Mark Sanchez

[condon84]

Sanchez went full ****** yesterday.

 

[Yehoodi]

You're arguing based on seeding after the first 4 games of a season??????? Really???

How many games have the Pats played on the road?

Which team in the AFC is the only one to have 2 road wins so far?????

What seed were the Jets last year?

First off, I made a few points that moving forward things could get dicey if we don't button things up on defense . . .

YOU then responded (in post #60) with the question "Where does it put them in the standings?" I responded with an answer to where they are in the standings: #6 seed in the AFC

Is there something that you don't understand . . . don't be coming on here and asking a question about where a team is in the standings if you don't want to hear the answer . . . not that complicated is it?

 

[reflexblue]

Sanchez went full ****** yesterday.

I think the Ravens D made him go ''Full ******" yesterday.

 

[Banjo]

Patriots: 19 points
Jets: 34 points

There's a couple of stats for you, that's right the TERRIBLE Pats defense gave up 15 points less than the vaunted Jets defense.

I guess you didn't watch the game. you can't blame the Jets defense for points scored when they are not on the field. The Ravens returned three Mark Sanchez passes for touchdowns.

 

[Big-T]

I guess you didn't watch the game. you can't blame the Jets defense for points scored when they are not on the field. The Ravens returned three Mark Sanchez passes for touchdowns.

Those were the scores when both teams played @ Oakland, not the Patriots @ Oakland and Jets @ Ravens.

 

[WhiZa]

Ross Tucker made some good points about this on the radio today. Stats are for losers. Specifically how many yards you gave up. What matters most is how many points where scored against you. What does your red zone defense look like? Reiss hasn't put up those numbers yet, but I bet the Pats are looking pretty good there.

 

[Rob0729]

Ross Tucker made some good points about this on the radio today. Stats are for losers. Specifically how many yards you gave up. What matters most is how many points where scored against you. What does your red zone defense look like? Reiss hasn't put up those numbers yet, but I bet the Pats are looking pretty good there.

I still don't get why people are so hung up on yards especially garbage time yards. If the Pats stopped Campbell on that garbage time drive, he would have had 244 yards with no passing TDs and people would say the pass defense had a pretty good game. Since he passed for 99 yards and a TD down by three scores with under 3 minutes left in the game, everyone is talking how horrible the defense was.

Yards are a good measuring tool for individual skills players on the offense. It is horrible to judge an offense or defense as a unit primarily on yards. Yards can be deceiving for a defense especially if a defense is playing soft defense defending a huge lead in the fourth quarter like the Pats did vs. the Dolphins, Chargers, and Raiders.

 

[SVN]

more worried about offense trying to figure out the jets D after the playoff loss especially if hernandez doesnt play. if brady can figure the jets D out and not make mistakes...wont matter what sanchez does.

 

[Rob0729]

more worried about offense trying to figure out the jets D after the playoff loss especially if hernandez doesnt play. if brady can figure the jets D out and not make mistakes...wont matter what sanchez does.

I am not so worried about the offense. You can rarely beat Belichick and Brady using the same gameplan twice. Also, the fact that Ridley is emerging and the Jets haven't been playing good run defense this year also gives the Pats an additional element that they didn't utilize in the playoffs last year.

 

[BradyFTW!]

I still don't get why people are so hung up on yards especially garbage time yards. If the Pats stopped Campbell on that garbage time drive, he would have had 244 yards with no passing TDs and people would say the pass defense had a pretty good game. Since he passed for 99 yards and a TD down by three scores with under 3 minutes left in the game, everyone is talking how horrible the defense was.

Yards are a good measuring tool for individual skills players on the offense. It is horrible to judge an offense or defense as a unit primarily on yards. Yards can be deceiving for a defense especially if a defense is playing soft defense defending a huge lead in the fourth quarter like the Pats did vs. the Dolphins, Chargers, and Raiders.

The same point can be used for the Miami and San Diego games, as well. Our defense isn't great, but it's not as bad as 500 YPG suggests. We've given up a lot of garbage time drives and points, and while I would rather that we didn't, I'm not really stressing out over it either.

 

[shmessy]

First off, I made a few points that moving forward things could get dicey if we don't button things up on defense . . .

YOU then responded (in post #60) with the question "Where does it put them in the standings?" I responded with an answer to where they are in the standings: #6 seed in the AFC

Is there something that you don't understand . . . don't be coming on here and asking a question about where a team is in the standings if you don't want to hear the answer . . . not that complicated is it?

