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Mike Reiss Chat Today at 2pm Eastern


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too many folks here who, if they don't agree with someone, hurl an insult.
 
since67 said:
too many folks here who, if they don't agree with someone, hurl an insult.

Believe me, it's all in good fun.

We're the anti-ESPN forums.
 
Pat_Nasty said:
Anyway, I believe I do know what I'm talking about. I am, at present, a working (usually) writer and reporter. As a young guy trying to get into the game, I am frustrated at the direction journalism is going in now, whether it's politics, sports, or entertainment. It's all about access these days. The Whitehouse heavily favors reporters who support its agenda with it, and take it away from those who refuse to let the government control what they print.

I say you have no clue as to what you're talking about.
 
Pat_Nasty said:
Wow. That was... uh... over the top. So far I'm batting one thousand here... one post, one inspired hissy-fit.

Wow, I'll say. Your posts have been calm and well-reasoned, all the name-calling is ridiculous.

It's a perfectly legitimate issue, how much a reporter covering any regular beat has to toe the line to gain access. When it comes to sports beat reporters, my impression is that there's actually far less of this now than in the past. The coziness of the baseball beat guys to the players in the old days is legendary. (Babe Ruth was never seen drinking, etc.)

I share everyone's deep appreciation for Mike Reiss. He covers the team in a way that no other reporter does. But off the top of my head I have to admit I can't think of a single time he's published any information that would have even slightly annoyed the team. That could be simply a conservative journalistic approach--Mike doesn't do the rumor beat, his style so far is a straightforward chronicling of events. But I suppose it could also mean he's sat on some info to keep getting access to more. There's no way for any of us to know.

I will say that I think Tomase gets a lousy rap here. He's no Borges, and he had a legitimate scoop on Bruschi's injury.
 
Pat_Nasty said:
Anyway, I believe I do know what I'm talking about. I am, at present, a working (usually) writer and reporter. As a young guy trying to get into the game, I am frustrated at the direction journalism is going in now, whether it's politics, sports, or entertainment. It's all about access these days.

Ah, an idealistic journalism major. Let me let you in on a little secret that the lib journalism profs never told you: reporters are whores. It has been that way since time immemorial. If you're not ready to lay down, you're in the wrong business.

The Whitehouse heavily favors reporters who support its agenda with it, and take it away from those who refuse to let the government control what they print.

PUH-LEESE. That must explain all the pro-Bush articles I am always seeing in the paper. Do you really think think that the current administration INVENTED access ? The last one raised raised it to a fine art, practically pedaling access for cash, along with the Lincoln Bedroom, cabinet positions, 'executive orders' and photo ops. After the Lewinski story broke (on the Internet, after the story was suppressed by Newsweek), Clinton didn't have a public press conference in over a year - but plenty of softball 1 on 1 interviews. Where were the hand-wringing journalists decrying access then ? Not a peep.

If you think that GWB is the biggest threat to journalism, you are seriously naive, deluded, or both. Ever heard of Jason Blair ? NY Times reporter who made up stories while sitting in his apartment high on crack ? He wasn't caught for years because the stories all had perfect liberal spin. How about the CNN executive, who admitted that they didn't air stories about Sadaam Hussein's genocide against the Kurds, because it would have precluded getting interviews (access) with him ? How about the obviously fake National Guard documents that CBS tried to smear GWB with a few weeks before an election ? How about the AP photojournalist who was just caught doctoring his photos to make them more dramatic (and anti-Israeli) ?

Do you know what 'stringers' are, and how they are used ? Those are the unheralded underpaid people that actually DO the legwork, interviews and fact checking (what reporters are SUPPOSED to do), which is then turned over to the 'star' national reporter to actually write the article that will be published (with the correct editorial spin) with that reporter as the only one in the byline. Isn't that extermely dishonest ? The person telling you the story is telling you facts that he or she didn't collect themselves, but pretends that they did ? Your probably too young to remember, but prior to the journalism scandals, you NEVER saw the stringers get credit. Now at least, you will see a little blurb at the bottom, saying so-and-so 'contributed' to the report.

