List of possible salary cap cuts

[borisman]

They apparently know more about the pats than you do. We are NOT cutting one of the top linebackers in the league, and the heart and soul of the defense.

I'm not sure who you're refering to but if it's McGinest than it's all about the money. His cap # is about $8.5M. They will not give him the roster bonus he's due next week. He would've signed a restructured deal by now but with the new CBA in doubt there's no way they can do anything with anyone unless it's for small money.

 

[dryheat44]

So..you'd rather have Eric Alexander as a backup LB than Chad Brown.

O.K.....

178 career NFL games to 4 career NFL games (or 0 if you see Ryan Claridge in there instead of Alexander for Brown).

People need to lay off the guy. He was a speed-rushing OLB, and a damn good one at that, in his days with Seattle. The Pats expected him to be what Colvin was last year - the 3rd OLB. He was signed after Bruschi's stroke, but before Ted Johnson's retirement. Until Bruschi came back, Brown was the #1 MLB, a position he never held in his career. When Bruschi returned and Vrabel was moved inside, Brown was put back into the role the Patriots wanted him in. Thus, he started to perform fairly well near the end of the season and into the playoffs - at OLB.

The same can be said about Beisel. Surely, the Pats didn't see him starting at MLB for the first time in his career to start the season, in his first year with a new team. That's suicide for 99% of players. Expecting him to be a legitimate starter after a conversion while still learning a new defense is absolutely crazy. Now the Pats have him back in the desired role - learning behind Vrabel and Bruschi at MLB.

I'm with you. I like what Brown can do as a pass rushing OLB. He could even play McG's role to spell him. Belichick, out of necessity, tried to fit a square peg into a round hole. I also thought it was a good idea at the time, but it seems age and/or contact has dulled Brown's reflexes to play on the inside. But at the end of the season, I noticed him making some plays.

He's much more productive than TBC on the outside.

 

[arrellbee]

The same can be said about Beisel. Surely, the Pats didn't see him starting at MLB for the first time in his career to start the season, in his first year with a new team. That's suicide for 99% of players. Expecting him to be a legitimate starter after a conversion while still learning a new defense is absolutely crazy. Now the Pats have him back in the desired role - learning behind Vrabel and Bruschi at MLB.

Even after a whole season of coaching and practice, he was essentially worthless. In the final game he made one decent play moving across and stopping a sweep run when McGinest got sealed. But even then there was a 4 yard gain and if Bruschi were there instead it would probably have gone for almost no gain. It's hard to believe - but if you watch slow motion replays - Beisel actually hops out the way to avoid making contact when he could assist in a tackle to hold down a gain. And on a goal line play, he actually moved parallel to the runner instead of charging into him to see if he could stop him before he got to the goal line. There is more, but I'll not get into that. His instincts are simply worthless - imho he is absolutely uncoachable to do anything of value. Which is of considerable dismay to me because I really thought the Patriots might have stolen another real performer. He won't make it onto the final 53 man roster and I wouldn't be surprised to see him cut much before that if they need room for someone else.

 

[dryheat44]

Even after a whole season of coaching and practice, he was essentially worthless. In the final game he made one decent play moving across and stopping a sweep run when McGinest got sealed. But even then there was a 4 yard gain and if Bruschi were there instead it would probably have gone for almost no gain. It's hard to believe - but if you watch slow motion replays - Beisel actually hops out the way to avoid making contact when he could assist in a tackle to hold down a gain. And on a goal line play, he actually moved parallel to the runner instead of charging into him to see if he could stop him before he got to the goal line. There is more, but I'll not get into that. His instincts are simply worthless - imho he is absolutely uncoachable to do anything of value. Which is of considerable dismay to me because I really thought the Patriots might have stolen another real performer. He won't make it onto the final 53 man roster and I wouldn't be surprised to see him cut much before that if they need room for someone else.

I too put the "P" label on Beisel in regard to his attitude playing vs. the run. It was evident every time he got on the field.

 

[spacecrime]

They apparently know more about the pats than you do. We are NOT cutting one of the top linebackers in the league, and the heart and soul of the defense.

