Maroney's benching

[emoney_33]

When healthy Fred Taylor is our best running back BY FAR

A healthy Taylor probably would have already easily surpassed 1,000 yards by now...even in a RB committee and at his age he still can produce those 100 yard games we all desire to see since Dillon left.

"we all desire to see". I don't desire to see one single RB getting 1000+ yards, I couldn't care less. Our RBs this year have 1700+ yards, and ALL of them are healthy going into the last game of the season before the playoffs. THAT is what I care about. I don't know why some of you want so bad to have one guy running the ball, and then have a huge dropoff to the #2 running back. That means the depth is terrible and if that #1 rb gets hurt, your running game goes to hell. Not to mention the RB position is very prone to injury. It's clear that BB prefers the committee health approach. Having 3 GOOD running backs splitting carries is better than 1 great running back and 2 crappy backups.

 

[Boots Electric]

So, Maroney is the workhorse of this team practically all season and everyone loves him but the minute he fumbles (which was a TD and did not cost the Patriots any points), he is all of a sudden the worst guy in the world and Taylor is our star?

Please, it's painfully obvious that Taylor isn't ready to handle 15-20 carries a game. Maroney is this teams best back. Before the turnover, he had 22 yards on 5 carries. On that drive alone. Some has to do with the fumble, more has to do with the fact that they need him healthy for the playoffs.

 

[The Dynasty]

So, Maroney is the workhorse of this team practically all season and everyone loves him but the minute he fumbles (which was a TD and did not cost the Patriots any points), he is all of a sudden the worst guy in the world and Taylor is our star?

Please, it's painfully obvious that Taylor isn't ready to handle 15-20 carries a game. Maroney is this teams best back. Before the turnover, he had 22 yards on 5 carries. On that drive alone. Some has to do with the fumble, more has to do with the fact that they need him healthy for the playoffs.

I agree, fumbling is part of the game and it just so happens that 2 of Maroney's fumbles have been on the goal line. Obviously this isnt where you want these fumbles to happen, but he has only fumbled 4 times all season, that isnt that bad when compared to the rest of the league. Cut this guy some slack, just last week everyone was loving him and no hes back to being in everyones dog house.

 

[MrBigglesWorth]

I'm a Maroney supporter

 

[RobertWeathers]

only had 5 attempts and it is unlikely he would have fumbled again).

Right- BB had seen enough and put him on the bench for coughing it up.

Maroney never was fumble prone and I'm not buying that this isn't more of an abberation due to dumb luck or something easily correctable.

I'm sure Maroney has worked very hard on ball security these last few weeks. The problem is that ihis efforts are not yielding the desired results.

You can find a 7 game stretch where Taylor fumbled once every 34 carries in 2003. Same can be said for Dillon in 2002 for example.

I'm sure you can find stretches of "fumble-itis for every great RB. The problem is that Maroney is doing two things 1) fumbling during the playoff stretch drive and 2) at inopportune times/places during the game and is costing the team points.

Your once every 28 attempts stat is disingenuous at best.

It's a trend. Can't dismiss recent trends with a good month of samples. In his last 116 carries, Maroney has fumbled 4 times. Not sure how much more you would need to conclude he is going through a stretch where ball security is a given with him.

He definitely needs to hold on to the rock, but I think people are overly stating the issue. He has 4 fumbles on the year, that is not an eye-popping number for a running back in the NFL.

I agree but in a RBs last 116 carries, 4 fumbles it is not an overstatement. If the 4 fumbles were spread out over say 243 carries, I would concur.

He had always been EXTREMELY good at not coughing the ball up over his career. So he dropped it a few times this year, I still don't see it as being a problem and I don't worry about it when he gets the ball.

What if he coughs it up vs Houston? Vs BAL in the playoffs. What is your threshold? You are 100% confident he gets the rock on the goal line in the playoffs? I think BB would disagree with you.

 

[PATSYLICIOUS]

So, Maroney is the workhorse of this team practically all season and everyone loves him but the minute he fumbles (which was a TD and did not cost the Patriots any points), he is all of a sudden the worst guy in the world and Taylor is our star?

Please, it's painfully obvious that Taylor isn't ready to handle 15-20 carries a game. Maroney is this teams best back. Before the turnover, he had 22 yards on 5 carries. On that drive alone. Some has to do with the fumble, more has to do with the fact that they need him healthy for the playoffs.

I like Maroney, and I still do despite the recent fumbles, but from week 1 I felt Taylor was the slightly better runner. I have more confidence in him to hit the cracks and put games away for us. Plus he has owned the Colts in the past. That said, I wouldn't be terribly disappointed if Maroney is the workhorse back in the playoffs, I would like to see him utlized as KR as well.

 

[aluminum seats]

I guess I'm surprised again. I thought Belichick's benching of Maroney was, on balance, a good move. It makes tangible to him the importance of holding onto the damn ball. (Again, it didn't used to be a problem for Maroney, but it has been lately.)