My guess is that your journalism profs didn't spend much time on these issues. Journalistic ethics as it is practiced by today's MSM is an oxymoron.

Look, I'm not saying that Reiss doesn't work for his living. He does, very hard I'm sure. I'm just saying that by giving up some independence in terms of what he chooses to write in return for greater access to the team and information, he's working a little less hard than maybe he should be, and, what's worse, guys like him make it harder for everybody else, who aren't the "pet" reporters of whoever controls the access to whatever it is they're trying to cover.

You decry tabloid and entertainment journalism, but then criticize Reiss because he doesn't engage in it. Far be it for me to suggest that journalists engage in hypocrisy.

We like and trust Reiss because seems to present a balanced set of facts that coupled with a reasonable knowledge of the game of football. He clearly states when he is stating a fact and when he is giving an opinion. He doesn't engage in sensationalism for it's own sake to sell papers or self-aggrandizing. Case in point - when most of local and national media sensationally reported that Tom Brady had criticized the FO re: Branch, Reiss reported the ENTIRE interview, which clearly showed that he was misquoted and taken out of context. He obviously puts in a lot of work, as his Blog clearly shows.

Sounds like spoiled grapes to me. You could learn a lot from Reiss.

Of course thanks to the Internet, people like us aren't wholly reliant on people like you to spoon feed us information - information that YOU feel is important and presented in a way YOU feel like presenting it. Gone are the days when a few monolithic (liberal) media outlets monopolize what we know and think. We can get information from a variety of sources, judge them on their merits, and make our own decisions.

R
 
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njpatsfan said:
Ah, an idealistic journalism major. Let me let you in on a little secret that the lib journalism profs never told you: reporters are whores. It has been that way since time immemorial. If you're not ready to lay down, you're in the wrong business.



PUH-LEESE. That must explain all the pro-Bush articles I am always seeing in the paper. Do you really think think that the current administration INVENTED access ? The last one raised raised it to a fine art, practically pedaling access for cash, along with the Lincoln Bedroom, cabinet positions, 'executive orders' and photo ops. After the Lewinski story broke (on the Internet, after the story was suppressed by Newsweek), Clinton didn't have a public press conference in over a year - but plenty of softball 1 on 1 interviews. Where were the hand-wringing journalists decrying access then ? Not a peep.

If you think that GWB is the biggest threat to journalism, you are seriously naive, deluded, or both. Ever heard of Jason Blair ? NY Times reporter who made up stories while sitting in his apartment high on crack ? He wasn't caught for years because the stories all had perfect liberal spin. How about the CNN executive, who admitted that they didn't air stories about Sadaam Hussein's genocide against the Kurds, because it would have precluded getting interviews (access) with him ? How about the obviously fake National Guard documents that CBS tried to smear GWB with a few weeks before an election ? How about the AP photojournalist who was just caught doctoring his photos to make them more dramatic (and anti-Israeli) ?

What do your rightwing politics have to do with Mike Reiss? Save the political rants for the political forum.

I agree with since67 who said insults are thrown around wayyy too much on this forum (especially at new posters). Here we have a well-reasoned critique of a reporter, and what does that get in response... scolding, name-calling, you name it, by what seems to be members of the Reiss family. I ask these forumers, why is Reiss above criticism? And why the hell do you care so much about him that you feel the need to make yourself look like an irrational ********?
 
Got a torrent of complaints from posters regarding AzPatsfans' obscenity laced bullying post and had to delete it (although it is still seen in quotes from others protesting it).

C'mon AzPF, from your history of great posts I know you're better than that. I, too, take exception to I'mWrongBorges? campaign against Reiss, but no one has to resort to that.