Heart and soul of the defense? This is what you said about Milloy.

 

[DaBruinz]

Who comes up with these lists? Seriously. The Ravens just signed Keydrick Vincent last season. Why would they cut him already? He played decently enough for them.

Players whom I would like the Patriots to look at if they were cut would include:
Brandon Short - LB
Mike Green - S
Seth Payne - NT
Eric Moulds - WR
Jimmy Smith - WR
Chris Bober - OL
Sam Madison - CB
Shelton Quarles - LB

 

[DaBruinz]

How does Corey Dillon fit into that equation?

Corey doesn't because he was never convicted of domestic violence. Only charged. And the charges were reduced to a misdemeanor.

 

[pats1]

Even after a whole season of coaching and practice, he was essentially worthless. In the final game he made one decent play moving across and stopping a sweep run when McGinest got sealed. But even then there was a 4 yard gain and if Bruschi were there instead it would probably have gone for almost no gain. It's hard to believe - but if you watch slow motion replays - Beisel actually hops out the way to avoid making contact when he could assist in a tackle to hold down a gain. And on a goal line play, he actually moved parallel to the runner instead of charging into him to see if he could stop him before he got to the goal line. There is more, but I'll not get into that. His instincts are simply worthless - imho he is absolutely uncoachable to do anything of value. Which is of considerable dismay to me because I really thought the Patriots might have stolen another real performer. He won't make it onto the final 53 man roster and I wouldn't be surprised to see him cut much before that if they need room for someone else.

I agree with Beisel. But it's a helluva lot different when, as he was in KC, a special teams ace and backup OLB/DE. MLB takes a lot more mind over athleticism. However, from what I saw watching the tape, Bruschi still had the drive, but he was a bit less effective than in the past. Was pushed to his knees by OGs many, many times.

Brown was seen rarely out on the field, though, after Bruschi got back. He made some nice plays when he was out there.

 

[DaBruinz]

I'm not sure who you're refering to but if it's McGinest than it's all about the money. His cap # is about $8.5M. They will not give him the roster bonus he's due next week. He would've signed a restructured deal by now but with the new CBA in doubt there's no way they can do anything with anyone unless it's for small money.

This is BS. The Pats could have resigned McGinest by now with a deal for a 6-7 million SB that reduced his salary to the vet minimum. That would reduce McGinest cap hit by 4 million and still give McGinest the same pay he'd get this year with the roster bonus.

 

[DaBruinz]

Even after a whole season of coaching and practice, he was essentially worthless. In the final game he made one decent play moving across and stopping a sweep run when McGinest got sealed. But even then there was a 4 yard gain and if Bruschi were there instead it would probably have gone for almost no gain. It's hard to believe - but if you watch slow motion replays - Beisel actually hops out the way to avoid making contact when he could assist in a tackle to hold down a gain. And on a goal line play, he actually moved parallel to the runner instead of charging into him to see if he could stop him before he got to the goal line. There is more, but I'll not get into that. His instincts are simply worthless - imho he is absolutely uncoachable to do anything of value. Which is of considerable dismay to me because I really thought the Patriots might have stolen another real performer. He won't make it onto the final 53 man roster and I wouldn't be surprised to see him cut much before that if they need room for someone else.

Sorry, but you are wrong on Beisel. Totally wrong. But you will learn.

 

[mgteich]

Yes, I guess many have used this phrase more than once, me for Law and McGinist, and perhaps I used it for Harrison or Bruschi, but I don't think so. As was already posted, would you really prefer Eric Alexander or a rookie staring at OLB? Or maybe you prefer TBC or Chatham?

Milloy was a lot of things, but never the heart and soul of the defense. I think Milloy was screwed by the team. And BTW, lots of players figured out to insist on roster bonuses from then on to prevent the same thing happening to them.

Heart and soul of the defense? This is what you said about Milloy.

 

[mgteich]

And that is exactly what they are likely to do by March 10th, by which time everyone will know the rules. An uncapped rules might make the structure a bit different, but the patriots should restructure him (as they ahve about five times) in any case.

