Mortenson: Broncos and Buccaneers both offered 1st round picks

[Grizzafted]

what the hell happened here.

where there's smoke there's fire.

yeah we've gotta move on but i am pissed. real pissed.

we could have had the number 12 pick in the draft? are you kidding me? even if the brocos and bucs didn't move quick on calling us, why the hell weren't we calling them!? what was the rush, shouldn't we have checked the market? we could still have vrabel and the no 12 and 23 picks in the draft?

wow. i am livid. this is as upsetting to me as missing the playoffs. you could get a stud, an absolute stud at 12.

 

[mesoslo]

The patriots want the cap space probally because they want to go after peppers hard. Seeing how cassel was a very low draft pick and vrabel was a steeler cast off pick up, getting the 34th pick for both is still good. I really hop we land peppers.

 

[Grizzafted]

yeah but if we don't have peppers at the end of all this, we've got shawn crable trying to learn OLB this year and a qb coming off injury with an untested young backup, after letting go a borderline pro bowl quarterback for nothing.

the fact is belichick and pioli have a history here and belichick probably did this as a going away thank you to pioli. that's the only thing i can think makes sense, the writing's on the wall that belichick is softening up. he never would have done this three years ago, never. the fact is we did not use cassel to significantly upgrade our team as we all hoped, and in fact may have lost a lot depending on the player we get at that spot.

a number two pick for those two guys?? i can't get over this, sorry. i'm going to be pissed for a while.

 

[unoriginal]

Oh well. Hopefully in the future teams will get their bids into the Pats FO promptly ala Pioli instead of (a) trying to play chicken with Belichick or (b) tampering with the player, unless they (Denver) like seeing QB commodities go to their rivals for half-off.

 

[PatsFanInVa]

I'll wait until after the draft to make a declaration of BB getting his proverbial pocket picket.

It seemed crazy that we'd be sending both players for 1 2nd round pick, particularly with the QB market being what it is.

Something about the story seems off, or something about the deal is not yet known, formal or informal. I will give up on this little theory after all the draft day wheeling/dealing is done.

PFnV

 

[Shockt327]

Exactly, it's hard to value the half hearted, last ditch efforts of Tampa or Detroit as better than the solid early offer of KC. Bird in the hand is better than two in the bush, or something like that. I can see why BB pulled the trigger.

Dude, if Tampa was really willing to give up a first and a 3rd for Cassel, then why aren't they in Pioli's ear right now? You don't think Scott would at least entertain the idea of flipping Cassel for that price?

It's not happening cause this three way trade was all about Jay Cutler. He was the guy getting offers for a 1st and a 3rd. Not Cassel.

 

[mike_usagisan]

we could have had the number 12 pick in the draft? are you kidding me? even if the brocos and bucs didn't move quick on calling us, why the hell weren't we calling them!? what was the rush, shouldn't we have checked the market? we could still have vrabel and the no 12 and 23 picks in the draft?

You're assuming that the Broncos were willing to give up Cutler, something the Broncos are denying to anyone who will listen. Some say that it is to save face with Cutler. Who knows the truth?

Tampa Bay didn't want Cassel. They weren't giving up the pick unless they got Cutler.

I think when Bill heard about the possibility of the deal from Tampa Bay, he called his good friend Josh up and asked him if the deal was for real. Josh said no, and the only real deal on the table with KC went ahead.

 

[upstater1]

We walked down the street and found a $20 bill. So we didn't find a $50. We still came out ahead. We have 4 first-day draft picks, a boatload of cap room, and it's what, day 3 of the NFL year? I'm willing to wait a bit to see how the roster shapes up given these facts.

The real concern is that we spend the $20 bill on a lottery ticket that yields $0, or else we spend it on a bag of popcorn and a crappy movie, say, "Flash of Genius" (which I had the unfortunate pleasure of watching last night), or that we buy a 12 pack of great beer and drop it on the way out of the store.

I'll be very very happy if #34 turns into a good player. Sure there's no guarantee if we had a better pick, but you do increase your chances.

 

[Shockt327]

yeah but if we don't have peppers at the end of all this, we've got shawn crable trying to learn OLB this year and a qb coming off injury with an untested young backup, after letting go a borderline pro bowl quarterback for nothing.

the fact is belichick and pioli have a history here and belichick probably did this as a going away thank you to pioli. that's the only thing i can think makes sense, the writing's on the wall that belichick is softening up. he never would have done this three years ago, never. the fact is we did not use cassel to significantly upgrade our team as we all hoped, and in fact may have lost a lot depending on the player we get at that spot.

a number two pick for those two guys?? i can't get over this, sorry. i'm going to be pissed for a while.

