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My Best Crack at 53-Man Roster and Depth Chart

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by TaxPlaya, May 12, 2006.

  1. TaxPlaya

    TaxPlaya On the Roster

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    The PatsFans.com messageboard has been quite optimistic (though this is the silly season). However, I think that this may very well be the deepest Pats team of my lifetime, and maybe the deepest team in the NFL across the board. I’m assuming a bit in post-June 1 free agency here, but I think I’m pretty spot on:



    QB: A-minus



    1. Usurper. Best clutch QB in the league

    2. Veteran backup (Flutie or someone else)

    3. Cassell. Had a breakout game against Miami last year



    RB: B-plus with potential for A-minus



    1. Dillon. Training hard and bouncing back

    2. Maroney. Shanahan said he will be the best running back in the league, and Manning said, “you stole our back.â€

    3. Faulk. One of the best 3rd down running backs in football

    4. Pass. Terrific FB/receiver

    5. Mills. College TE will be an H-back here. Most catches of any TE in college history



    TE: A-minus



    1. Graham. Best blocking TE in the league

    2. Watson. Finally broke out last year as a monster receiving TE.

    3. Thomas. 3rd rounder considered 2nd-best TE in the draft (think Fauria)



    WR: B-plus



    1. Branch. Pro Bowler

    2. Johnson. Speed burner

    3. Jackson. Best WR in draft

    4. Caldwell. Good possession 3rd receiver

    5. Brown: Wily veteran



    O-line: A-minus



    1. LT Matt Light: solid guy

    2. LG Logan Mankins: rough dude

    3. C: Dan Koppen: solid guy

    4. RG: Stephen Neal: rough dude former wrestler

    5: RT: Nick Kazcur: filled in at LT last year admirably

    6. Backup tackle/guard: Ryan O’Callahan—big fat 5th rounder

    7. Backup tackle/guard: Brandon Gorin: former RT

    8. Backup guard: Mruckowski/Hochstein: embarrassment of riches—either would be great

    9. Lonnie Paxton: long snapper and backup guard/center



    Kicker: B-minus with potential for D



    1. Gramatica or the new kid. Big dropoff



    Overall offense: A-minus. Put the choke ahtist in there and there would be A+ potential. Damned shame.





    D-line: A+



    1. DE Seymour: best d-lineman in the league

    2. NT: Wilfork: excellent, excellent NT

    3. DE: Warren: excellent

    4. DE: Jarvis Green: could be a starter

    5. DE: Marquise Hill: former 2nd rounder—project

    6. NT: Dan Kleko or LeCharles Smith: old project vs. new project



    Linebackers: B+



    1. OLB: Rosy Colvin: former Pro Bowler, finally came back from hip injury

    2. OLB: Mike Vrabel: Pro-Bowl caliber

    3. ILB: Tedy Bruschi: Pro-Bowl caliber

    4. ILB: Monty Beisel: struggled early last year, stabilized toward the end

    5. OLB: Tully Banta-Cain: former project

    6. ILB: Ryan Claridge: 3rd rounder hurt last year

    7. Larry Izzo: special teamer and ILB

    8. One of the bodies: Alexander, Mincey, Gardner, Lloyd, Davis



    Defensive Backs: B+



    1. CB: Hobbs—rookie sensation

    2. CB: Samuel—solid pro

    3. Nickel: Warfield (former KC starter)

    4. Dime: Gay—solid pro

    5. Backup dime: Chad Scott

    6. Backup dime: Hank Poteat

    7. SS: Harrison—Pro Bowler if he is healthy

    8. FS: Wilson—solid Pro

    9. Backup SS: Tebucky Jones (former starter)

    10. Backup FS: Guss Scott (hurt as a rookie)

    11: Backup backup S: Artrell Hawkins

    12. Backup backup S: James Sanders



    Punter: A-minus



    1. Josh Miller: solid punter, won’t screw up



    Overall Defense: B plus with potential for A-minus depending on health and younger guys’ development
     
  2. Handel

    Handel Third String But Playing on Special Teams

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    Thomas was not the 2nd best TE in the draft. Jackson was not the best.
     
  3. Remix 6

    Remix 6 Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal

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    Thomas wasnt a top 3 TE but Jackson was #1 WR according to many..it was between him and Holmes.
     
