Moss claims to be better than Rice

[Satchboogie3]

I don't understand that? If he is the most-talented WR ever and he just had arguably the greatest season any WR has ever had, how is he not the best?

You can't just look at stats. Randy even mentioned this. Rice never saw the kind of double, triple, quadruple coverage that Moss see's regularly. When Moss came into the league, he had the ability to stretch the defense like no one had ever seen before. He still has that ability.

In terms of production, Moss has the slight advantage thus far. I don't think you can just say "Rice has more yards" and claim thats the breaking point. Moss doesn't need to catch a single pass to be the most effective player on the field. If defenses are so afraid of him they are willing to commit 2,3,4 guys to him, the other WR will get open, thus contributing to the team.

 

[Patriot_in_NY]

Rice will always be the best. Randy needs to realize that. This is sure to attract some trolls.

It's on the ESPN Hashmarks blog.

http://myespn.go.com/profile/hashmarks

It should be called the HACKmarks blogs, because it's clear anti-pats biased. Are you gonna get on Brady's case for claiming that BB is the GOAT coach over Lombardi? That clearly what the writers want by posting that story 2-3 stories about the Moss one.

Moss might be the most-talented, but he is not the best. That's the homer in you talking. I think you need to go back and watch some NFL Films highlights.

Perhaps you should not dictate how another person chooses to determine the GOAT WR. I personally think it's Rice myself, however, I don't think it's out of line to put Moss's name into the conversation. Certainly not worth insulting someone else for thinking that way.

 

[BadMoFo]

I think it's a personal shot at Rice. Remember Rice made those comments about Moss "it's a slap in the face, but that's Randy Moss." They don't like each other.

Exactly. I can see saying something about a current player, but there is nothing Rice can do about it now. His record-breaking, HOF career is over.

 

[PonyExpress]

So the QBs made Jerry Rice, I see.

Those are your words, not mine. Do you deny that having 2 HOF Qbs throwing him passes contributed to Rice's gaudy statistics? if Moss had been playing with Brady, Favre, Manning all this time, he would have rings and unheard of stats and nobody would question who the greatest of all time is.

 

[BadMoFo]

It should be called the HACKmarks blogs, because it's clear anti-pats biased. Are you gonna get on Brady's case for claiming that BB is the GOAT coach over Lombardi? That clearly what the writers want by posting that story 2-3 stories about the Moss one.



Perhaps you should not dictate how another person chooses to determine the GOAT WR. I personally think it's Rice myself, however, I don't think it's out of line to put Moss's name into the conversation. Certainly not worth insulting someone else for thinking that way.

So they write something you disagree with and it's anti-Pats? I guess I'm anti-Pats for posting what Randy said.

 

[TheGodInAGreyHoodie]

One more from Moss
11:25 AM MT NFL.com

Randy Moss, who has turned down numerous invitations to attend a Super Bowl, said he told himself during his rookie season, "I don't want to come to a Super Bowl until I am playing in one." Moss, who will be playing in his first Super Bowl this weekend, went on to say that he would rather catch no passes and win the game than have a big game and lose.

 

[BradyFTW!]

Moss, right now, is better than Rice ever was. Anyone that has a problem with that is just going to have to find a way to deal with it. The trolls don't really bother me anyways; they were going to be here for one reason or another. If they weren't latching onto this statement they'd just keep talking about how Brady is an "system QB" or something similarly stupid.

 

[pwes]

Wow this thread is stupid. Are you seriously getting pissed that Moss said he was better than Jerry Rice? Why?

And you can't sit here and tell people how to judge the best ever just because it's the way YOU do it.

 

[BadMoFo]

It should be called the HACKmarks blogs, because it's clear anti-pats biased. Are you gonna get on Brady's case for claiming that BB is the GOAT coach over Lombardi? That clearly what the writers want by posting that story 2-3 stories about the Moss one.



Perhaps you should not dictate how another person chooses to determine the GOAT WR. I personally think it's Rice myself, however, I don't think it's out of line to put Moss's name into the conversation. Certainly not worth insulting someone else for thinking that way.

Another thing, how is calling someone a homer an insult? We're all homers in here, some more than others. I've caught myself defending Belichick, Harrison and Wilfork only because they were Patriots.