Thanks,
Shmessy
 
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patchick said:
I share everyone's deep appreciation for Mike Reiss. He covers the team in a way that no other reporter does. But off the top of my head I have to admit I can't think of a single time he's published any information that would have even slightly annoyed the team. That could be simply a conservative journalistic approach--Mike doesn't do the rumor beat, his style so far is a straightforward chronicling of events. But I suppose it could also mean he's sat on some info to keep getting access to more. There's no way for any of us to know.

Mike Reiss has consistently opined this offseason in his Ask Reiss/chat sessions that he thought that the Pats should have been more proactive in their dealings with Adam and Givens.

One example
http://www.boston.com/sports/football/patriots/extras/askreiss/08_04_06/

"All valid points, KC, and there is no reason why you can't question Belichick and Co. They aren't perfect, and they acknowledge that. I thought the Vinatieri decision was a mistake, going back a year or two. I would have locked him up long-term, assuming there was a two-way dialogue and he was truly interested in staying here. In retrospect, the team could have also been more proactive to lock up David Givens a few years ago, and I'm sure that's one decision they'd like to have back after seeing him blossom. In turn, I don't necessarily think the lack of a big-name free agent signing this offseason is that bad of a thing. Big names don't always get it done. The defensive backfield might be better than you think, and if Wilson stays at corner, I think that solidifies that spot. I also believe James Sanders, a second-year safety, is ready to emerge. All in all, I think the team has taken some hits this offseason and the potentially tenuous situation at inside linebacker should have any Patriots fan concerned. But this team is still a contender."
 
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Seymour93 said:
What do your rightwing politics have to do with Mike Reiss? Save the political rants for the political forum.

I agree with since67 who said insults are thrown around wayyy too much on this forum (especially at new posters). Here we have a well-reasoned critique of a reporter, and what does that get in response... scolding, name-calling, you name it, by what seems to be members of the Reiss family. I ask these forumers, why is Reiss above criticism? And why the hell do you care so much about him that you feel the need to make yourself look like an irrational ********?

Seymour93 is right. No place for politics in this forum - - that goes equally for Njpatsfan and PatsNasty (who initiated it).

If anyone has a blazing need to bloviate about politics (as I do on occasion), there is a very active forum for that on this website.
 
Pat_Nasty said:
Wow. That was... uh... over the top. So far I'm batting one thousand here... one post, one inspired hissy-fit.

Calm down, dude. Seriously.

Anyway, I believe I do know what I'm talking about. I am, at present, a working (usually) writer and reporter. As a young guy trying to get into the game, I am frustrated at the direction journalism is going in now, whether it's politics, sports, or entertainment. It's all about access these days. The Whitehouse heavily favors reporters who support its agenda with it, and take it away from those who refuse to let the government control what they print. In entertainment, you're either a shill like Entertainment Weekly, giving everything glowing reviews and conducting soft-ball "blow job" interviews to appease studios and publicists, and you get all the access you want-- or your a muckracking tabloid, and have to use the sleasiest tactics available and compromise your ethics in other ways, because you get zero access from anyone -- without serious coercion.

The same is true in sports. Just look at today's chat -- when asked about an injury, Reiss doesn't have anything to say that hasn't previously been reported, or isn't a cop-out "well, he looks pretty good, but we'll have to see" kind of non-answer. He's around the compound constantly. How has he not gotten an anonymous quote from a trainer or medical guy about players' conditions? Tomase did on Bruschi, and he's got half the access Reiss gets.

As I said in my original post, I understand that at this point in the media environment, you need guys like Reiss. But don't tell me his job is harder than somebody like Tomase's -- because I know. It's 10x harder to consistently get "scoops" that aren't stamped for approval by the franchise media reps, especially when you've got a history of printing things that obviously cheese off the FO -- like anything having to do with a Patriot injury, ever.

Look, I'm not saying that Reiss doesn't work for his living. He does, very hard I'm sure. I'm just saying that by giving up some independence in terms of what he chooses to write in return for greater access to the team and information, he's working a little less hard than maybe he should be, and, what's worse, guys like him make it harder for everybody else, who aren't the "pet" reporters of whoever controls the access to whatever it is they're trying to cover.