  4. captain stone

    captain stone Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal

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    No Jersey Selected

    Not so fast, my friend...


    First, I apologize for copying the entire post; I do not know how to copy portions of posts.

    Second, I disagree with your higher-than-deserved grades for the WRs, OL and LBs.

    Expecting significant contributions from Bethel and Reche is unrealistic; neither has done it before, why should it start now?

    While grading the OL, you made the mistake of including The Human Turnstile, Brandon Gorin. If this bum is even on the 53 in September, then the OL has not improved as much as it needs to. I also would never refer to Mruc and Hochstein as an embarrassment of riches, especially the former. Oh, and by the way, Paxton has never been, and will never be, a backup guard or center.

    Having Beisel and TBC as your 4/5 LBs should scare you. We need 2 or more of Alexander, Claridge, Mincey, Roach, etc. to step up and prove that they belong on a championship-caliber roster.

    Otherwise, you are, as you say, pretty spot on.
     
  5. bishbash

    bishbash On the Game Day Roster

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    Step 1: Click on the quote button
    Step 2: Use your mouse to highlight any parts of quote you don't want to show up
    Step 3: Hit the delete button
    Step 4: Repeat until only the part you want to show up remains
    Step 5: Make sure you did not delete the first part that is between and including the brackets (example: [QUOTE = captain stone]) or the last part between and including the brackets (example: [ /QUOTE ]).
    That's it.
     
    Last edited: May 12, 2006
  6. JoeSixPat

    JoeSixPat Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal

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    I'm just amazed that so many people are penciling in Bethel as our #2 WR (there was another thread about this)

    Did I pull a Rip Van Winkle and sleep through a season where he was the least bit relevant?

    I don't get it.
     
  7. PatsWorldChamps

    PatsWorldChamps Rotational Player and Threatening Starter's Job

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    i like bethel, but i dont see him making the cut this year, unless there are injuries
     
  8. mgteich

    mgteich PatsFans.com Veteran PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Welcome to the board. You will find hundreds of discussions of various aspects of the roster over the next few months. Your first effort was interesting and one point in many areas. You overestimate in many areas, If our running backs were really B+, our WR B+ and our OL A-!!

    See below for some specific comments.

    SPECIALISTS (3)
    Kicker, punter, deep snapper.
    We used a #4 for the new guy; he'll stay
    ----------------------------
    OFFENSE (24)
    I reduced your offensive roster by one because we will surely keep Lonnie, who does not backup at OL at all.

    QUARTERBACKS (3) We have the best quarteback in football an clear "A"

    RUNNING BACKS (4)
    We usually keep four, not five. Pass is NOT a terrific fullback, and not a great pass catcher. Mills is much better, and is the replacement for Pass.

    TIGHT ENDS (3)
    There was a Fauria/Graham, another Colorado TE who arguably was the #3 or so TE. We didn't draft early enough to get him. We drafted the #7 TE by many counts, but a solid TE at that. This draft was very deep at this position.

    WIDE RECEIVER (5)
    Troy Brown is still our 3rd down receiver and a top slot receiver
    If Bethel Johnson had a ghost of a chance to be our #2 receiver, then maybe we could be a B+. As it is Bethel is fighting for the 5th WR/Returner spot with Childress. I think Bethel will win, because of his defensive special teams play.

    OFFENSIVE LINE (9)
    I agree with nine. We have had many injuries, and we now prefer to develop players on the squad. Besides Light and Koppen are coming back from injuries. Gorin isn't much of a guard. He is likely to be our gameday backup at both tackles. Hochstein is the backup center. Mruc isn't close. Hochstein is the backup C/G, although it is jsut possible that Tucker could beat him out (not likely). The last spot could be the developmental spot for Stevenson. More likely is that he will be on the PS, and Mruc, Yates and Tucker will fight it out for the spot.
    -------------------------------------------------------------------
    DEFENSE AND DEFENSIVE SPECIAL TEAMS (26)
    We only NEED 20 defensive players: 6 DL's, 7 LB's, 4 CB's and 3 S's. Most of the rest are primarily special team players, some starters at important special team positions. They aren't just a #9 LB. We also occasionally care a defensive project or two.

    DEFENSIVE LINE (6)
    We need a backup NT. For now, that man is Wright. No one seems any better.

