Mayo v. Eckel round 2 and other notes from camp

[PonyExpress]

Re: Mayo V. Eckel RD 2

I think there's a kind of disillusionment backlash against Eckel. The image, coming out of college: tough fireplug type, upstanding Naval Officer, Steve Belichick's favorite, the ultimate "Patriots guy." As it turns out he's just another football player, probably a good guy but no special Mr. Clean. Which is fine, but folks who had artificially elevated him feel artificially let down. (Personally, I've never cared one way or the other. And FWIW, it seems to me that Heath Evans really is the guy everybody wanted Kyle Eckel to be, both personally and professionally.)

Great assessment. i agree totally.

 

[signbabybrady]

Re: Mayo V. Eckel RD 2

http://www.boston.com/sports/football/patriots/articles/2007/11/18/troubled_waters/

That's why I don't like Eckel so much. Not the type of guy that I can root for.

When you have a milatary that recruits Kids than you are going to get a few who don't know what they are getting themselves into. i don't think you can blame a kid for wanting the NFL over service.

 

[psychoPat]

2 QBs ?

....
On the QB, I don't think there's a chance what I said will happen. But I have zero confidence that Cassel or Gutierrez could get us through a playoff game if needed.

Very nice report, signJETbrady !

BF, you've opened my eyes to that strange QB possibility.
With so much good talent, potential, and depth to be cut ... obviously
every roster spot is precious.
We'll be stocking other teams with LBs and DBs after cutdown.

If BB decides that his 2 Matts aren't going to win him (m)any games
if it comes to that ...
then why shouldn't he keep one more Guyton ... Redd ... Ruud ... Richardson ... Ventrone ... or Spann
instead of Cassel or Gute?

 

[blackglass3]

Re: Mayo V. Eckel RD 2 and other notes from camp

Great report, man.

 

[signbabybrady]

Re: Mayo V. Eckel RD 2

On the QB, I don't think there's a chance what I said will happen. But I have zero confidence that Cassel or Gutierrez could get us through a playoff game if needed.

Back ups are not exactly suposed to win you playoff games. It would be nice to have that faith but realisticly I want a guy that can do .500 or better for a few weeks that way if the starter goes down for small stretch than you don't fall to far back and can still have a chance at playoffs when the starter returns. If the starter is done for the season, especially in our case, so is the team. Sometimes there are exceptions but those are tough to tell, I mean if we knew we had Brady back in the day he probably would have been starting from game one that season and not after Drew went down.

 

[MassPats38]

Re: Mayo V. Eckel RD 2

I'm not a military guy, but it seems like the navy just wasn't his # 1 priority. He's no Pacman and I can certainly still root for him. He seems like a real blue collar, down to earth team player. I'm not telling you to like him, though. That's your choice, obviously.

The "Anchor Man" status in the Naval Academy class is actually celebrated (in a mocking sort of way), and having dealt with officer separations in my time on active duty, it can be for misconduct (sometimes as simple as a drunk and disorderly arrest) or for other innocuous reasons like carrying too much weight/bodyfat when measured against height/weight charts.

I am not sure the statement about everyone leaving after service with honor is accurate either. I know an officer that got kicked out and went to the Packers, I just don't know if he was Naval Academy (I think he was). I am also not sure if he lasted through preseason (he was a defensive lineman).

The fact is I am neutral on Eckel as far as his character goes but I like the way he plays. My read on that older Globe article was the author had an axe to grind with him. If you haven't been in the Naval Academy (I went ROTC because a few visits was enough to convince me it blew hard for the first two years), then seizing on difficulties dealing with that life really isn't fair in the context of all other NFL player college experiences. Discussing uncharged misconduct, in which the "victim" may in fact not be a victim and which may explain the absence of charges, falls in line with digging for dirt.

 

[JMarr]

Re: Mayo V. Eckel RD 2

Great assessment. i agree totally.

Eckel's days are numbered. Say hello to Jordon and the three-headed beast at RB

 

[signbabybrady]

Re: Mayo V. Eckel RD 2 and other notes from camp

Nice report there SBB.....