But having said that, I'm really surprised so many seem to think he won't be the top back in the playoffs, or Taylor will be. I think all the guys will get carries, but have no doubt Maroney will get a lot of them (and for the record, I think he'll be terrific in the playoffs.)

 

[emoney_33]

Right- BB had seen enough and put him on the bench for coughing it up.

Possible but don't act as if you know for a fact the exact reason for the "benching".

I'm sure Maroney has worked very hard on ball security these last few weeks. The problem is that ihis efforts are not yielding the desired results.

So if his "efforts" are the past few weeks, and the results are 1 fumble in 63 carries, are you saying that only 0 fumbles is acceptable?

I'm sure you can find stretches of "fumble-itis for every great RB. The problem is that Maroney is doing two things 1- fumbling during the playoff stretch drive and 2) at inopportune times/places during the game and is costing the team points.

This last fumble was the first in December, which is the "stretch drive". His 3 stretch 1-a-game was in November. You even said yourself you can find stretches for every RB, but yet are nitpicking on Maroney, even though he has proven throughout his career and in college that he is not prone to "fumble-itis" .

It's a trend. Can't dismiss recent trends with a good month of samples. In his last 116 carries, Maroney has fumbled 4 times.

You act as if "trends" are predictors of the future, just like Moss' numbers were a "trend".

It is what it is, stop trying to take tiny sample sizes of the latest data and extrapolate them into opinionated "trends".

In the same exact week span (10-12) that Maroney had 3 fumbles, Adrian Peterson had 4. Maybe the Vikings should be worried about trusting him in the playoffs and go with someone else. It's a trend!

I agree but in a RBs last 116 carries, 4 fumbles it is not an overstatement. If it the 4 fumbles were spread out over say 243 carries, I would concur.

Peterson's 4 fumbles were spread out over 67 carries. A "stretch" is usually going to have small total numbers, and thus the average is going to be exaggerated. Once again it's completely disingenous of you to attempt to use a tiny sample size's average to argue that Maroney is now fumble prone.

What if he coughs it up vs Houston? Vs BAL in the playoffs. What is your threshold?

And now it comes down to what ifs? What if Adrian Peterson fumbles 4 times and the vikings are one and done. Would that mean you would all of a sudden not want Adrian Peterson on your favorite team?

I will be disappointed if/when any turnover occurs, but just like a Brady INT isn't going to make me worried every time Brady throws the ball, I am not worried on all of a running-back's carries after a fumble, unless that player has a large sample and lengthy history indicating it to be an issue.

 

[PATRIOTSFANINPA]

Those of you think Taylor is our best RB need to stop living in the past. He's had the best career out of any of our RB's, but he is no longer the same RB he used to be.

As for seeing 100 yard games, we've seen plenty of them by our RB committee. From the looks of things, that's likely to be the norm for this team until BB retires.

Did you forget 1,600+ by Dillon a few years back?...its not like having a 1,000+ yard rusher has never happened before,If BB has a guy like that and he remains healthy he surely would love that I am sure just like he has the committee RB thing right now.

Taylor is getting long in the tooth but if he was healthy I think he would have had a very good season as his career winds down.

 

[emoney_33]

Did you forget 1,600+ by Dillon a few years back?...its not like having a 1,000+ yard rusher has never happened before,If BB has a guy like that and he remains healthy he surely would love that I am sure just like he has the committee RB thing right now.

Taylor is getting long in the tooth but if he was healthy I think he would have had a very good season as his career winds down.

Do you forget 05 and 06? What makes you think that BB is trying to get one RB ~25 carries a game?

Are you still failing to understand the beating a RB takes getting 25 carries a game? Are you still failing to understand the logic in splitting the carries?

 

[Deus Irae]

Did you forget 1,600+ by Dillon a few years back?...its not like having a 1,000+ yard rusher has never happened before,If BB has a guy like that and he remains healthy he surely would love that I am sure just like he has the committee RB thing right now.

Taylor is getting long in the tooth but if he was healthy I think he would have had a very good season as his career winds down.

Dillon had 1600+ in 2004. In 2005, even before Maroney arrived on the scene, Dillon's numbers plummeted to 733 yards. Watching his 'workhorse' running back age right before his eyes with nobody to help shoulder the burden seems to have been a learning moment for Belichick, because he's gone with RBBC ever since.

 

[Boots Electric]

Dillon had 1600 in 2004. In 2005, even before Maroney arrived on the scene, his numbers plummeted to 733 yards. Watching his 'workhorse' running back age right before his eyes seems to have been a learning moment for Belichick, because he's gone with RBBC ever since.

Exactly.

The only reason Dillon had such a great season was because there was virtually no one else and Belichick went against his principles (Belichick has only had 2 1,000 yard runners in his entire head coaching career).