 

[oldskool138]

See, I'd be more worried if he said he was better than Burress and gives the Giants some bulliten board material...(BTW, he is better than Burress )

 

[ctpatsfan77]

One more from Moss
11:25 AM MT NFL.com

Randy Moss, who has turned down numerous invitations to attend a Super Bowl, said he told himself during his rookie season, "I don't want to come to a Super Bowl until I am playing in one." Moss, who will be playing in his first Super Bowl this weekend, went on to say that he would rather catch no passes and win the game than have a big game and lose.

Amen, brother. Obviously, I think most of us are hoping he gets the monster game and the bling. :rocker:

 

[BadMoFo]

Wow this thread is stupid. Are you seriously getting pissed that Moss said he was better than Jerry Rice? Why?

And you can't sit here and tell people how to judge the best ever just because it's the way YOU do it.

Getting pissed? I just pointed out what he said and stated that in my view, Jerry Rice is better than Randy Moss.

I think the ones causing this to last longer than it has to be are the Randy Moss fans who only became Randy Moss fans this year.

And am I telling you how to judge someone. That is how I judge the best of all-time.
QB: Tom Brady/Joe Montana
RB: Barry Sanders/Jim Brown
WR: Jerry Rice/Randy Moss.

 

[wpdougie2180]

Why is this even a question it's not as if Rice doesn't hold every receiving record possible. Everyone mentions Rice's HOF QBs but does he still not have to get open for them to throw to him and what everyone forgets is both were injured alot. If anyone really one wanted to make a case for Moss their argument would be shut down by simply lokking at the playoffs where Moss has never done anything and Rice holds every postseason and Super Bowl record.

 

[BadMoFo]

See, I'd be more worried if he said he was better than Burress and gives the Giants some bulliten board material...(BTW, he is better than Burress )

I'd rather even have Welker over Burress.

 

[Patriot_in_NY]

So they write something you disagree with and it's anti-Pats? I guess I'm anti-Pats for posting what Randy said.

Did I say anti-pats? No, I clearly didn't. I said stop berating the guy, calling his a homer, and telling him "watch highlight films" cause he doesn't agree with you, and thinks Randy is the best all time. That doesn't make you anti-pats, it makes you rude.

Bottom line, I can see how, talent and production wise, he could be considered. I's say it's pre-mature to say that, but I would insult someone else that feels that way.

.... and Yeah, Sando and Mosley are pretty much anti-pats guy.

EXHIBIT A

I'm too lazy to go find more, but it's documented

 

[BadMoFo]

Did I say anti-pats? No, I clearly didn't. I said stop berating the guy, calling his a homer, and telling him "watch highlight films" cause he doesn't agree with you, and thinks Randy is the best all time. That doesn't make you anti-pats, it makes you rude.

Bottom line, I can see how, talent and production wise, he could be considered. I's say it's pre-mature to say that, but I would insult someone else that feels that way.

.... and Yeah, Sando and Mosley are pretty much anti-pats guy.

EXHIBIT A

I'm too lazy to go find more, but it's documented

Did you read what you wrote?

It should be called the HACKmarks blogs, because it's clear anti-pats biased. Are you gonna get on Brady's case for claiming that BB is the GOAT coach over Lombardi? That clearly what the writers want by posting that story 2-3 stories about the Moss one.

And like I said, what is wrong with being called a Homer, that's what we are here.

 

[wpdougie2180]

Also here's some statsfound on a different board(data from pro-football-reference):

Rice (1st 6 seasons):
Receiving yds - 7,866
Receiving TDs - 79
Rushing yds - 289
Rushing TDs - 4
Total yds - 8,155
Total TDs - 83

Moss (1st 6 seasons):

Receiving yds - 8,375
Receiving TDs - 77
Rushing yds - 159
Rushing TDs - 0
Total yds - 8,534
Total TDs - 77

Rice (career through age 30):
Receiving yds - 10,273
Receiving TDs - 103
Rushing yds - 349
Rushing TDs - 5
Total yds - 10,622
Total TDs - 108

Moss (career through age 30):
Receiving yds - 12,193
Receiving TDs - 124
Rushing yds - 159
Rushing TDs - 0
Total yds - 12,352
Total TDs - 124

Total fantasy pts (FBG scoring):
Rice (1st 6 seasons) - 1,313.5
Moss (1st 6 seasons) - 1,315.4
Rice (career through age 30) - 1,710.2
Moss (career through age 30) - 1,979.2

Rice had an incredibly productive career after age 30. Moss turns 31 on February 13th. At this age, he's significantly ahead of Rice -- mainly because he started his pro career at an earlier age than Rice.