If you go back tonight, can you check out the DB 1's & 2's and try to get a read on how Richardson looks - especially if you can remember how he looked last year and if you think he has made any kind of a jump at all. BB mentioned him yesterday and that was good as mostly, his name has been missing from the usual CB candidates, namely Hobbs/Bryant/Webster/Wilhite/Wheatley/Williams/Sanders & even Spann.

Great observation on your boy Eckel - I think the S/teams battle is really the story of camp this year with so many options and great ST players that are contending for spots. Eckel will make this team if he can win it on S/teams play. A rough way to look at it (I said rough) is if you have 80 guys and figure that at about 38 are starters, indispensable back ups, qb's, kickers & snapper shoe ins to make the team, that means you have 15 spots & maybe 8 practice squad spots for 35 guys to fight over. Many of these 15 spots will be special teams.

Also, if they happen to do another walk through type of practice tonight - take a good look at the pup'ers and see if you can find any casts, limps etc.

I will try and keep an eye out for some of those things. Here is a tid bit on Richardson I found in Mrs Bs camp report from today

Richardson also batted one away

 

[signbabybrady]

Re: Mayo V. Eckel RD 2 and other notes from camp

and another Richardson tidbit here..I imagine it was the same play.

Cornerback Mike Richardson caught the eye in red-zone work with one nice play – a breakup of a Kevin O’Connell pass intended for receiver Sam Aiken

http://www.boston.com/sports/football/patriots/reiss_pieces/

 

[spacecrime]

Re: 2 QBs ?

If BB decides that his 2 Matts aren't going to win him (m)any games
if it comes to that ...
then why shouldn't he keep one more Guyton ... Redd ... Ruud ... Richardson ... Ventrone ... or Spann
instead of Cassel or Gute?

If Brady gets hurt, none of those guys will help the team more than either Matt...

Everyone thinks we will be winless without Brady. Do you all think our team sucks that badly? I'd rather have either Matt than Rex Grossman, Kyle Boller, etc, but if you think those teams are better than ours in positions 2-53, then I see your point.

Me, I think Brady is the difference maker, but I also think our team is strong top to bottom, and that we won't go winless if we are Bradyless.

 

[VJCPatriot]

Re: Mayo V. Eckel RD 2

Did you see much of O'Connelll ? The guys on PFW blog seem to think his passes were a lot more consistent than in the spring.

It's a good thing I'm not Belichick - I'd cut Evans and Eckel now that we have Jordan too and don't use a FB much. Save a roster spot. Then - and no-one will agree but I'll say it - I'd move Cassel and Gutierrez, going just with Brady and O'Connell. Save a roster spot. Brady never gets hurt to the point he misses a game and if our backup QB is gonna be young, I wouldn't waste a roster spot on the other two. Those two moves could keep, say, Guyton and Richardson on the roster.

If we cut Gutierrez and Cassell I'd want BB to sign a veteran backup. KO is too young and raw to step in if the Big Boy goes down.

I think one of Evans or Eckel is losing his job because Lamont Jordan just brings more to the table. It could be both, but who would be the FB then, Jordan?

The depth at linebacker, especially the young guys, seems to be really encouraging. I am betting that whoever the Pats cut ends up on another team's roster pretty darn quick. Tough decisions to make there, but having to make a tough cut is a GOOD situation to be in.

 

[BradyFTW!]

Re: 2 QBs ?

If Brady gets hurt, none of those guys will help the team more than either Matt...

Everyone thinks we will be winless without Brady. Do you all think our team sucks that badly? I'd rather have either Matt than Rex Grossman, Kyle Boller, etc, but if you think those teams are better than ours in positions 2-53, then I see your point.

Me, I think Brady is the difference maker, but I also think our team is strong top to bottom, and that we won't go winless if we are Bradyless.

Agreed- IMO, the Pats are a 10-6 team with Gutierrez at QB, if that's what it comes to. Moss spent years making crap QBs look good, and the Pats' running game and defense are both well above average, at the very least.

 

[fgssand]

K-Ro & Gunnails -

This is one of your own turning on you - is it really that desperate there??

http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/07/27/favre-flirtation-further-proof-of-jets-desperation/

FAVRE FLIRTATION FURTHER PROOF OF JETS DESPERATION?