You are out to lunch if you think that's the case.

Cassel was never going to net us a 1st and a 3rd - that deal was contingent upon Cutler. It was never going to happen. Vrabel was a salary dump, he was going to be cut anyway.

And when it comes to football, Belichick wouldn't do his own mother a favor.

 

[MagicMarker]

Something doesn't make sense...and that's why the deal wasn't done.

Denver sends #12 to the Patriots for Cassel. Ok, so far.
Denver then trades Cutler to Tampa Bay for what? #19, plus a third rounder?

It doesn't work...The Patriots #2 has to go back to Denver with Cassel in exchange for the #12. Then Denver trades Cutler for a #1 and a #3.

If that's the trade, do you make it? The only thing news reports said was the Tampa Bay was giving up a #1 and a #3 and Denver was giving up #12. It never said whether the Patriots were giving anything else up.

 

[BSR]

Great analogy by Curran.

"Suddenly, at the closing, another buyer busts into the lawyer's office saying he'll give you more - MUCH MORE - but he needs to work out financing and he's going to try and flip it or maybe he'll get a consortium to go in on the purchase.

What would you do? The Patriots sold the nice house they didn't need to the people who were serious buyers. And they threw in that reliable 2001 Camry (Vrabel) because they wanted it to go to a good home."

I think it's easier to understand now why the Pats went through with the deal for the early 2nd instead of waiting for the stars to align for a convoluted trade that would yield them a 1st rounder.

What would I have done? I would have waited for more then a day to decide there was no market for my house and suddenly panic thinking I couldn't afford the taxes and sell the house for what I knew was half of what it should have been.

 

[CrazyDave]

sniff... sniff sniff... hmm...
I may be wrong, but I think I smell something.
I'm not 100% sure, it's hard to say but my gut is telling me something.
If I'm wrong, well so be it.

 

[VJCPatriot]

Dude, if Tampa was really willing to give up a first and a 3rd for Cassel, then why aren't they in Pioli's ear right now? You don't think Scott would at least entertain the idea of flipping Cassel for that price?

It's not happening cause this three way trade was all about Jay Cutler. He was the guy getting offers for a 1st and a 3rd. Not Cassel.

You overlook the fact that there's no way Denver is unloading Cutler unless they get Cassel to take his place in return. Those teams you mentioned can offer Denver a 1st and 3rd for Cutler until they are blue in the face, Denver's not going to move him with nobody in place to replace him.

The proposed swap was Denver gets Cassel Patriots get a 1st rounder and Team X gets Cutler.

Pioli offered a high 2nd because he wanted Cassel. He didn't make the trade with the intention of 'flipping' him, or Cassel wouldn't have agreed to it. Whoever gets Cassel still has to sign him long term to make the deal worth it.

 

[SVN]

ProFootballTalk.com - DID BUCS’ OFFER COME TOO LATE?



Considering the horrible source (Mortenson) take that as you will.

"Mort also suggests that the Pats leaked word of the Broncos’ effort to trade Cutler to the Boston Globe as a way to mess with the Broncos."

typical ESPN.just unecessarily stirring up the pot.why would BB do this ? i just hate these wild speculation just so to look BB as an A-hole. mort couldnt break the original story that the pats traded cassel to KC but can predict everything else the pats did.

 

[ausbacker]

What's all the fuss about? Could we have had a first round pick, or several.. maybe, but by dealing Cassel to the Broncos and Cutler moving to Tampa, they instantly improve 2-3 fold. Broncos = familiarity with McDaniels and Tampa is a very good side, lacking in a skilled QB. By dealing Cassel to the Chiefs, they improve, but I doubt they become a contender.

I'm not hung up on the perceived lack of a deal the Pats got or didn't get. I am pleased the front office didn't send him to a team that could improve dramatically for the sake of a high draft pick.

There's a plan and I am waiting to see it evolve.

 

[VJCPatriot]

What's all the fuss about? Could we have had a first round pick, or several.. maybe, but by dealing Cassel to the Broncos and Cutler moving to Tampa, they instantly improve 2-3 fold. Broncos = familiarity with McDaniels and Tampa is a very good side, lacking in a skilled QB. By dealing Cassel to the Chiefs, they improve, but I doubt they become a contender.

