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MMQB - Demps, Jones and Mallett mentions

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by MoLewisrocks, Aug 20, 2012.

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  1. MoLewisrocks

    MoLewisrocks PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    He also notes after spending time in KC last week that the atmosphere in camp there is much different since the golf pro moved on to Pittsburgh. More attention to detail on defense and more relaxed communication on offense. Notes with all the injuries of last season you can't blame all of their struggles on Haley, but Cassel looks a whole lot better and while he wouldn't point any fingers others did. Too bad Bowe is such a diva. Finally signed his tender Friday but he's well behind on a more expansive offense. Pioli should have flipped him that first season and found a way to hang on to the aging all pro TE.

    One more note that is sure to drive JETS fans berserk, he named Schottenheimer his offensive coach of the week...says he's really got that offense humming. LOL


    Andrew Luck delivering on the hype so far, while Kevin Kolb's struggles continue - Peter King - SI.com
  2. bagwell368

    bagwell368 Rookie

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    I'm not that high on Mallett but find it hard to call last year a "full" training camp.

    If the Pats plan on letting Hoyer walk, then unless they really need Hoyer to win games, I'd argue Mallett should get all the back-up work and garbage time in games, not Hoyer.
  3. ClevTrev

    ClevTrev Rookie

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    Agreed, last season, Mallett was indoctrinated into the Patriot way, but he did not have a training camp. With one training camp (this season), he's showing he needs game reps to really prove himself. In my mind, Hoyer is clearly the backup. Mallett is a work in progress. I, too, would like to see him start to show he's capable much faster. Tonight's game is a good time to start.
  4. Nunchucks

    Nunchucks Rookie

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    Mallet has been a real disappointment. I would not be surprised to see him cut.
  5. ClevTrev

    ClevTrev Rookie

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    You may be right, but I'd be surprised with Hoyer becoming an UFA in 2013. It would be wise to keep one QB who understands the offense on board. He has 3 preseason games to show he belongs.
  6. Lamanai

    Lamanai Rookie

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    FWIW, I thought Mallett was far better than Hoyer in practice on Friday. Really the only report I saw was that he was picked off by Ebner. Nobody mentioned that Mallett laid one right into Urban's hands, and it popped into the air to Ebner. On a play a bit later Mallett read through his progressions and then hit someone with a harmless sideline pattern. BB reacted screaming "good read"

    I see a lot of negative reports on him relative to Hoyer, so maybe this was an aberration? I wonder if he's just not Bedard's (and others') cup of tea.

    (On the other hand, the stinkeroo he put up against New Orleans is compelling evidence.)
  7. PatsWickedPissah

    PatsWickedPissah PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I would be VERY surprised. He'd have to stink up the next 3 games proving that he's useless as a developmental player to make the 53rd player more valuable to the team and get cut. Pats need somebody as backup in 2013 for Brady and BB knows that most FAs aren't compatible with the Pats offense.
  8. ClevTrev

    ClevTrev Rookie

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    Another point regarding Mallett, and I'm the first to admit that I don't see what the Pats see on a daily basis, Belichick has been extremely patient with backup QBs. Many were calling for Cassel's ouster before he took the team to an 11-5 record in 2008. Both QBs, Hoyer and Mallett, need game action. The next 3 games should provide the reps Mallett needs to get comfortable, but even then he'll have his detractors as Cassel did until he became the starting QB in 2008. I expect Mallett to be around at least for the length of his contract.
  9. IllegalContact

    IllegalContact Rookie

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    people continue to latch onto some far-fetched notion that mallet is not a good person or a 'patriot type', so he is scrutinized much more highly and people wring every ounce of negativity out every little thing they see that reflects their negativity even slightly.

    Hoyer is a clip board holder.


  10. Reckedtrek

    Reckedtrek Rookie

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    BB's patient until he's not. Kevin O'Connell was a 2008 third round pick and was gone before the start of the 2009 regular season. But having said that, I'd be surprised to see Mallett get cut this season.
  11. Nunchucks

    Nunchucks Rookie

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    I would just like to remind everybody that Hoyer was the primary backup as a rookie.
  12. ctpatsfan77

    ctpatsfan77 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Well, that year this impressive UDFA came in and upstaged all the other veterans save Brady.

