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Marshall Faulk thinks Brady is the MVP over Peyton

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by Salva135, Dec 4, 2012.

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  1. Salva135

    Salva135 Rookie

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  2. Patsfan_22

    Patsfan_22 Rookie

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    That was on saturday, Manning had a better game than Brady did so he's probably back in the lead. This thing is so close, it's week to week - we won't know until the last week of the season really.

    Also when it's not cut and dry the analysts on NFLN almost always take opposing sides to fuel the debate.
  3. patriotsgoat

    patriotsgoat Banned

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    Manning MVP? Absolutely NOT. He's getting sympathy votes just because he was hurt and came back.
  4. ausbacker

    ausbacker Brady > Manning. PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #51 Jersey

    Marshall Faulk and a common sense argument does not compute. It's been a pleasure knowing most of you on Patsfans. I'm going to see about those Mayan prophecies.
  5. DarrylS

    DarrylS PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Did Marshall Faulk have a brief encounter with a bolt of lightening???
  6. RelocatedPatFan

    RelocatedPatFan Rookie

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    Maybe Marshall was playing opposite day with his kids and forget to switch his brain back to normal mode?
  7. Gumby

    Gumby Rookie

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    Yeah, pretty shocking that in a put-up segment by ESPN where 2 guys are supposed to take opposing opinions on particular issues and you have 2 TB-haters who host the segment; that a Brady-hater drew the short straw. ........

    I mean he only had a 50% chance of drawing it. What kind of luck is that for him.:bricks:

    I hope his breakfast curdled in his stomach as he had to read the script. ;)

    On the other hand; at least Marshall can annunciate his words. I hope Irvin gets displaced SOON by one of these Pats (Harrison) who retired who can at least communicate.

    anyway. Thanks for link. The only highlight to me.

    MF: Michael, "There were 3 guys, YOU CAME IN THIRD!!!" LOL. :D
  8. nowayback

    nowayback Rookie

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    worse game? played against the worse pass defense tb 32nd miami 27th, tb 17sacks miami 33 sacks. manning 0 and 0 sacks and qb hits, brady 4 sacks 7 qb hits. rating , yea manning better. stats were pretty similar, in my eyes :)

    let manning win mvp, fact is the only ones who care about mvp are the fans. Brady was defintely off target on sunday. sometimes.
  9. shmessy

    shmessy Maude Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I read this thread and can only wonder - - were all of you (other than Patsfan22 and Gumby) born yesterday?????

    Do you know how television shows work???

    There is a script. This is set up as a debate. They are standing on opposite sides of the table.

    Did you see them agree on any of the other questions???? You do understand how that works, right?

    Irvin got the Peyton script and Faulk got the Brady script.

    Hey guys, I have some premium oceanfront Iowa real estate to sell you - - who wants to start the bidding?
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2012
  10. sevengables_2207

    sevengables_2207 Rookie

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    Not that regular season awards are of paramount importance, if Brady lights up the Texans and Fortyniners defenses and the Pats run the table then the award is his to lose... in all likelihood IMO.

    As for Faulk and those LCD shows on NFL Network and BSPN, they are all scripted and opinons of the panel probably do not reflect what they actually believe.
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2012
  11. Froob

    Froob Rookie

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    Right now, I don't see how you can say absolutely not to either. Pretty much tied at this point both have good teams around them and both putting up good numbers with Brady with a few less picks. Going to come down to the houston game.
  12. stcjones

    stcjones Rookie

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  13. RelocatedPatFan

    RelocatedPatFan Rookie

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    On second thought, our collective opinions should have been.

    I still don't care what Marshall Faulk thinks :D
  14. BradyManny

    BradyManny Rookie

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    Considering Peyton is 0-3 against teams that don't suck, I don't know how he can be the clearcut MVP. Let's see how he fares against the Ravens in a couple weeks.
  15. patsfan13

    patsfan13 Hall of Fame Poster PatsFans.com Supporter

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    These shows are SCRIPTED, they are for ENTERTAINMENT, so for this SHOW Irving was the Manning guy and Faulk was the Brady guy............

