Maybe they had no choice

[patsfaninpittsburgh]

You might be right, but I see it a little differently. As you say, they knew what they were getting when they got him and did manage him, as you detail, pretty well for the first three years. We'll never know everything that happened, at least not until BB writes his book, but I find it hard to believe that a team that prides itself on management couldn't have figured a way to manage its way through this. Startups and established companies alike are constantly managing the egos of prima donna contributors. We all have to move on now, but I'm not ready to let them off the hook for this, until I have more information.

Completely agree with your second paragraph. Whatever went bad, started way before this week, which is why I question how the situation was managed.

74

Sometimes there is simply no answer.

If Moss was given a big contract this would not have happened. If the gameplan, provided Moss the chance to prove he is worthy of another big contract, I doubt this would have happened. However, the two are not mutually exclusive because you don't give huge contracts to guys who will play dimished/secondary roles.

My guess is BB decided after 2009 on a different direction. We have those pieces and they checked out the past two weeks. If Moss would have accepted the secondary, "decoy' role then fine.

My guess is management realized that would not happen based on play and comments so they were prepared for the inevitable. However, the inevitable was only possible if the new direction worked.

Would they prefer to have Moss? Hell yes

Would they prefer to have Moss on their terms? Hell, yes

Is that realistic? Probably not

I have enjoyed his play here and like Moss alot. Yet sometimes you simply have to move on.

 

[cmasspatsfan]

You might be right, but I see it a little differently. As you say, they knew what they were getting when they got him and did manage him, as you detail, pretty well for the first three years. We'll never know everything that happened, at least not until BB writes his book, but I find it hard to believe that a team that prides itself on management couldn't have figured a way to manage its way through this. Startups and established companies alike are constantly managing the egos of prima donna contributors. We all have to move on now, but I'm not ready to let them off the hook for this, until I have more information.

Completely agree with your second paragraph. Whatever went bad, started way before this week, which is why I question how the situation was managed.

I think they could have managed their way through it but it would have expended a lot of energy, energy better spent elsewhere. They probably knew Moss had a shelf life and they would keep him til the shelf life expired, then either dump him or trade him.

 

[unoriginal]

I find it hard to believe that a team that prides itself on management couldn't have figured a way to manage its way through this. Startups and established companies alike are constantly managing the egos of prima donna contributors. We all have to move on now, but I'm not ready to let them off the hook for this, until I have more information.

Completely agree with your second paragraph. Whatever went bad, started way before this week, which is why I question how the situation was managed.

Have you ever noticed how often those prima donna contributors change companies? And most of them aren't chasing a $10 million per annum paycheck.

 

[smg93]

Ybut I find it hard to believe that a team that prides itself on management couldn't have figured a way to manage its way through this. Startups and established companies alike are constantly managing the egos of prima donna contributors. We all have to move on now, but I'm not ready to let them off the hook for this, until I have more information.

His trade was exactly how they manage the team. Perhaps the goals are a bit different here for you and I. What you seem to be saying is that management should be more about keeping talented individuals on the team so that they remain happy. My thoughts are kind of the opposite on this. Management to me is about making sure the system/team is secure and not any one individual person.

By trading him, I believe the team has sent an extremely strong signal to players and fans that the team's interest will always be greater than any one individual's.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

You might be right, but I see it a little differently. As you say, they knew what they were getting when they got him and did manage him, as you detail, pretty well for the first three years. We'll never know everything that happened, at least not until BB writes his book, but I find it hard to believe that a team that prides itself on management couldn't have figured a way to manage its way through this. Startups and established companies alike are constantly managing the egos of prima donna contributors. We all have to move on now, but I'm not ready to let them off the hook for this, until I have more information.

Completely agree with your second paragraph. Whatever went bad, started way before this week, which is why I question how the situation was managed.

What you fail to grasp is Bill is committed to not managing egos, that responsibility rests with the player and their teamates. He abhored what Parcell's did with egos like LT, and while it worked in increments he knew it spelled long term consequences he never wanted to have to live with on HIS teams. Just like Kraft stipulated to him he wanted nothing to do with thugs and hoodlums if that was the price he was expected to pay for winning in this league, Bill wanted nothing to do with divas. So few here understand what the basic philosophy of the "system" is at it's core. Responsibility, accountability, selfless dedication to the common goal. That is why as Pioli often pointed out we select from a more limited talent pool that many other teams. We want the unselfish self starter, the player who is coachable and driven and committed to winning. The guy who lets his playing do the talking and knows he has to earn his living and it's not a hype driven given and who cares more about winning here than making every last nickle he can squeeze out of a career.

Bill clearly knows you can't handle every guy the same way, but the rules apply to all of them regardless of talent or standing or perceived value. That was made clear to Moss the day he cried and promised his way onto the roster. Had Brady not made that meeting last winter that Bill placed so much emphasis on, he'd have been fine with that under the circumstances. The beauty of Brady is he wasn't going to ask for the favor, rather he was going to set the tone because he knew how badly the team needed to set that tone. Randy felt disrespected when he was sent home just like all the other clowns who didn't get it... Randy felt disrespected when Brady reemed him in practice for not making a play on a ball...even though he knew that Brady regularly endured reaming in front of the team, as did Rodney and Tedy and every other starter or sub or benchwarmer on this team.

This organization saved Randy Moss' ass and career and they had his back against all comers and critics and they coddled his delicate psyche within and sadly even beyond reason IMO, and what he did in return is ultimately revert to the form that landed him here in the first place. A leopard never changes it's spots no matter now well you think you're managing it. Now he's off to rejoin a bunch of kindred spirits back at the same place his journey started, the first place he wore out his welcome and shot his way out of... Oddly there remain a collection of desperation fueled enabler/apologist psynchophant fanboys waiting to revel in his return...