When Dillon's numbers plummeted (as well as YPC) and was nagged by injuries, you know Belichick had wished he hadn't worked Dillon so much in 2004.

 

[MetalBleachers]

I agree that fumbling is an issue especially in the red zone, but you cannot completely give up on Maroney and not have him be apart of our offense.

He does things that Taylor, Morris and Faulk cannot do, but on the flip side those backs do things that Maroney cannot do. This team will be most effective by using all 4 of their backs. Each of the backs have their roles and strengths and all 4 should be used. One advantage the Pats have over other teams is that all of our backs have not played a full season and therefore will be at full strength in the playoffs. I dont see BB taking Maroney out of the playoff offense, with all the time he puts in with him I cant see him just completely ignoring him.

Agree. Would love to see Maroney start (adding a dynamic element to the O that the other backs do not), followed by Morris in spot duty, Faulk in the shotgun, and Taylor running out the clock. Not sure why so much passion is directed toward Maroney either way. He's a starting RB who makes mistakes but seems to have found his way over all. Would like to see him start next week and get his head on straight.

 

[Ochmed Jones]

Not sure why so much passion is directed toward Maroney either way. He's a starting RB who makes mistakes but seems to have found his way over all. Would like to see him start next week and get his head on straight.

I think you answered your own question. "He's a starting RB who makes mistakes."

As a former college FB, all I can say is coaches can barely handle an ocasional funble once every 100 - 200 touches. Once it becomes a pattern or a regular occurance, then coaches go nuts and corrective action needs to be implemented immediately.

 

[CrazyDave]

I'd rather see Maroney, since he's our best RB.

I'd have to respectfully disagree.
I'm not sure he is even #2.

 

[Patriots Nation NY]

heard on the big show intro some guy called in ...

Tiki Maroney ...

That was the funniest thing ive heard

 

[rabthepat]

“There will be changes here, there's no doubt about that.” - Bill Parcells

 

[emoney_33]

I'd have to respectfully disagree.
I'm not sure he is even #2.

Do you expect to be taken seriously?

 

[RobertWeathers]

Possible but don't act as if you know for a fact the exact reason for the "benching".

Give me a break. You know damn well why Maroney was pulled.

So if his "efforts" are the past few weeks, and the results are 1 fumble in 63 carries, are you saying that only 0 fumbles is acceptable?

4 fumbles over 252 carries is acceptable. 4 fumbles in a 116 carry stretch with 3 of them in the red zone and the 4th at the NYJ 34 is not.

This last fumble was the first in December, which is the "stretch drive". His 3 stretch 1-a-game was in November. You even said yourself you can find stretches for every RB, but yet are nitpicking on Maroney, even though he has proven throughout his career and in college that he is not prone to "fumble-itis" .

I've acknowledged in a latter thread Maroney's history of solid ball security. No matter how you slice it, 4 fumbles in 116 carries brings into question his ability to hang onto the football moving forward.

You act as if "trends" are predictors of the future, just like Moss' numbers were a "trend".

Yep, BB doesn't care about who is playing well lately either. Give me a break with that.

It is what it is, stop trying to take tiny sample sizes of the latest data and extrapolate them into opinionated "trends".

116 carries is 1/2 a season's worth of carries for most feature RBs and is certainly a quality sample size. You are going way overboard on this contrarian viewpoint of yours in not admitting Maroney is having ball security issues....

In the same exact week span (10-12) that Maroney had 3 fumbles, Adrian Peterson had 4. Maybe the Vikings should be worried about trusting him in the playoffs and go with someone else. It's a trend!

Different set of circumstances and players. For the record, Peterson does put the ball on the ground quite a bit, but because he is the cornerstone of their offense, a dynamic player and the team doesn't have anyone else like him who can produce at his level, that is why the team lives with his fumbles. Maroney is a part on this team and with other RBs on the roster that can produce, there are options.

Peterson's 4 fumbles were spread out over 67 carries. A "stretch" is usually going to have small total numbers, and thus the average is going to be exaggerated. Once again it's completely disingenous of you to attempt to use a tiny sample size's average to argue that Maroney is now fumble prone.

Last time I checked 67 does not equal 116.

And now it comes down to what ifs? What if Adrian Peterson fumbles 4 times and the vikings are one and done. Would that mean you would all of a sudden not want Adrian Peterson on your favorite team?

Who would you rather have? Chris Johnson, Stephen Jackson or Peterson? Hint: guess who fumbles the most.

I will be disappointed if/when any turnover occurs, but just like a Brady INT isn't going to make me worried every time Brady throws the ball, I am not worried on all of a running-back's carries after a fumble, unless that player has a large sample and lengthy history indicating it to be an issue.

We differ.

 

[JackBauer]

I'd have to respectfully disagree.
I'm not sure he is even #2.

Well that's certainly your right. But you'd be wrong.

I can't even believe there are still people out there who think Morris might be/is better than Maroney. Boggles the mind.