His combination of size and explosiveness is going to be special this year.

I don't know if anything about Hightower is special, but I do agree that he doesn't need to add much more, if any, weight in order to play an effective 4-3 DE/3-4 OLB.

 

[mayoclinic]

Andy Johnson's summary of film analysis of the base defense from last week:

We are using 43 personnel. The weak DE plays a 5 tech and the strong DE plays a 7. The strong DT moves out to a 5 and the weak DT moves down to NT.
The LBs shift the other direction, so the LLB moves in over the G the MLB moves over the other G and the RLB moves to a 7 tech.
It is simply an overshifted 43.
It is done so the weakside DE can be effective as a pass rusher, at the expense of some beef in the run D.
Its our defense.
Easley will play the 5 tech mostly but lets not forget you can shift the DL and LBs many ways.
What we are discussing is the vanilla version of the base defense, which we used just 21 snaps last week.

We are using a 34 in a way that I believe no one ever has.
To me Hightower is the key. He looms as a dangerous pass rusher coming from the weakside on the same side as either Jones or Nink. And he does not have to be the 5th rusher to do so, meaning you can play all kinds of coverage from that.
This is really important IMO, because over the years our 1st down defense has been much stouter vs the run than the pass, and very susceptible to play action.

http://www.patsfans.com/new-england-patriots/messageboard/threads/discuss-the-defense.1112042/page-6

As for the sub defense:

I'm also very intrigued by the inside blitz possibilities in sub.
Mayo is a tremendous inside blitzer, we have just never used him much that way.
Collins seems to be as well.

My instinct is that in nickel Hightower will move back and forth between DE and LB with Nink and Collins correspondingly splitting the reps, and Jones getting a break now and then too.
Having a front of HT, Easley, Chris J, Jones with Mayo and Collins at LB in the 42 nickel AND having Revis on one side, with Browner jamming the WR on the other (with McCourty over the top) should make our ability to blitz and bring pressure better than I can ever remember.

When you look from the nickel perspective its really exciting to see what the plan may be.

I think it's a huge mistake to try and simplify things to simply "3-4" or "4-3". Regardless of how many men are on the line or what the exact spacing is, we are seeing some really creative and innovative stuff. It should only get better as the players get more comfortable and the coaches get more confidence that they can execute the schemes.

 

[mayoclinic]

We don't have any 6'-4"+, 290#+ DLmen on this team to effectively run a 3-4 defense. Bill had one,
but he released him before even the final cut-down. 4-3 is the way to go, including Hightower as a
DE in a rotation with Chandler J & Ninko.

See the above analysis by Andy. It's a very different defense than a traditional 3-4, one that uses 4-3 personnel with 3-4 spacing and alternatives one of the 5-Tech and OLBs.

The current "base" in this scheme would ideally be:

- Wilfork at NT and Easley at one 5-Tech with Sealver Siliga and Chris Jones backing them up
- Hightower at one OLB position
- Chandler Jones and Ninkovich swapping between the other 5-Tech and OLB positions
- Mayo and Collins as the LBs

There would be a variety of sub packages, based on scheme-specific game planning.

It's still early, but if this is indeed the way the defense is headed, then I wouldn't look to them drafting a tradition 300+# 5-Tech; that would take away some of the ability to generate pressure. Rather, I would see them drafting a very athletic player who can stand up and play the 5-Tech. The guys who seem the most interesting to me in this regard are Shawn Oakman, Dante Flowers, Bronson Kaufusi, and Arik Armstead. A big NT could be in the mix if Wilfork shows signs of fading, since this line is lightish on the ends and needs a really strong guy in the middle who can 2-gap. Danny Shelton, Ellis McCarthy, Carl Davis, Chris Carter, Jordan Phillips and Terry Williams could all be interesting NT options.

 

[Off The Grid]

Easy, Lads.

Mad Bill makes plenty of Mistakes ~ he is mortal, after all ~ but one of the wisest Things he does is to treat September as an Extension of Camp. He's still evaluating the Lads, you see.

September Games are best looked upon by us not as Gauges but as Entertainment.

Ahhhh...The Timeless Wisdom of Off The Grid.

How much Difference one Week can make!!

Mad Bill Strikes Again!!

 

[manxman2601]

For that more athletic guy that can play both a 5-tech and stand up and can play the run well, I wouldn't look much further than UCLA's Odighizuwa. It's a perfect role for him.

 

[manxman2601]

Ahhhh...The Timeless Wisdom of Off The Grid.