    If he cuts Mallett, then he's basically back to square one after this season.
  13. The_Riddler

    The_Riddler Rookie

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    Way too early to give up on Mallett. Last week the OLine was abysmal. I think if he has time in the pocket, he'll start to show what he can do. I am still high on him and feel like he is the future. The arm obviously is there and the work ethic is there, he just needs the reps and with that will come confidence.
  14. MoLewisrocks

    MoLewisrocks PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Mallett didn't have a full off season with conditioning and OTA's and mini camps in 2011. No one did. He did have a full TC. And a full season on the 53. And this season he's had the whole enchilada.

    I know Bill talked him up last week. When doesn't he do that to a player under fire. Said he has seen improvement relative to Mallett knowing the playbook vs. trying to pick it up cold last season. Well, he'd almost have to have as there was nowhere to go but up after last season. It just hasn't shown on the practice field or in limited game action. His snaps seem to be increasingly limited in practice as camp progressed. He still seems to show the same inclination to be a boom or bust player almost from snap to snap. Hoyer may not have nearly the arm, neither does Brady. But they are consistent and poised game managers who make few costly mistakes and don't tend to make the same ones repeatedly. They process information quickly (Brady at warp speed) and retain information (Brady is like Univac) cleaned from film study and experience. They're mechanically sound. Cassel was a similar type player (although Haley nearly wrung it out of him). Mallett might make it in another, simpler system based on arm strength alone. Although I don't see anything that portends greatness in any system.

    Cassel and Hoyer were thought to be potential high floor low ceiling players who showed tremendous development and affinity for the system early on (despite the fact that many here didn't see that). Mallett is assumed to have a higher ceiling based largely on arm strength. Just haven't seen a remotely functional floor or any affinity for this system. And absent both the ceiling can't be reached here.

    I think Mallett will remain on the roster unless he totally falls apart over the next three weeks. But just like KOC he will face competition for the #2 spot next season, probably from some UDFA like Hoyer or some former starter or backup who washed out elsewhere that Bill once admired (or Josh once worked with) and thinks can be salvaged.
  15. WinstonSmith

    WinstonSmith Rookie

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    Lots of folks seem to have soured on him after the preseason game - granted, he looked like Tebow without the running and winning, but with our roster I'm still holding out hope that by the end of preseason that we can rely on Mallet and go with 2 QB's.
    Last edited: Aug 20, 2012
  16. Nunchucks

    Nunchucks Rookie

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    I don't really care about Mallet's dislikeability factor. I am more concerned with his ability to make plays.

    His accuracy in the last preseason game was awful, his decision making slow and poor. He just doesn't seem to be able to "get it"

    However, I do think he made maybe 2-3 plays in that game that were excellent, but is that enough to compensate for all the crap?

    I don't know, guess he will have a chance to redeem himself tonight.
  17. MoLewisrocks

    MoLewisrocks PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Hoyer was the ONLY backup as a rookie and for a QB coming back from a season ending ACL. And in his rookie year Cassel sent Rohan Davey and Chris Redman packing, in his second year Cassel was the lone backup (although they brought Vinny in as a mentor in mid November). In 2008 he held off O'Connell and the QB the team supposedly was in love with, Gutierrez...
    Last edited: Aug 20, 2012
  18. Reckedtrek

    Reckedtrek Rookie

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    I agree. I don't think Mallett will be cut. I guess my point was that you can't take much of anything for granted with BB, except that he'll do what he thinks is best for the team. Whether he has done something a hundred times, or never at all seems to have little impact on what he'll do this time. With BB, it's "situational team building".
  19. MoLewisrocks

    MoLewisrocks PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    If Bill determines from a roster standpoint that he can't carry 3 QB's Hoyer won't be going anywhere.
  20. MoLewisrocks

    MoLewisrocks PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Those who play the dislikeability card are just not willing to consider the alternative. Assessments of system fit are all about consistent (and not merely random) performance and production.
  21. letekro

    letekro Rookie

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    Mallett looks good in first preseason game last year---he is a god among men. Mallett looks bad in first preseason game this year---he should be cut immediately. Next year will likely make or break Mallett, but he is safe this year as long as he continues to behave on and off the field.
  22. The Gr8est

    The Gr8est Rookie

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    Good to see you posting again letekro, I take it the "staplectomy" went well?

    :rolleyes:
  23. RayClay

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    Don't you understand? If he doesn't beat out the very poised and confident backup by the first preseason game of his first full training camp, he can never be great. Never!