    LINEBACKERS (7) This group is a long way from a B+
    Your list is fine, except for Izzo and Davis who much make it as Ster's. Mincey should be the favorite for the #7 spot.

    CORNERS (4)
    Hobbs, Samuel, Gay and Warfield are all we need. Our backup S (Hawkins) is a corner. Sanders was our nickel last year, and can also be the dime. Chad Scott and Poteat are gone, unless they beat out Warfield.

    SAFETY (3)
    I have Harrison starting on the PUP list with Wilson, Hawkins as our starters, and Sanders again as the backup. Tebucky was brought back to be our gunner and special team ace. He could also be a safety in an emergency.

    SPECIAL TEAMERS (6)
    Jones, Guss Scott, Izzo, Pass
    are a good list. You had them all making the team. I tend to agree. I would add Mitchell and Don Davis.

    BOTTOM LINE
    I have 50 in common with you, cutting Chad Scott, Poteat, and Klecko/Smith, and adding Wright, Mitchell and Don Davis. Of course, in many cases you listed more than one option.

    MY NUMBER 54
    My 54 would be Smith, the DE as a project, as a developmental DE. Any injury could make room, and I have a gut feeling Guss Scott isn't going to ever stay on the field.






     
  9. rookBoston

    rookBoston 2nd Team Getting Their First Start

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    #12 Jersey

    Claridge was a 5th rounder, the compensatory pick we got for Ted Washington.

    I agree that Bethel is an even odds proposition to make the 53-man and will NOT repeat NOT be the #2 receiver, barring catastrophic injuries. He'll me lucky to make the team. In fact, I think Childress has the clear edge over him coming into camp.

    Hochstein is a lock. The name of the game is versatility.

    I think Stevenson will battle with Mruczkowski for a OG spot on the roster. I think BB will carry 10, if you include Paxton.

    Wright will have the edge over Klecko. It will be Wright or Smith as backup NT.

    Mincey is a lock. Have you seen the film?

    Dont see the roster holding Warfield, Scott and Poteat. In fact, I think there's a chance that two of the three get cut. Poteat is likely to go back to the shadow roster, again this year.

    In taking a CB off the roster, I'd add Mel Mitchell back in. Why? Certainly, not to play S. He'll make the team to replace Stone on ST coverage.

    My list:

    QB Brady, UFA, Cassel
    RB Dillon, Moroney, Faulk, Pass, Mills
    WR Branch, Caldwell, Brown, Jackson, Childress
    TE Graham, Watson, Thomas
    OT Light, Kaczur, Gorin, O'Callaghan
    OG Mankins, Neal, Stevenson
    OC Koppen, Hochstein

    NT Wilfork, Smith
    DE Seymour, Warren, Green, Hill
    OLB Vrabel, Colvin, TBC, Mincey
    ILB Bruschi, Beisel, Claridge, Izzo
    CB Samuel, Hobbs, Gay, Scott
    S Harrison, Wilson, Hawkins, Sanders, Jones, Mitchell, Scott

    ST Gostkowski, Miller, Paxton
     
  10. mgteich

    mgteich PatsFans.com Veteran PatsFans.com Supporter

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    As always, an excellent analysis. I could accept this roster in a sec.

    ISSUES, ROSTER FIGHTS, COMMENTS (I'm OK with either choice on all)
    1) Childress or Bethel Johnson or a free agent or a trade
    Bethel Johnson is an excellent defensive Ster, but time could gone.
    2) Stevenson or Tucker
    3) Hochstein is definitely a lock; we should extend him, the price depending on Koppen's availability (injurywise and contractwise).
    3) Smith or Wright; is Smith really a NT?
    4) Scott or Warfield or Ty Law
    5) We don't need a 7th DL if Smith is ready to backup at NT AND Hill is ready to contribute.
    6) Will Harrison make the 53; or be on PUP, making room for Don Davis or a 7th DL.
    7) This is the month to believe that the first 10 draft choices will make the 53. I suspect at least one of the 10 will be on the Practice Squad.

     
    Last edited: May 13, 2006
  11. PatsFanInVa

    PatsFanInVa PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Nope. I'm calling you out on the Brady count, and a backup is a backup unless he really reeks.