How much Difference one Week can make!!

Mad Bill Strikes Again!!

The wonders of patience and under-reacting.

 

[mayoclinic]

For that more athletic guy that can play both a 5-tech and stand up and can play the run well, I wouldn't look much further than UCLA's Odighizuwa. It's a perfect role for him.

But does he have the athleticism to play 3-4 OLB? I haven't watched him yet, but I'll be curious to take a look.

 

[mayoclinic]

Ahhhh...The Timeless Wisdom of Off The Grid.

How much Difference one Week can make!!

Mad Bill Strikes Again!!

Thank God for your mild-mannered restraint. A voice of reason in the wilderness.

 

[mayoclinic]

On a different theme which has been discussed on the main board, Nate Ebner played 13 or 14 snaps in the dime against Minnesota, and the dime was very effective. BB was unusually effusive about Ebner:

In addition to playing 20 of 28 special teams snaps, Ebner – the former MVP of the US junior rugby squad – saw action in 14 of 66 defensive snaps playing free safety. Is that a sign of growing confidence and growth in the 25-year-old Ebner?

“I’€™d say it’€™s yes on both accounts,” Belichick said Tuesday, before beaming about Ebner’s development. “We certainly have a lot of confidence in Nate. We’€™ve seen Nate grow and improve. I would probably put him in the, not the all-time top, but maybe in the top five percent all-time of players that I’€™ve coached from where they were in college to how they grew in the NFL. Nate had almost no defensive experience at Ohio State. He’€™s adapted in a relatively short amount of time€“ going into his third year so it’€™s really two-plus years ‘€“ adapted very well to the knowledge of our defense, to the understanding of opponents’€™ offenses, to instinctiveness and reading and recognition at a position that he plays right in the middle of the field, which is among the most difficult, inside linebacker and safety where the volume and the number of things that can happen are the greatest, where you have to really see everybody on the field, all 11 guys. His development has really been outstanding.

“Nate has, I’€™d say, far exceeded our expectations defensively based on what he had coming out of college. Players like Steve Neal, with zero experience, [Matt] Cassel, very little playing experience at Southern Cal, guys like that, Nate, very little defensive experience at Ohio State, for those guys to become the type of players that ‘€“ I’€™m not putting him in that class yet, but I’€™m saying the evolution and development for guys like that is pretty significant relative to a lot of other players who have just had a lot more opportunity than guys like that have.”

http://itiswhatitis.weei.com/sports...ld-expect-to-see-more-and-more-of-nate-ebner/

It's a long shot, but the 6' 210# Ebner certainly has the raw physical tools and athleticism (4.53 40, 6.59 3C, 39" VJ, 10'8" BJ) to excel as a safety. Better measurables than what Kenny Vaccaro had in 2013. It's a long shot, but if Ebner can seize a role in the defense it could be a real bonus. Some possibilities:

1. Continue as the dime DB.
2. Play a "star" LB/S role in big nickel packages.
3. Become an every day starter.

#3 is a long shot, but the first 2 aren't that unrealistic. Definitely a story line to watch this year.

 

[stelfans]

For that more athletic guy that can play both a 5-tech and stand up and can play the run well, I wouldn't look much further than UCLA's Odighizuwa. It's a perfect role for him.

I watched the video at draftbreakdown and i was impressed by his strenght. Not sure he can play in space like Jones but he sure wasnt slow. Will watch more.

 

[mayoclinic]

I watched the video at draftbreakdown and i was impressed by his strenght. Not sure he can play in space like Jones but he sure wasnt slow. Will watch more.

I still haven't watched that film, but one of the reasons I like Arik Armstead is that I think he does have the athleticism and speed to stand up on occasion. Armstead has been playing the role that Taylor Hart (6'6" 281#) played last year, and Oregon did use Hart standing up at times, as well as at DE, DT and NT. That kind of versatility should appeal to BB. Armstead's basketball background should also help in terms of playing in space on occasion.

 

[captain stone]

Is Arik's brother's heart condition congenital? Before I would commit to another Armstead, I'd want
to know the answer to that question.

 

[manxman2601]

I watched the video at draftbreakdown and i was impressed by his strenght. Not sure he can play in space like Jones but he sure wasnt slow. Will watch more.

I still haven't watched that film, but one of the reasons I like Arik Armstead is that I think he does have the athleticism and speed to stand up on occasion. Armstead has been playing the role that Taylor Hart (6'6" 281#) played last year, and Oregon did use Hart standing up at times, as well as at DE, DT and NT. That kind of versatility should appeal to BB. Armstead's basketball background should also help in terms of playing in space on occasion.