    Now that that's settled, give me a triple mocha latte with a shovelfull of extra whipped cream.
  24. DaBruinz

    DaBruinz Pats, B's, Sox PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I can remember back not too long ago when all the media pundits (and many on this board) were saying how Cassel was going to get cut and that some UDFA rookie was going to be the number 2.. And what happened? Cassel wasn't cut. Brady went down. And Cassel ended up being the starter and surprising everyone, including his supporters.

    Mallett has talent and hasn't been a nuisance off the field (ala O'Connell).. Let's wait and see before we go writing Mallett off.
    Last edited: Aug 20, 2012
  25. Off The Grid

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    Not me.

    I soured on'm the moment he was drafted!! [​IMG]

    And now we're starting to see why. :D
  26. MoLewisrocks

    MoLewisrocks PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Oddly the same people who couldn't see the upside in Cassel are the ones who generally can't see the downside in Mallett. And the Gutierrez love was based largely on Mike Reiss repeating something someone in the FO told him about how they loved Gutz work ethic. The rest of the media lemmings picked up on that and it morphed into Matt Cassel is on the way out. After all they drafted KOC in the third that year as well...

    I don't recall KOC being a nuisance off the field. I think his problem was he assumed the #2 spot was his once he landed it by default. And Gutz kept regressing to his scrambling, make something out of nothing mistake prone norm as he couldn't deal with competitive roster pressure. KOC spooked him, Cassel paid neither of them any mind and just continued to do what the coaches asked him to - run the offense for better or worse so they could evaluate everyone on the field.
  27. Metaphors

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    My take:

    - Demps has small hands. Just means he has to make sure he covers up at contact. He isn't going to break many tackles anyway. His Florida buddy (who actually has large hands) fumbled last night against the Colts, so I don't think hand size is the only (or even the top) determiner of ball security. If Demps doesn't take ball security seriously, he won't be a Patriot for long...which makes him exactly like every other player. I'd be curious to know how many of his 11 fumbles occurred on kick returns or gadget plays, which are likely to be his roles this year.

    - Jones is going to be as good as the scheme allows him to be. If the Pats throw the 2011 defensive philosophy out there, Jones will get a handful of sacks, pressures and tipped passes...but nothing worth writing home about. QBs were more often than not making 3 step drops and throwing to their first reads. If the Pats vary pressures and coverages like they have in the past, Jones could be as good as he wants to be.

    - The Mallett criticism is kind of baffling. The Pats obviously like Hoyer as the 2nd string QB so it makes little sense to change things up. Mallett has by all reports been a solid Patriot and fit in with Brady and Hoyer. As for production, he has played 5 preseason games (80+ attempts) with a variety of 3rd string receivers, backs and protection in front of him. Expecting consistency is unreasonable. The other aspect is around expectations from coaches. They are stretching him mentally and physically to gauge his development. If they just asked him to Sanchez his way down the field, I'm sure he could throw out a "7-9 for 53 yards" stats line without much problem. But what is the use in that?

    The common theme is that Demps, Jones and Mallett all have enormous potential. They have special physical attributes that make them similar to successful contemporaries (Sproles, Aldon Smith, Flacco) but they obviously need to turn that into NFL production. This does allow fans, pundits and amateur scouts to say pretty much anything at this point.
  28. Nunchucks

    Nunchucks Rookie

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    I am just saying that for this one season, if it comes down to keeping Mallet over Deadrick or Branch or Stallworth, or any of those guys that might be on the bubble...a guy that will give you injury protection and positive snaps during the season, it can be difficult to justify keeping that 3rd QB. Especially, if he hasn't shown too much.

    I admit to being a Cassell hater, he was awful that preseason and he was awful for a good chunk of the 2008 season. However, he was kept, he became the starter and by the end of the year, I felt he would give us a shot in the playoffs, too bad they missed em.

    I liked the Mallet pick and totally can understand if they keep him, but the Patriots are going to have to make some very tough choices.
  29. The Gr8est

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    If Mallett gets cut, he will be claimed by multiple teams. Branch would likely go unclaimed and go straight to the shadow roster.
  30. Deus Irae

    Deus Irae PatsFans.com Retired Jersey Club PatsFans.com Supporter

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    1.) I was one of the few defending Cassel.

    2.) Mallett has shown basically nothing to this point, and it's not just about one exhibition game. If he gets cut, he gets cut. If he stays, hopefully he'll improve dramatically, because he'll need to.
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