    QB: A (A+ if we had a real real stud backup. But I cannot justify the minus here.)

    RB: B-, with A potential. A lot depends on Dillon's health, and Maroney's capability at the pro level. The "B-" is if we get back Dillon, plus minor improvement based on health. It's the "worst case scenario." The "A" scenario is Dillon all the way back to 04 form, or Maroney breaking out.

    I call this group a solid "A," but will take the B-plus on the premise that the Pats don't use the tight end in "A" (for Antonio) fashion. Still, if that's where BB goes with this position, your A grade can happen. This group will do whatever is asked of them, and what is asked of them is the only limit on what we will see.

    WR: C, B+ potential

    And the "+" is because Brady can make an average receiver look good.

    Branch is a one-time SB MVP. I like him a lot, but he's really shown his stuff a grand total of one season. There is such a thing as drop-off, and I can't call him a solid "anchor" like everyone here seems to. I think that's what he is but I am not as certain of it. He has trouble with double/triple teams.

    Bethel, as I've said, last ran a decent route when he was delivering papers. I hope he catches on but he is on the bubble.

    Gator-Aid was indeed the best WR in this draft, but a rookie nonetheless. For every Anquan Boldin, there are five guys who don't "get it" until their third season.

    Caldwell, I have high hopes for as a consistency guy, and he's shown a certain level of ability. He could step it up this year, and be a more significant contributor than he was in SD. No guarantee.

    Brown - what's not to love? Except he's at the tail end of his production, sadly. (He's given a lot to retire a Patriot, by the way, and I personally will always love him for that.)

    O-line: B-
    Owing to injuries, the Pats have a lot of guys who now have NFL starting experience, which is good. But come on. You give guys like KC and Denver the "A"s in this categories. Our guys are young, and sometimes play young. But oh my, if O'Callaghan has any work ethic and quickness... we might be going somewhere very nice with this group in the next few years.

    Nope. B with a potential for A+. Gostkowski apparently hits long field goals (40-50 range) routinely. What I've seen of him has been eye-popping. Adam was missing last year - he was still good, but his greatness (even "clutch" greatness) was not apparent. We drop off from 2004 here, if at all, not 2005.


    Gonna have to call the offense a B-, with A potential.

    "A" in Patsland has thus far meant getting up 10 or more points, and killing the clock. No proof we have the explosiveness to do the former, and no proof we can return to doing the latter.

    The answers we are afraid of take us to the "B-" category: how bad WAS the O-line? Is Light all the way back? Have the Kaczur/Mankins grown or treaded water? Is Jackson a force the first year out, or a project? Maroney? Are any of the rooks worth plugging in? If some or all of this goes right, the O line makes everybody else better, and the O could become a powerful and consistent force. Otherwise they can be stopped by the better teams.

    A+ it is.

    Linebackers: B-, A- potential

    It goes to "B" with "A" potential if we trade for Edwards and he melds to the Pats' system well (and quickly.) Otherwise we are depending on Banta Cain, Beisel, and/or Clarige. You don't give a team relying on unprovens any kind of A, minus or otherwise.

    Defensive Backs: C+, A- potential

    Look at all the unknowns: is Warfield a classic HITTING CB (I think yeah,) or just bad at coverage? Does Harrison really help at all this year? Is he a shot in the arm come playoff time? Does he just not make it back? Are the younguns gelling, or did they have their best games against our less powerful opponents last year? In the perfect world, everybody grows, Rodney is healthy, etc. Let's set the range with the negative answers as the baseline and hope for the positives.

    A minus is fine. He's a punter, for God's sake.

    Overall Defense: C+ to A- range.

    There is a lot to hope for here, but not so much is proven. Let's remember we were ranked 31st against the pass much of last season.

    My take is, we are not where we need to be to claim a place among the elite, when you break it down position by position. My gut says, however, that enthusiasm is justified. The Pats seem to answer questions (like the above) in the affirmative somehow, every year. Of course you can just say that the coaching magically turns questions into answers, but in the cold light of day, there are holes on this roster that could go either way.

    On the bright side, I don't see a unit on this team without upside. Still, I tend to expect the worst, even if I hope for the best. On the high end of the range, we're "A-/A." That gets you deep into the playoffs, maybe into The Show.

    Welcome to the board, Tax!

    PFnV
     

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