I asked because #6 seed is FINE (especially because no one has played more on the road or has won as many road games in 2011- - so it's definitely "advantage-Pats" so far). What seed were the Jets last year? What seed were the Ravens in 2009? All that counts is getting into the playoffs and being on a roll.

I completely agree that the Defense needs to get better.

However, we have post-2007 posters on this board spouting that it is "the WORST defense in the NFL" and that "it can't stop NOBODY".

This type of nonsense is consistently being spewed by posters who back up their statements with yardage stats alone. Not scoring. Not red-zone. Not turnover. Not the fact that the 4 teams played by the Pats are 7-5 in non Pats games and that 3 of the 4 games were on the road. Nope. Just yardage.

The 2007 Patriots spawned an entire group of new football fans that were turned on by the stats.

 

[shmessy]

I guess you didn't watch the game. you can't blame the Jets defense for points scored when they are not on the field. The Ravens returned three Mark Sanchez passes for touchdowns.

He was referring to the points given up by the Jets the week before against the COMMON OPPONENT RAIDERS, Banjo.

Ironic from how you wrote it above that YOU didn't get the reference that everyone else here immediately understood.

 

[SEA_Pat]

The same point can be used for the Miami and San Diego games, as well. Our defense isn't great, but it's not as bad as 500 YPG suggests. We've given up a lot of garbage time drives and points, and while I would rather that we didn't, I'm not really stressing out over it either.

Exactly.

In case all of the idiots who keep on :deadhorse: about the D, it may not have occurred to you that throughout the BB reign, he ALWAYS trades yards and points for time when he knows he has as big of a lead as he needs to win the game. He plays percentages, and doesn't give a crap about statistics other than the score. Because that's all that counts, actually.

 

[shmessy]

I still don't get why people are so hung up on yards especially garbage time yards.

Because many fans came aboard after the 2007 season and the fantasy football craze.

 

[Deus Irae]

I asked because #6 seed is FINE (especially because no one has played more on the road or has won as many road games in 2011- - so it's definitely "advantage-Pats" so far). What seed were the Jets last year? What seed were the Ravens in 2009? All that counts is getting into the playoffs and being on a roll.

I completely agree that the Defense needs to get better.

However, we have idiots on this board spouting that it is "the worst defense in the NFL" and that "it can't stop nobody".

This type of nonsense is consistently being spewed by posters who back up their statements with yardage stats alone. Not scoring. Not red-zone. Not turnover. Just yardage.

The 2007 Patriots spawned an entire group of new football fans that were turned on by the stats.

I don't know where I'd rank the defense overall, because I think it's too early to go about evaluating every single team in the NFL, it is the worst defense in the NFL by more than one measure. They are giving up a full 50+ yards more per game than the next worst team. Also, they are second worst in the number of first downs allowed, second worst in 3rd down percentage, 4th worst in number of penalties against, 6th worst in penalty yardage allowed, 23rd against the run in ypc, tied for last against the pass in ypc, and by far the worst in yards allowed per play (7.2 v. 6.5 for the next worst). Now, it is "only" the 21st worst team in the league in terms of points allowed.

As you know, however, while points allowed is the bottom line stat for a defense, it's not a standalone statistic, and it's not the sole determinant as to how good a defense is. While I think the defense should improve if some key injured players (Haynesworth comes first to mind) can get healthy and up to speed, the reality is that the defense has been pretty darned bad so far.

 

[rojo8401]

Exactly.

In case all of the idiots who keep on :deadhorse: about the D, it may not have occurred to you that throughout the BB reign, he ALWAYS trades yards and points for time when he knows he has as big of a lead as he needs to win the game. He plays percentages, and doesn't give a crap about statistics other than the score. Because that's all that counts, actually.

This is a very good observation and I agree.

I think most people are concerned with the Pats dismal playoff performances the last few years. I actually think Brady is more to blame for those quick exits than the defense though.

It's probably that the bend don't break philosophy of giving up yards and tightening in the red zone doesn't work as well against playoff-caliber teams though.

 

[vyrago]

Exactly.

In case all of the idiots who keep on :deadhorse: about the D, it may not have occurred to you that throughout the BB reign, he ALWAYS trades yards and points for time when he knows he has as big of a lead as he needs to win the game. He plays percentages, and doesn't give a crap about statistics other than the score. Because that's all that counts, actually.

Has that second to last sentence always been true? Sea_Pat, no kidding? Then what's all this weeping, moaning and gnashing of teeth about yards given up. Why give a rat's tushie about how many yds the other team made if the final score is all that counts. Are you yard harpies all so puritan that you want us to feel really unworthy and lowdown bad even when we win?