We’ve believed that the Jets’ entire approach to the 2008 offseason was driven by desperation. Caught between the Pats in their own division and the Giants in their own city, the Jets spent like drunken pilots in an effort to improve the team.

Harvey Araton of the New York Times also perceives desperation — and he thinks that the recent reports linking quarterback Brett Favre to the Jets is further proof of it.

“You wonder how Mangini and Tannenbaum are viewed around the [NFL] after setting off the saga known as Spygate last season, outing Belichick for his secret taping practices in violation of league rules. Did they score for delivering Belichick his comeuppance, or are they scorned for breaking an honor code?
“Mangini, in particular, would seem to be at risk of being cast as a hypocrite and an ingrate, given that he raised his coaching profile in the system he subsequently turned against and brought dishonor.”
Ouch.
But Aranton is right. More than a few league insiders have speculated that Mangini’s current NFL job will be his last one, and that to continue coaching after his tenure with the Jets ends, he’ll have to take a job in the college ranks.
Whether the stink of Mangini’s antics attaches to Tannenbaum remains to be seen. If it does, Tannenbaum’s only option might be to become an agent.

 

[signbabybrady]

K-Ro & Gunnails -

This is one of your own turning on you - is it really that desperate there??

http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/07/27/favre-flirtation-further-proof-of-jets-desperation/

FAVRE FLIRTATION FURTHER PROOF OF JETS DESPERATION?


We’ve believed that the Jets’ entire approach to the 2008 offseason was driven by desperation. Caught between the Pats in their own division and the Giants in their own city, the Jets spent like drunken pilots in an effort to improve the team.

Harvey Araton of the New York Times also perceives desperation — and he thinks that the recent reports linking quarterback Brett Favre to the Jets is further proof of it.

“You wonder how Mangini and Tannenbaum are viewed around the [NFL] after setting off the saga known as Spygate last season, outing Belichick for his secret taping practices in violation of league rules. Did they score for delivering Belichick his comeuppance, or are they scorned for breaking an honor code?
“Mangini, in particular, would seem to be at risk of being cast as a hypocrite and an ingrate, given that he raised his coaching profile in the system he subsequently turned against and brought dishonor.”
Ouch.
But Aranton is right. More than a few league insiders have speculated that Mangini’s current NFL job will be his last one, and that to continue coaching after his tenure with the Jets ends, he’ll have to take a job in the college ranks.
Whether the stink of Mangini’s antics attaches to Tannenbaum remains to be seen. If it does, Tannenbaum’s only option might be to become an agent.

is that suposed to be the ultimate shame for a GM....you are cast off forever to the land of sports agents but first here is a slime bath from "You Can't Do That On Television"

 

[Bostonian1962]

I was at Training camp this mourning. Highlight to me was the contact between Eckel and Mayo. Yesterday Mayo got the better today it was Eckel. it was the drill with no DB and no WR as they work on the fits in the running game. Mayo went to fill a gap and Eckel met him and put him down. Really nice contact. After the play Mayo was grabbing his hand and got me nervous turns out Eckel knocked Mayo's contact out (I didn't know Mayo had bad eyes).

other notes:

Faulk made the catch of the day a one handed lefty snag by the sidelines (no defense though). He than gave us a scare later as he limped out of a play, he didn't leave and with less than 40 min. left I figured he would be down but he returned for a play and afterwards you could see him give a nod to Fears which appeared to me as though he was nodding I'm OK.

Mayo looked OK despite getting blown up by Eckel. For all those wondering why I like Eckel so much this is it, he plays TC like he should be like he has something to gain by giving a little extra and it winds up being some added contact.

Chad Jack had a decent practice nothing special no real mistakes. But just seeing him on the field reminds of why we have high hopes for him. He is in as good shape as anyone and he is fast. He looked smooth in the some of his position drills. I really think if he is healthy he will finaly shine.

Hobson made one nice play.

Tank was back at LB though I didn't see him make a play.

No Seymour and No Watson(but just seems like they are going easy on them). Kazcur returned.

I had heard a few good things about Guyton so far in camp and he didn't disapoint to day. He had a nice pick and looked good in the STs rotation.

Speaking of STs Washington really plays it up to the fans when it is STs time. He knows that is his role. Look for him to be the captain should Izzo be a casuality (not saying that is the case but seems an obvious choice).