He looks to have Chandler Jones' level of athleticism. I think athleticism in a 3-4, particularly in this specific role, is a little overrated anyway - they only need enough to drop into a zone coverage every now and then anyway. After all, how many times has Chandler Jones dropped into coverage in the last two games? If it's more than ten I'd be amazed.

 

[captain stone]

See the above analysis by Andy. It's a very different defense than a traditional 3-4, one that uses 4-3 personnel with 3-4 spacing and alternatives one of the 5-Tech and OLBs.

The current "base" in this scheme would ideally be:

- Wilfork at NT and Easley at one 5-Tech with Sealver Siliga and Chris Jones backing them up
- Hightower at one OLB position
- Chandler Jones and Ninkovich swapping between the other 5-Tech and OLB positions
- Mayo and Collins as the LBs

There would be a variety of sub packages, based on scheme-specific game planning.

It's still early, but if this is indeed the way the defense is headed, then I wouldn't look to them drafting a tradition 300+# 5-Tech; that would take away some of the ability to generate pressure. Rather, I would see them drafting a very athletic player who can stand up and play the 5-Tech. The guys who seem the most interesting to me in this regard are Shawn Oakman, Dante Flowers, Bronson Kaufusi, and Arik Armstead. A big NT could be in the mix if Wilfork shows signs of fading, since this line is lightish on the ends and needs a really strong guy in the middle who can 2-gap. Danny Shelton, Ellis McCarthy, Carl Davis, Chris Carter, Jordan Phillips and Terry Williams could all be interesting NT options.

Of the teams that have/run 3-4s, is there anything comparable with what Bill is trying to do
here, or is this multi-front, ever-changing-technique defense somewhat of a trailblazer?

 

[manxman2601]

I hate his thesaurus-laden writing style but Oliver Thomas has an excellent breakdown of the defensive formations with a Chandler Jones emphasis.

http://www.nepatriotsdraft.com/2014...ts-pass-rusher-chandler-jones-vs-vikings.html

n the 3-4, that made him an outside linebacker for five snaps and a five-technique defensive end for five more. In the 3-3, it made him a three-technique defensive tackle for one snap and a seven-technique defensive end for two. In the 3-2, it made him a five- to seven-technique for a combined 11 snaps. And between the 4-3 and 4-2 fronts, it made him a prototypical seven- to nine-technique end for a net of 37 snaps.

 

[manxman2601]

I hate his thesaurus-laden writing style but Oliver Thomas has an excellent breakdown of the defensive formations with a Chandler Jones emphasis.

http://www.nepatriotsdraft.com/2014...ts-pass-rusher-chandler-jones-vs-vikings.html

So according to this analysis, Chandler Jones played OLB for five snaps out of 61, the difference is that he plays the seven/nine-tech a lot more from a two point stance.

 

[mayoclinic]

Of the teams that have/run 3-4s, is there anything comparable with what Bill is trying to do here, or is this multi-front, ever-changing-technique defense somewhat of a trailblazer?

Lots of teams run multi-front hybrid defenses. We've talked about some of them in this thread - Seattle, Ray Horton (now with Tennessee). The Ryan brothers have done it to some extent. The Pats have run a multi-front hybrid for several years, though it's been labelled a 3-4 at times and a 4-3 at other times. But I've never seen a team do what the Pats are currently doing, in terms of running a 3-4 base with 4-3 personnel and flip-flopping 2 players between OLB and 5-tech. Andy Johnson mentioned in another thread that he can't recall seeing anything quite like this, either. If you look at BradyFTW!'s play breakdowns on the thread on the main board you can see that the distinction between 3-4 and 4-3 becomes extremely fuzzy at times. As far as I can tell, the main driving forces are (1) getting as many of your best players on the field as possible, (2) balancing run-stopping capability with pass rush and disruptive capability, and (3) flexibility, disguise, and creating confusion. It's very innovative and creative stuff. We'll see how effective it is as things play out.

 

[mayoclinic]

Is Arik's brother's heart condition congenital? Before I would commit to another Armstead, I'd want to know the answer to that question.

My understanding is that Armond Armstead had no personal or family history of heart disease, and that his original heart attack resulted from high dose administration of toradol (a non-steroidal anti-inflammatory drug) by USC trainers/team personnel.