 

[Deus Irae]

This is a very good observation and I agree.

I think most people are concerned with the Pats dismal playoff performances the last few years. I actually think Brady is more to blame for those quick exits than the defense though.

It's probably that the bend don't break philosophy of giving up yards and tightening in the red zone doesn't work as well against playoff-caliber teams though.

Has that second to last sentence always been true? Sea_Pat, no kidding? Then what's all this weeping, moaning and gnashing of teeth about yards given up. Why give a rat's tushie about how many yds the other team made if the final score is all that counts. Are you yard harpies all so puritan that you want us to feel really unworthy and lowdown bad even when we win?

The Patriots have usually not been terrible in yards allowed. Here are some of the yearly Patriots defensive rankings, in yardage:

2003 - #7
2004 - #9
2006 - #6
2007 - #4
2008 - #10
2009 - #11

Last year, the team dropped from #11 to #25. This year, they are currently dead last.

The famous "bend but don't break" defense has really only shown an optimal return in the 2001 season (although the 2010 season showed a dramatic difference in yards v. points as well, oddly enough). In all other seasons, the points allowed ranking has been moderately close to the yards allowed ranking. It's usually been a successful style, but it's not as if the team generally ranks bottom 4 in yards allowed while being top 4 in points allowed.

 

[Darolyn72]

Deus,

Stats sometimes don't lie. WHERE IS THE TALENT? The fanboys don't want to admit there is no talent on the defense. And why is that? Because then they would have to admit LORD BILL made mistakes. Look at the talent on the Ravens defense. Packers defense, Titans defense, and you could name 25 other teams that have more talent. Where is their Suggs?? Ed Reed? Ngati? and Lewis.

And I am not necessarily talking about THESE players because 2 of them are hall of famers, I am talking about the roles. Defensive line stud, pass rusher, play making safety and fearsome middle linebacker. The Pats once had this. (Seymour, Bruschi, Harrison, Willie or Vrabel) Now maybe they only have the Defensive Line Stud. The rest..Nope. Even Mayo, who fears Mayo? He's a great tackler, not a playmaker.

Now, I am expecting the fanboys to immediately start talking about Flacco. Well, I am ONLY talking about the defense. the Pats offense is ready to go. They can play with anyone. And as far as getting better, I always said, if you have too many ifs you don't have a great team. IF Albert, IF Dowling, IF the Safeties. So I expect Sanchez to have a good game this week. And I expect the same excuses from the fanboys.

 

[Belichick's Midget Army]

Exactly.

In case all of the idiots who keep on :deadhorse: about the D, it may not have occurred to you that throughout the BB reign, he ALWAYS trades yards and points for time when he knows he has as big of a lead as he needs to win the game. He plays percentages, and doesn't give a crap about statistics other than the score. Because that's all that counts, actually.

Yeah... the problem is that he no longer has a defense that bends but doesn't break. Or else the Patriots wouldn't have lost against the Bills after an 18 point advantage at HT.

They are being run over too fast. Look at the stats. They are the defense that allows the most 20+ plays in the league. That means the other team is moving up the field fast (like what happenned with Buffalo). It's not just long passes in 3rd and forever with a Prevent defense because the other team is throwing all it has. They are RUNNING 20+ plays on them. They are passing that much on 1st and 2nd down, in the 1st quarter. It has been unable to contain any QB so far, and had it not being for two stupid interceptions by Campbell, the Raiders might have won. Hell, take those away and Campbell had a hell of a game. Same with Henne, another crappy QB that looked great against the Pats but was screwed by his mental mistakes and his coach calling stupid plays.

Right now, whenever a team gets beyond Mayo, they have free room for another 20, 30 yards, because the safeties are incompetent. TEs could kill us, because Ninkovich and Guyton all of the sudden became awful at coverage and Chung is too small for them. There's no pass rushing, there's poor tackling, there's poor fielding. Even McCourty is playing bad.

This may not cost NE the Jets game. Luckly, their OL has collapsed under the weight of the incoming set of injuries. But Sanchez has won games against the Patriots before firing dragons and hoping his defense keeps the game two scores up to give him confidence. If that is the case (the defense keeping the Patriots offense from tying a game and the Jets pull to another TD), it will be hard to come back. Rex Ryan already has Brady's card: he can't make the long passes, so he stacks up the first 15 yards with zone coverage and hidden man-to-man, keeping two deep. It won't be as easy to score against them as it has been so far for them.

I don't think this team makes the AFCCG as it is. It seriously needs to improve their passing defense and get a pass rusher pronto.