    Say after me espn and nfl network are for ENTERTAINMENT.
  16. borg

    borg Rookie

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    MVP......easily Manning. The Denver offense is now completely on Manning's shoulders unlike the more balanced O of NE. The Pats have out rushed Denver by 450 yds. The Pats running attack has out scored Denver's rusher by 13 TDs (19-6). It's all on Manning. Defenses know that, yet Manning is able to be 3.3% more accurate than Brady while tossing 4 more TDs. I'm forgiving Mannings higher INTs simply because this is his first year with this receiving corps. Clearly he and his WRs weren't in synch to start the season.....They are now.
    With McGahee gone, what choice does Denver have but to lean on Manning. Voters will look at the bounty of Pats rushing TDs and realize that New England isn't as reliant on Brady as Denver is on Manning. The vote won't even be close. And if Denver ends up 13-3....it will be a landslide vote.
    Remember...it's not a vote on who's better, it's a vote on who's most VALUABLE....and the stats clearly show one team needs their QB to perform at a very high level to cover up deficiencies. Sorry to be the voice of truth....hope I'm wrong

    And to add some perspective....I always sided with Brady for MVP during Manning's Indy days because Brady did more with less. Manning was surrounded with #1 draft picks at most every skill position while Brady worked magic with lesser accomplished players (ignoring 2007). Now Brady is surrounded by the best of the best at TE and slot WR, and above ave guys at 2nd TE and RB....while Manning is in his first year with some very young talent. D Thomas is a stud no doubt....and if he and Manning can stay healthy together for a few more seasons, I expect Thomas to be in the elite conversation soon. In fact, I'd bet a few coins that Manning chose Denver because of Thomas' potential. And Manning will receive the bulk of the praise for unleashing Thomas' potential (Archie will probably get some credit too)
  17. Uncle Rico

    Uncle Rico Rookie

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    Faulk also pick the Pats in SB 46 ...
  18. Deus Irae

    Deus Irae PatsFans.com Retired Jersey Club PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Only in the minds of those who don't take the time to actually think about it. And "forgiving" the ints is the same as saying "I'm completely biased and looking for excuses".
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2012
  19. PATRIOTSFANINPA

    PATRIOTSFANINPA Rookie

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    Peyton is certainly comeback player of the year,but MVP.....not so sure about that.
  20. Yehoodi

    Yehoodi Rookie

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    I dont value passing TDs over rushing TDs as much as others might . . . bottom line I look at how many TDs the offense has scored as a better indicator, especially of the passing TDs are close . . .

    If I a QB leads his team down the field for a TD drive and then at first goal from the one yard line does two play actions fakes and on the second try get a passing TD, how is he more effective that a similar QB who hands the ball off to a RB on 1st down so he can punch it in for a TD . . . the Denver-NE is good example of this, while Brady is handing the ball off to his running backs for an easy TD, Manning keeps the ball and throws it into the endzone . . . so he "looks" better, but to an trained eye its the same . . . well the QB contributed the important things, getting his team first and goal inside teh 3 yard line . . .

    i think the packers only have 2 rushing TDs and the saints 5, so if you are a qB i n a offense that passing alot in the red zone, when a run could be just as effective, the QB will benefit . . .

    but for me, when the numbers are close, i will look to the overall TD drives as a tiebreaker . . .
  21. SVN

    SVN Rookie

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    Frankly Luck should be considered for MVP if they really mean MVP.
  22. Avenger

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    No, AP deserves it
  23. AndyJohnson

    AndyJohnson PatsFans.com Veteran PatsFans.com Supporter

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    A broken clock is right twice a day.
    I didn't look at the clip, but I saw Faulk discussing this on Sunday. At one point he says "special teams: there kicker missed a FG to lose the game against Baltimore, so they have no special teams either". Ironically this was right after the special teams helped destroy the Jets, not long after both KO and punt returns for Tds, and with coverage units that I do not remember giving anything up all year. What a tool.
  24. AndyJohnson

    AndyJohnson PatsFans.com Veteran PatsFans.com Supporter

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    As is the argument that Manning is more relied upon. That in and of itself is meaningless, unless they are AS GOOD OR BETTER.
    Doing as well with a lesser supporting cast is an argument, doing worse while blaming a lesser supporting cast is an excuse.
  25. Sparetire

