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Moulds for only a 4th to 5th?

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by Digger44, Apr 4, 2006.

  1. Digger44

    Digger44 Rookie

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    http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/3768911.html

    Bills haggling with Texans over compensation

    By MEGAN MANFULL
    Copyright 2006 Houston Chronicle

    Talks continued Monday between the Texans and Buffalo Bills over wide receiver Eric Moulds, who is in town to meet with Texans officials and take a physical.

    Last week, Moulds, 32, agreed to a $14 million four-year contract with the Texans, which included a $5 million signing bonus. But because Moulds is under contract for two more years with the Bills, the Texans must give compensation to the Bills to make the trade complete.


    Negotiations between Texans general manager Charley Casserly and Bills general manager Marv Levy continued Monday. The Bills are asking for a fourth-round pick in the April draft; the Texans are offering a fifth-round pick.

    If the Bills don't accept the Texans' offer, they risk losing Moulds for nothing. They have failed in their attempts to restructure Moulds' contract, and they have made it clear to Moulds that they will not pay the base salary of $7.1 million that he's due next season.

    If the Bills cut Moulds, they receive no compensation.

    Moulds, 6-2 and 210 pounds, spent the past 10 seasons in Buffalo. The three-time Pro Bowler has accumulated more than 1,000 receiving yards in four seasons, most recently in 2004. If he joins the Texans, he will start opposite Andre Johnson.


    Whoa, only a 4th or 5th? We could offer 4th right now and get him. Don't like the $5 mil signing bonus, but we could do it easily. $14 mil over 4 isnt that bad either.
  2. BelichickFan

    BelichickFan B.O. = Fugazi PatsFans.com Supporter

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    It takes two to tango. The Bills are probably happier getting a 4 or 5 from Houston than a 3 or 4 from us.
  3. Digger44

    Digger44 Rookie

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    ya this makes no sense to me though. i think moulds is worth a 3rd rounder.
  4. BelichickFan

    BelichickFan B.O. = Fugazi PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I can't say I'd be upset with a #3 plus the above mentioned contract but at his age it's still a lot. Honestly I'm getting tired of the draft choice for player thing. We've now trade a #2, #3 and #5 and gotten : One good year of Dillon, one bad year of Dillon, one bad year of Starks and one unmemorable year of Andre Davis.

    Given our draft history we seem to be better off going that route.
  5. Digger44

    Digger44 Rookie

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    good thoughts, never saw it that way.
  6. JoeSixPat

    JoeSixPat Rookie

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    Marv Levy is old school - you don't trade a guy like Moulds within the Division.

    Once it became clear that they weren't going to release him it became clear that the Patriots really had no shot of getting him.
  7. BelichickFan

    BelichickFan B.O. = Fugazi PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Well the last time they traded within the division it didn't really work out for them :D

    Ty Warren for a benched Bledsoe - thanks Donahoe :D
  8. flutie2phelan

    flutie2phelan Rookie

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    Creative arrangement!

    That one good year of Dillon, though ... to me ... is worth the 2nd-rounder.
    It's the rich extension we offered that causes the burping about him now.

    Funny thing, when you look back over the big picture, doesn't it seem? ... as if Belioli
    are just average judges of pro-player talent (FAs and trades) ...
    while being superb judges of collegiate talent (draftees and UDFAs).
    That's a little counter-intuitive because they watch the pro guys play live and surely watch much more film starring NFL-ers than collegians.

    Are the Pats' scouting squads that different in ability?
  9. BelichickFan

    BelichickFan B.O. = Fugazi PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Arrange it how you like - it is what it is :)

    Tough to disagree with any of that.
  10. Pats726

    Pats726 Rookie

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    Also, Moulds was looking more at Phillie..
  11. bucky

    bucky Rookie

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    Starks was obviously a disaster, though he was hurt the entire time. But the other 2 trades I would do again. I don't know what it is about our draft history that makes you think 5th round picks are so valuable. Besides Koppen, there hasn't been a 5th rounder of note since BB got here.
  12. Digger44

    Digger44 Rookie

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    Maybe the fact that if BB can pull of a Brady & a Givens later than 5, he may be able to get someone better in 5.
  13. BelichickFan

    BelichickFan B.O. = Fugazi PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I don't know if the 5th round pick would have worked out or not but a 2, 3, 5 is a good size package of picks to have given up. As a group I would make the trades, I guess, as there's no saying for sure we win SB 39 without Dillon. But in general these trades have left me underwhelmed.
  14. rookBoston

    rookBoston Rookie

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    You forget that we got one Championship year from Ted Washington for a 4th rounder.

    Now, riddle me this: was our 4th rounder on Dexter Reid better spent, or the 4th on one year of Big Ted?

    And then calculate the fact that we got a 5th round compensatory pick for Ted after he signed with the Raiders, and tell me where you think that trade ranks among the best deals of all time...
  15. mac

    mac Rookie

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    Teams and guys on this board think draft picks are like gold. Are you kidding me? You wouldn't give Dexter Reid for Moulds? Klecko for Moulds? Samuel for Moulds? These guys were fourth round picks. How about Brock Williams for Moulds? Or Guss Scott for Moulds? J R Redmond for Moulds? These guys were third-rounders. I just do not get why teams just don't bite the bullet and give up a pick. Give a third and a fourth for Moulds. What's the big deal? Maybe as you suggested Rook, BB thinks Childress can step up and claim a spot as a cheap alternative. Otherwise, sitting tight on Moulds makes no sense.
  16. PatsFanInVa

    PatsFanInVa PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I think what the Pats do is what everybody else does, just moreso.