Seems like Gisele is really rubbing off on Tommy as he didn't throw much again this mourning even tossing under hand at times.

Might go again tonight...thats all for now.

Really nice report. Please keep it up. Good stuff.

 

[K-Ro 25]

K-Ro & Gunnails -

This is one of your own turning on you - is it really that desperate there??

http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/07/27/favre-flirtation-further-proof-of-jets-desperation/

FAVRE FLIRTATION FURTHER PROOF OF JETS DESPERATION?


We’ve believed that the Jets’ entire approach to the 2008 offseason was driven by desperation. Caught between the Pats in their own division and the Giants in their own city, the Jets spent like drunken pilots in an effort to improve the team.

Harvey Araton of the New York Times also perceives desperation — and he thinks that the recent reports linking quarterback Brett Favre to the Jets is further proof of it.

“You wonder how Mangini and Tannenbaum are viewed around the [NFL] after setting off the saga known as Spygate last season, outing Belichick for his secret taping practices in violation of league rules. Did they score for delivering Belichick his comeuppance, or are they scorned for breaking an honor code?
“Mangini, in particular, would seem to be at risk of being cast as a hypocrite and an ingrate, given that he raised his coaching profile in the system he subsequently turned against and brought dishonor.”
Ouch.
But Aranton is right. More than a few league insiders have speculated that Mangini’s current NFL job will be his last one, and that to continue coaching after his tenure with the Jets ends, he’ll have to take a job in the college ranks.
Whether the stink of Mangini’s antics attaches to Tannenbaum remains to be seen. If it does, Tannenbaum’s only option might be to become an agent.

It depends who you ask lol. By that I mean, its desperate among Jets fans b/c a majority think we can be a decent team but our QB's just flat out suck. The training camp reports are miserable regarding the two. As far as Tangini being desperate, I dont think completely desperate but definitely some desperation there. I think the one major factor which makes me lean that way is the gaudy contract Pace got. Other then that I thought the other moves were sound acquisitions, including Faneca who will be worth his deal if he can just play well and help the kids out b/c its no secret they struggled last year. Also factor in the Giants winning the SB and the Jets having a new home in 2 yrs. If anyone gets fired after this year I hope its Mangini not Tanny. Tannenbaum has shown signs of being a very good GM in the way he handles trades and his draft selections.
'
Backon topic, how fast do you guys think they will bring along Mayo as far as % of snaps week one to % of snaps towards years end.

 

[signbabybrady]

Backon topic, how fast do you guys think they will bring along Mayo as far as % of snaps week one to % of snaps towards years end.

I think alot of that depends on the health of Vrabel and how well Hobson does, not to mention the obvious how quick he can pick things up. I would expect he is a rotational guy to start but with a guy picked that high you have to expect him to contribute sooner rather than later. I say by week 5 he is really contributing heavily.

 

[K-Ro 25]

I think alot of that depends on the health of Vrabel and how well Hobson does, not to mention the obvious how quick he can pick things up. I would expect he is a rotational guy to start but with a guy picked that high you have to expect him to contribute sooner rather than later. I say by week 5 he is really contributing heavily.

OT: How has my boy Shawn Crable looked? I loved him at Michigan and think he has pro bowl upside if he can t just pack a few more LB's to guard against the run.

 

[signbabybrady]

OT: How has my boy Shawn Crable looked? I loved him at Michigan and think he has pro bowl upside if he can t just pack a few more LB's to guard against the run.

He batted down a pass yesterday and I heard something else good about him too though I can't remember specifically what. On the other side I heard he was yelled at from a coach for going half assed. I havent seen enough to make a real opinion which could be a bad thing too as Guyton, Mayo, and Hobson all did soemthing to stand out to me yesterday (one practice means nothing and my opinion of the one practice probably means less too).

 

[K-Ro 25]

He batted down a pass yesterday and I heard something else good about him too though I can't remember specifically what. On the other side I heard he was yelled at from a coach for going half assed. I havent seen enough to make a real opinion which could be a bad thing too as Guyton, Mayo, and Hobson all did soemthing to stand out to me yesterday (one practice means nothing and my opinion of the one practice probably means less too).

not to meaningless if im asking