Good, let them manage the end of his career as well as they did it's beginnings...ultimately with the same thing to show for it...opcorn:

Hopefully the lesson has been learned here. I wouldn't hold my breath for the replacement diva...Bill's done with the talented malcontent reclamation projects who pay lip service to loving the game or loving to win when what they love above all else is themselves...

 

[Patriot_in_NY]

Folks........ It's pretty simple. Remember Moss came to us amid a lot of trepidation. Many argued for, based on his talent, other said.... No way, he'll turn into a cancer, look at his history.

We've all forgotten about his past because of everything he's done for us.

Right now, I'm reminded of Denny Green's CLASSIC RANT that is fitting.

Folks, it turns out that Randy Moss is who we thought he was.

He's a self-absorbed, petulant, me-first talent that is fine when things are going well, but a team-killer when they aren't. He was in Minny the first go round, Oak, and now NE...... Anyone want to take bets on how it ends up for the Minny in the end? It'll be fine this year, then next year when T-jack is throwing him the rock, we'll see what happens

Minny will remember all the reasons they dumped him the first go round. Ever consider re-marrying your ex-wife?

 

[Bella*chick]

Folks........ It's pretty simple. Remember Moss came to us amid a lot of trepidation. Many argued for, based on his talent, other said.... No way, he'll turn into a cancer, look at his history.

We've all forgotten about his passed because of everything he's done for us.

Right now, I'm reminded of Denny Green's CLASSIC RANT that is fitting.

Folks, it turns out that Randy Moss is who we thought he was.

He's a self-absorbed, petulant, me-first talent that is fine when things are going well, but a team-killer when they aren't. He was in Minny the first go round, Oak, and now NE...... Anyone want to take bets on how it ends up for the Minny in the end? It'll be fine this year, then next year when T-jack is throwing him the rock

Minny will remember all the reasons they dumped him the first go round. Ever consider re-marrying your ex-wife.

Agree, except I think it needs to be narrowed even further....Moss is fine when things are going well for the team because of HIM. If he's a focal point of a great team, well, it's all good. But we're 3-1 and we won an awesome road game the other night and Randy wasn't fine with it by a long shot.

 

[Patriot_in_NY]

Agree, except I think it needs to be narrowed even further....Moss is fine when things are going well for the team because of HIM. If he's a focal point of a great team, well, it's all good. But we're 3-1 and we won an awesome road game the other night and Randy wasn't fine with it by a long shot.

Point taken

 

[Teenuh]

I don't believe that the pats would trade a guy like moss unless they had to.

its not like they got drunk and did this as a prank

Yeah, Bill and Kraft would never do something like that. They would never trade players that were an important part of their offense or defense like Moss, Seymour, Vrabel, Branch, etc... No, never...

 

[ctpatsfan77]

I wish we got back more, and thought the Vikings would be way more desperate with the Rice injury and Harvin's migraines, but after all this info has been leaked, I now realize we were the desperate ones. The situation was so bad that we couldn't wait it out, couldn't even bring Moss back to practice for a few days because he would have been a disruptive presence.

The main reason why it was only a 3rd is that this is, apparently, just a rental. Even the Vikings aren't sure they're going to resign him long-term.

 

[Patspsycho]

Agree, except I think it needs to be narrowed even further....Moss is fine when things are going well for the team because of HIM. If he's a focal point of a great team, well, it's all good. But we're 3-1 and we won an awesome road game the other night and Randy wasn't fine with it by a long shot.

That is a very excellent point!

 

[ctpatsfan77]

The thing that sucks is that by acting like a self-centered child, Moss got traded somewhere he wanted to go, where he thinks he'll be able to ring up big numbers. Acting badly gets you some of what you want - this lesson Moss has now taught the youngsters on the Pats and there is no undoing it.

Except that what he most wanted was a big, fat contract to stay and play with Tom. . . . and that opportunity is gone.

 

[kkpat]

One more thing: BB might have felt that O'Brien is being intimidated by Moss which might have made O'Brien call plays in JETS game relying on MOSS too much. Atleast, the news came out that he was yelling at O'Brien during MNF. He won't accept games in which he has to be relegated as DECOY.

I remember the Giants Superbowl game in which Brady tried 3 deep balls at the end even with one minute to go instead of dink and dunk to get a field goal to tie the game.

 

[stinkypete]

I remember the Giants Superbowl game in which Brady tried 3 deep balls at the end even with one minute to go instead of dink and dunk to get a field goal to tie the game.

Exactly. Adding Moss gave us the most explosive offense in history for 10 weeks, but it killed what the Patriots used to do great. They used to dink and dunk, they used to control the clock and they used to come up big when they absolutely had to. Moss ruined it.

The Buffalo game hinted a return to an old style Patriots offense and the Miami game furthered that development. This was a winning formula and I want to see it return even if it takes an extra year.

 

[upstater1]

One more thing: BB might have felt that O'Brien is being intimidated by Moss which might have made O'Brien call plays in JETS game relying on MOSS too much. Atleast, the news came out that he was yelling at O'Brien during MNF. He won't accept games in which he has to be relegated as DECOY.

I remember the Giants Superbowl game in which Brady tried 3 deep balls at the end even with one minute to go instead of dink and dunk to get a field goal to tie the game.

OhmyGOD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Really now?

This is becoming impossible on this board.

Dink and dunk?

Do you realize there were 30 seconds left in the game and the Patriots were like, at their 15?

I don't know what to say anymore people.