While some of your points are valid, you strike me as one of these reporter types who constantly look for the negative and want to "speak truth to power" and all that.

Nothing is more annoying than reporters who spin the news to support their agenda ... not even yes-men reporters are that annoying... they may be regurgitating the company line, but at least they aren't twisting it for their own selfish views.

I think it is hard for reporters to find the right balance. I'm not a reporter though, so I know I probably am not as informed on the nuances as you are.
 
To throw a little perspective on the flames, the crime here is not the reporting as much as the loss of reporters. I'm amazed that in all this ranting about whether Reiss is sufficiently antagonistic to the front office, you're missing (so like many reporters out there) the real story.

The three-time national champion patriots have lost (a) Projo's lead reporter to NBC, (b) the Globe's lead reporter to Houston, and (c) the quality of Felger's writing now that he's the servant of live media.

Pickings are slim in Boston. Tomase is okay, but he lacks Curran's quality and for that matter, Solomon's as well.

So go easy on the reporters who recently climbed out of the suburban high school beat into the regional spotlight.

Personally, I don't think he sucks up to the team. I think instead that each writer has their preferences and their audience. Cafardo and Borges have their axes to grind and some people like that. Reiss caters to the fan that wears red-white-and-blue glasses.

As you can tell by the responses, that's most of us.
 
Miguel said:
Mike Reiss has consistently opined this offseason in his Ask Reiss/chat sessions that he thought that the Pats should have been more proactive in their dealings with Adam and Givens.

Very fair point, thanks. (Though it could be argued that offering an opinion is different from revealing information.)

This week Reiss has an incredibly heavy load -- he seems to have stepped in for Solomon to write the Globe's feature articles on the Pats, while still blogging and hosting chats. When does the poor guy get a new partner on the Patriots beat?

[EDIT: just saw PatsFan37's post after I posted this. It's slim pickings indeed, and getting awfully close to the start of the season to fill a couple of critical beat jobs! Yikes.]
 
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One more thing to keep in mind. Many reporters try to make a story out of the people on the team, to give them something easy to write about. Building a story from quotes and opinions is the easiest thing for them to do and fundamentally they're lazy.

What some of us like to know is how the team will perform on Sunday. This requires watching the tape, analyzing player performances, critically watching practice and evaluating players themselves. This ain't easy (ask Box and Pats1). Reiss does it, Felger still does it, and I'll miss Curran's analysis.

There's a limited market for that kind of detailed reporting, since most fans' knowledge doesn't get into the players in the trenches.

Here on this forum, I'm surprised to see any angst over a perceived lack of reporting of front office moves or injuries. Doesn't that get enough press?

What we are MISSING, my friends, is analysis of the action on the field. And the skilled FOOTBALL reporters who do it.

Or have you forgotten that Tomase was most recently a baseball reporter?
 
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patchick said:
Very fair point, thanks. (Though it could be argued that offering an opinion is different from revealing information.)

I totally agree than offering an opinion is different from revealing information. I just wonder what negative information did Reiss not reveal that other writers did.
 
Miguel said:
I totally agree than offering an opinion is different from revealing information. I just wonder what negative information did Reiss not reveal that other writers did.

He's been COMPLETELY AWOL on the Aurora Faye story.
 
Pat_Nasty said:
As I said in my original post, I understand that at this point in the media environment, you need guys like Reiss. But don't tell me his job is harder than somebody like Tomase's -- because I know. It's 10x harder to consistently get "scoops" that aren't stamped for approval by the franchise media reps, especially when you've got a history of printing things that obviously cheese off the FO -- like anything having to do with a Patriot injury, ever.

I will give you that Tomase has scooped Riess on the Bruschi wrist break. But he has also jumped the gun on a couple of things and had to back off of them. Not to mention that he does not do a great job breaking down what is actually going on football wise. His, Brady almost gaffe story about Brady trying to get the kid to flex was assine in more ways then ten. But maybe with time he will grow into the position.