I'm not hung up on the perceived lack of a deal the Pats got or didn't get. I am pleased the front office didn't send him to a team that could improve dramatically for the sake of a high draft pick.

There's a plan and I am waiting to see it evolve.

True. There is also the threat of Cassel becoming a "Patriot killer" in McDaniel's offensive system. In Denver he would have had weapons and an offense/HC that he is completely familiar with. KC has a longer way to go to turn it around than Denver. So it was a safer trade to send Matt Cassel to KC than to Denver.

 

[BelichickFan]

There was no other deal. There was another "maybe" deal. If Belichick passed on what he got and the other deal fell through, it sounds like he had no other deal and KC may have moved on. He took what he had - you know, the bird in the hand - the second pick of the second round which is still a premium pick.

 

[mayoclinic]

What's all the fuss about? Could we have had a first round pick, or several.. maybe, but by dealing Cassel to the Broncos and Cutler moving to Tampa, they instantly improve 2-3 fold. Broncos = familiarity with McDaniels and Tampa is a very good side, lacking in a skilled QB. By dealing Cassel to the Chiefs, they improve, but I doubt they become a contender.

I'm not hung up on the perceived lack of a deal the Pats got or didn't get. I am pleased the front office didn't send him to a team that could improve dramatically for the sake of a high draft pick.

There's a plan and I am waiting to see it evolve.

Very nicely said. There is undoubtedly a plan, and I am eagerly waiting to see it evolve.

We have so much flexibility right now in terms of draft picks and cap space, it is ridiculous. Consider the following scenario:

- Sign Terrell Suggs to a long-term offer sheet. This would cost us our #2009 and 2010 1st round picks (#23 in 2009 and probable high 20's-32 in 2010).
- Trade one of our 2nd round picks (#34 or 47) for a 2010 1st round pick to replace the one spent on Suggs.
- Use #34/47, 58, 89 and 97 in the draft on remaining needs, with the secondary being the likely focus.

I'm not saying this is going to happen or is at all likely, just that it's something we could afford to do in terms of both salary hit and cost to acquire the player, whereas we could never realistically have afforded it before. The opportunity to acquire a Suggs-calibre player is almost beyond price. And we would still have enough left over to have a quality 2009 draft (4 top 100 picks in a very deep draft).

 

[SVN]

True. There is also the threat of Cassel becoming a "Patriot killer" in McDaniel's offensive system. In Denver he would have had weapons and an offense/HC that he is completely familiar with. KC has a longer way to go to turn it around than Denver. So it was a safer trade to send Matt Cassel to KC than to Denver.

BB isnt afraid of making a deal if it gets him value. there is nothing stopping pioli from sending cassel to denver. there was no deal in place . 1st and 3rd and all were offers not negoitated deals and finalized. there the cassel contract, cutler contract and a lot of other crap to be resolved.
i just hate ESPN.they dont give any breaking news any more but just try and stir up crap including the fact that the pats leaked the denver info just to messwith McD becasue everyone assiumes BB is satan

 

[Shockt327]

You overlook the fact that there's no way Denver is unloading Cutler unless they get Cassel to take his place in return. Those teams you mentioned can offer Denver a 1st and 3rd for Cutler until they are blue in the face, Denver's not going to move him with nobody in place to replace him.

The proposed swap was Denver gets Cassel Patriots get a 1st rounder and Team X gets Cutler.

Pioli offered a high 2nd because he wanted Cassel. He didn't make the trade with the intention of 'flipping' him, or Cassel wouldn't have agreed to it. Whoever gets Cassel still has to sign him long term to make the deal worth it.

I don't think you read my post very well cause you are re-iterating my argument.

People on the board seem to think that Bill blew it because Tampa was willing to give up a 1st and a 3rd. However, that was for Cutler, not Cassel. That deal fell apart because Denver never wanted to part with Cutler in exchange for Cassel.

If Denver really was interested in Cassel, then there is nothing stoping them from trading Cutler for Cassel straight up. If Tampa was ever interested in Cassel (which they weren't, which people seem confused about) then they could still go to Pioli and offer a 1st and a 3rd. In that scenario, Pioli would've essentially traded a second round pick for a first and a third.