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    AP deserves both.
  26. borg

    borg Rookie

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    Good stuff. Guess you really believe Manning is doing worse.
    But lets add a little context to the "Manning Comes to Denver" story.
    Denver 2011 vs Denver 2012

    Passing 2011 vs 2012
    Passing yds/game....152 yds vs 283 yds
    Passing TDs/game...1.25 TDs vs 2.42 TDs

    Rushing 2011 vs 2012
    Rushing yds/game 164.5 yds vs 103 yds
    Rushing TDs...11 total vs 6 YTD

    Points 2011 vs 2012
    19 points/game vs 29 points/game

    Wins 2011 vs 2012
    8 Total vs 9 wins with 4 to go

    These stats alone is why Manning will walk away with the award. The D and skill players are mostly the same as 2011, but Denver should increase wins by 3-4 games by scoring 10 points more /game than 2011........the Manning Effect.

    Brady 2011 vs 2012

    Brady throwing 32 yds/game fewer than 2011
    Brady on pace to throw 6 fewer TDs than 2011
    Wins... 13 vs 9 YTD with 13 being the possible top

    Brady didn't win the MVP in 2011 with those stats....yet you expect him to get the trophy with lesser numbers.

    Then.....factor in the improved 2012 rushing of NE....+30 yds/game this year with 19 TDs YTD vs 18 for all 2011.

    Lastly...here's the list of the last 5 MVP winners...Rodgers, Brady, Manning, Manning, Brady. I see a list of winners that carried their team despite below average running attacks. You may not agree, but voters heavily factor in the disproportionate amount of offense these players had to contribute. Will Brady get votes for leading a balanced attack?
    When its all said and done, one guy will be a viewed as elevating his team while our guy will be viewed as maintaining his consistently high level of play.
  27. goheels22002

    goheels22002 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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  28. BradyManny

    BradyManny Rookie

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    You are ignoring who their QB was last season - a guy who can't even beat out Mark Sanchez. Not to mention you ignore that Manning brought a bunch of Indy talent and scheme with him.

    Funny how Peyton Manning adds 10 points to what was a joke of an offense under Tebow and it's the reason he shouldn't win MVP. No one seems to mention that the Cassel-led offense scored 11 less PPG without Brady in 2008, everyone focuses on the 11 wins (which BTW, is 5 less than Brady provided).

    Ignore the noise. Peyton hasn't done anything deserving of the MVP yet. He might. But all he's really done so far is tear apart terrible defenses yet get soundly beaten by the good teams while trying to make it look close with some late garbage work.

    If he loses in the first round of the playoffs and wins the MVP award, then it will be another classic prototypical Peyton season.
  29. Uncle Rico

    Uncle Rico Rookie

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    Good argument, and this debate will go on til the end. (And I'm sure a new thread will pop up approximately every other day until then ...)

    There are so many standards people might think of when voting. But when Manning was winning it with the Colts, I always heard "the Pats can win without Brady, Colts can't without Manning, so Manning is most valuable to his team." By that standard, I'd point out again that Manning improved a team that was very young last year and still made the playoffs with Tim "The Jets wouldn't bench Buttfumble Sanchez until I was inactive" Tebow. Brady, meanwhile, has increasingly become the key figure in the Patriots' ongoing success.

    I do think Manning moved ahead a bit (I'm surprised how some analysts are so impressed with the win over the Bucs after the fact; I seem to recall every one saying beforehand Manning would pick that secondary apart). Brady has a chance to elevate himself in this race with strong outings against Houston and SF. Then again ... he'd be just as happy if the Pats went into championship mode and ran more in those games.
  30. Deus Irae

    Deus Irae PatsFans.com Retired Jersey Club PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Broncos with Tebow: 7-4
    Colts with Luck: 8-4

    Manning's been completely replaced in Indianapolis, and he's not done much more than replace Tebow in Denver. Manning doesn't even belong in the top 5 in the MVP vote.

    Brady
    Luck
    Peterson
    Ryan
    Watt
    RGIII

    all should be ahead of Manning in the MVP race.
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