With Riess you have a reporter that knows a thing or two about football and that is greatly appreciated. More so he cares about football which is more appreciated by the fans that are back-burnered by so much of the local media. Given that he used to work for the in house PFW crew, he does have more access. But it also indotronated him into the philosophy of that injuries are not news.

But he is more then willing to give contrary views. See Miguels post about Vinatieri. But they have to do with football issues. His blog gives his opnion on how guys are preforming and what nuggets he can glean from the staff on how guys are doing as far as on the field issues. Which is something I am more interested in.
 
njpatsfan said:
Ah, an idealistic journalism major. Let me let you in on a little secret that the lib journalism profs never told you: reporters are whores. It has been that way since time immemorial. If you're not ready to lay down, you're in the wrong business.



PUH-LEESE. That must explain all the pro-Bush articles I am always seeing in the paper. Do you really think think that the current administration INVENTED access ? The last one raised raised it to a fine art, practically pedaling access for cash, along with the Lincoln Bedroom, cabinet positions, 'executive orders' and photo ops. After the Lewinski story broke (on the Internet, after the story was suppressed by Newsweek), Clinton didn't have a public press conference in over a year - but plenty of softball 1 on 1 interviews. Where were the hand-wringing journalists decrying access then ? Not a peep.

If you think that GWB is the biggest threat to journalism, you are seriously naive, deluded, or both. Ever heard of Jason Blair ? NY Times reporter who made up stories while sitting in his apartment high on crack ? He wasn't caught for years because the stories all had perfect liberal spin. How about the CNN executive, who admitted that they didn't air stories about Sadaam Hussein's genocide against the Kurds, because it would have precluded getting interviews (access) with him ? How about the obviously fake National Guard documents that CBS tried to smear GWB with a few weeks before an election ? How about the AP photojournalist who was just caught doctoring his photos to make them more dramatic (and anti-Israeli) ?

Do you know what 'stringers' are, and how they are used ? Those are the unheralded underpaid people that actually DO the legwork, interviews and fact checking (what reporters are SUPPOSED to do), which is then turned over to the 'star' national reporter to actually write the article that will be published (with the correct editorial spin) with that reporter as the only one in the byline. Isn't that extermely dishonest ? The person telling you the story is telling you facts that he or she didn't collect themselves, but pretends that they did ? Your probably too young to remember, but prior to the journalism scandals, you NEVER saw the stringers get credit. Now at least, you will see a little blurb at the bottom, saying so-and-so 'contributed' to the report.

My guess is that your journalism profs didn't spend much time on these issues. Journalistic ethics as it is practiced by today's MSM is an oxymoron.



You decry tabloid and entertainment journalism, but then criticize Reiss because he doesn't engage in it. Far be it for me to suggest that journalists engage in hypocrisy.

We like and trust Reiss because seems to present a balanced set of facts that coupled with a reasonable knowledge of the game of football. He clearly states when he is stating a fact and when he is giving an opinion. He doesn't engage in sensationalism for it's own sake to sell papers or self-aggrandizing. Case in point - when most of local and national media sensationally reported that Tom Brady had criticized the FO re: Branch, Reiss reported the ENTIRE interview, which clearly showed that he was misquoted and taken out of context. He obviously puts in a lot of work, as his Blog clearly shows.

Sounds like spoiled grapes to me. You could learn a lot from Reiss.

Of course thanks to the Internet, people like us aren't wholly reliant on people like you to spoon feed us information - information that YOU feel is important and presented in a way YOU feel like presenting it. Gone are the days when a few monolithic (liberal) media outlets monopolize what we know and think. We can get information from a variety of sources, judge them on their merits, and make our own decisions.

R

hear hear!

It used to be said if you couldn't cut in college, go to the Education School and study methods of teaching finger painting.

But now if you can't cut it in the Education School, go to the Journalism School where you can earn straight As without understanding any history, any economics, any Science, any writing ability, or any pretense of what balance and bias is.
 
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