    Dillon for a draft pick? Are you kiddin' me? Of course that was a good move. Ted Washington, for a year? Sure, I'll take it. How's that Vrabel fella workin' out?

    And then there are the bad moves, which fall into the "whattayaexpect" category.

    It's a crap shoot all around the league, and the Pats do come up one the winning end of this equation, all told. It's hard to say the draft picks have all excelled and the FA/Trades have all stunk up the joint, though BB/SP seem to have found an extraordinary number of low pick, high value collegians.

    I think too, that before the league got savvy to what BB/SP were doing - and winning with - there was a huge advantage. I'm not just talking about getting the best 3-4 personnel before other teams decided to go with that defense, though that plays into it. I'm more talking about finding "Patriots type of guys." Low-ego, team-first, coachable guys who don't mind being role-players. I think more teams are looking for them now (although its hard to duplicate the Pats' magic elsewhere) and that cuts into the available talent pool the Pats can draw from. I think all around the league the spotlight is less on the high-price, high-profile Owens types, and more on the smart cap move. At least moreso than in, say, 1999-2000. The "five good players instead of one superstar" theory has caught on, changing the values. Now it's "five mediocre/project players or two good players or one superstar," so it's harder to pick up the working-class-to-pro-bowl-guy.

    Thoughts of a dry mind in a dry off-season,

    PFnV
  17. Digger44

    Digger44 Rookie

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    Oh ok so lets continue with your logic. Let's give Brady for Moulds. Moulds is an earlier pick. We should have given Givens for Moulds. Heck we should have traded Troy Brown for Moulds a few years ago bcs Troy wasn't even drafted. Come on newbie, you gotta do better than this. Any draft pick has golden potential in the hands of BB.
  18. Terry Glenn is a cowgirl

    Terry Glenn is a cowgirl Banned

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    Yeah...I doubt that they want to do ANY sort of business deal with the Pats.
  19. flutie2phelan

    flutie2phelan Rookie

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    Digger, i think you're too harsh on mac.

    Free agent vs draftee reduces to determining where is the greater risk?

    Isn't it surprising? ... how difficult it appears to be ... for the best professional judges of football flesh in the world ... to judge accurately how much longer a vet player of some accomplishment ... can keep up to snuff.
  20. MoLewisrocks

    MoLewisrocks PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Sounds like we can officially cease discussing Mr. Moulds:

    Bills | Team acquires 2006 fifth-round pick for Moulds
    Tue, 4 Apr 2006 23:11:20 -0700

    Megan Manfull, of the Houston Chronicle, reports the Houston Texans traded a fifth-round pick in the 2006 NFL Draft to the Buffalo Bills in exchange for WR Eric Moulds.
  21. nickw308810

    nickw308810 Rookie

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    I was about to post everything you just said. So...ummmm.....good post! Haha Yeah Big Ted was great for us and getting the comp pick for him made it even better. Any idea what player we drafted with the pick for Big Ted? Ryan Claridge?
  22. bucky

    bucky Rookie

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    Digger, maybe you don't remember this, but the Pats thought Brady was going to become a backup QB in the NFL. And the Givens pick was made because they couldn't trade the pick away. So give the Pats credit for picking these guys, but the real credit goes to the players who work to become good players and the coaches who help them.

    If you look at ALL the 2nd day picks the Pats have made since BB got here, you'll see the success rate isn't so hot. For every Givens and Samuel, you get five Dexter Reids, Jabari Holloways, PK Sams, and Kliff Kinsburys.
  23. bucky

    bucky Rookie

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    I think you're right.
  24. Brady'sButtBoy

    Brady'sButtBoy Rookie

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    Despite Digger44's irrational response, I think MAC is right on the money. Digger44 overlooks MAC's obvious point - even BB flops on plenty of draft picks (chose a name from his list), while obtaining Moulds is about as sure a move a GM could make.

    As for Buffalo turning down a third from us so they could send Moulds outside the division is a completely whacko idea, even Buffalo isn't that dumb. With all the holes they need to fill, a 3rd round pick has very realistic chance of helping the team soon while a 5th is pretty much a crap shoot. Besides, what would prevent Houston from turning around and shipping Moulds to NE for a 3rd round pick anyway?

    No way we offered Buffalo a third. we may have offered a fourth and Levy figured Houston's fifth is only 12 spots later so there's really no difference there. Maybe that happened....
    Last edited: Apr 5, 2006
  25. Pats726

    Pats726 Rookie

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    Obviously a very good one...I think.hardly gave away anything for a year of TedW and a Superbowl.
  26. MoLewisrocks

    MoLewisrocks PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    What would prevent it is Houston eating his entire $5M accelerated signinig bonus cap hit. For Moulds at 3 years $9M all salary no cap consequence we'd have to trade Houston more than a third. ;)

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