There are two minor things that affect all comparisons that are age or seasons based in Moss's favor:

1. Rice only started 4 games as a rookie. He joined a team that won the Super Bowl the year before, and it took him some time to crack the lineup. I suppose one could argue that the fact Moss didn't have to wait is deservedly an edge to Moss. But if our goal is to determine how they compare to each other, IMO it is somewhat misleading.

2. Rice played in a strike season in his third season. So he played only 12 games (of a possible 12) in 1987. So through no fault of his own, Rice played 92 regular season games in his first 6 seasons, compared to Moss's 96. It is a small difference, but it makes their total yardage per game in their first 6 seasons virtually identical, as opposed to there being a gap as it appears in your post.

In addition to that, consider their postseason performances from their first 6 seasons:

Rice - 50/847/11 in 9 games
Moss - 28/602/7 in 6 games

Both played extremely well, but Rice had more signature postseason moments, playing well in two Super Bowl victories and winning one Super Bowl MVP.

Honors from their first 6 seasons:

Rice - 1 MVP; 1 Super Bowl MVP; 5 All Pro selections; 5 Pro Bowls
Moss - 4 All Pro selections; 5 Pro Bowls

All in all, I think looking just at compiled statistics makes Moss look more favorably comparable to Rice than he really has been. I doubt it will matter, since I doubt Moss will come close to Rice over the second decade of their careers, so the compiled statistics will still favor Rice in the end, as do the other measures.

 

[PonyExpress]

Why is this even a question it's not as if Rice doesn't hold every receiving record possible. Everyone mentions Rice's HOF QBs but does he still not have to get open for them to throw to him and what everyone forgets is both were injured alot. If anyone really one wanted to make a case for Moss their argument would be shut down by simply lokking at the playoffs where Moss has never done anything and Rice holds every postseason and Super Bowl record.

Prior to this season, Moss had played in 8 Playoff games with 35 catches for 755 yards and 9 TDs.

In Jerry Rice's first 8 playoff games, he caught 43 passes for 699 yards and 8 TDs.

 

[Patriot_in_NY]

Did you read what you wrote?



And like I said, what is wrong with being called a Homer, that's what we are here.

Look, I agree with you (Rice is currently the GOAT), I just thought you were a little rough on the poster who though Moss was. Whatever...... No big deal.

I think Moss has the potential to be though, and I'm glad he thinks he is.

I suppose your right, I'm an admitted homer???? and I know you are from your previous posts???? (which is why I didn't say you were anti-pats).

 

[bradmahn]

So the QBs made Jerry Rice, I see.

It means a hell of a lot when comparing the two.

Moss's numbers through ten seasons:
774 receptions, 12193 yards, 15.8 yards/reception, 124 TDs
5.0 receptions/game, .8 TDs/game

Rice's numbers through ten seasons:
820 rec, 13275 yards, 16.18 y/c, 131 TDs
5.27 receptions/game, .84 TDs/game

Now tell me, do you think Joe Montana and Steve Young throwing balls to you is better than Randall Cunningham, Brad Johnson, Jeff George, Daunte Culpepper, Kerry Collins, Andrew Walter, and Aaron Brooks?

Cunningham and Culpepper have both had good seasons throwing to Moss, but they are no Joe Montana or Steve Young.

It's not outrageous to think that the receiver with almost identical numbers who has played with lesser quarterbacks and players surrounding him is better than the one who had two hall of famers at QB and numerous other greats surrounding him on offense.

And I don't even think we have to bring up the coaching advantage Rice's teams have over the combos of Denny Green, Mike Tice, Norv Turner, and Art Shell. Look at that brain trust.

There's no denying the greatness of Rice, but it's not completely ridiculous (as you seem to think) to believe that Moss is the better receiver.

Go back to 1994 and ask Rice who he thinks is the best receiver ever. With the numbers he had then (and the attitude of a WR), he'd tell you he knows he's the best, too.