This is BS. The Pats could have resigned McGinest by now with a deal for a 6-7 million SB that reduced his salary to the vet minimum. That would reduce McGinest cap hit by 4 million and still give McGinest the same pay he'd get this year with the roster bonus.

 

[arrellbee]

Sorry, but you are wrong on Beisel. Totally wrong. But you will learn.

All you have to do is watch his play in slo-mo replay. But, whatever. Let's make a date to meet back here after final cuts.

 

[arrellbee]

This is BS. The Pats could have resigned McGinest by now with a deal for a 6-7 million SB that reduced his salary to the vet minimum. That would reduce McGinest cap hit by 4 million and still give McGinest the same pay he'd get this year with the roster bonus.

However much I admire Willie and some of the astounding plays he has made in crucial situations (that probably led to 1 or more superbowls), the point still is - does it make sense to pay a 35 year old - 35 year old - linebacker another 6-7 million dollar bonus ?? ?? ?? I REALLY don't think so. And it is not as though the Patriots haven't done right by Willie either. Over the last 5 seasons he has received over $20M if I read Miguel's numbers correctly. That is big BIG bucks for a linebacker. Willie benefitted from one of the unrealistically large contracts that the Patriots were handing out prior to BB/SP. If ANYTHING, if the Patriots feel he can still contribute, with all the money they have paid him, it wouldn't hurt for him to give the Patriots a year at minimum veteran salary.

 

[mgteich]

And most of us REALLY think that a $6-7M bonus for Willie for a three year contract is the right thing to do for the team.

However much I admire Willie and some of the astounding plays he has made in crucial situations (that probably led to 1 or more superbowls), the point still is - does it make sense to pay a 35 year old - 35 year old - linebacker another 6-7 million dollar bonus ?? ?? ?? I REALLY don't think so. And it is not as though the Patriots haven't done right by Willie either. Over the last 5 seasons he has received over $20M if I read Miguel's numbers correctly. That is big BIG bucks for a linebacker. Willie benefitted from one of the unrealistically large contracts that the Patriots were handing out prior to BB/SP. If ANYTHING, if the Patriots feel he can still contribute, with all the money they have paid him, it wouldn't hurt for him to give the Patriots a year at minimum veteran salary.

 

[arrellbee]

And most of us REALLY think that a $6-7M bonus for Willie for a three year contract is the right thing to do for the team.

I think I get it. He's worth more than Harrison or Bruschi or Vrabel. Got it. Let's hope that Belichick and Pioli understand that.

 

[borisman]

This is BS. The Pats could have resigned McGinest by now with a deal for a 6-7 million SB that reduced his salary to the vet minimum. That would reduce McGinest cap hit by 4 million and still give McGinest the same pay he'd get this year with the roster bonus.

You are high if you think this will happen. It doesn't matter what we want to happen. Be realistic and think what BB/SP will do. Did Troy Brown get big money from the Pats last year? Willie is in the same boat this year.

 

[dryheat44]

You are high if you think this will happen. It doesn't matter what we want to happen. Be realistic and think what BB/SP will do. Did Troy Brown get big money from the Pats last year? Willie is in the same boat this year.

Maybe from a contract standpoint, but Willie is a lot more productive than Troy is these days. He's not going anywhere though.

 

[DaBruinz]

However much I admire Willie and some of the astounding plays he has made in crucial situations (that probably led to 1 or more superbowls), the point still is - does it make sense to pay a 35 year old - 35 year old - linebacker another 6-7 million dollar bonus ?? ?? ?? I REALLY don't think so. And it is not as though the Patriots haven't done right by Willie either. Over the last 5 seasons he has received over $20M if I read Miguel's numbers correctly. That is big BIG bucks for a linebacker. Willie benefitted from one of the unrealistically large contracts that the Patriots were handing out prior to BB/SP. If ANYTHING, if the Patriots feel he can still contribute, with all the money they have paid him, it wouldn't hurt for him to give the Patriots a year at minimum veteran salary.

Arrellbee -
1st off, Willie just turned 34 in December, not 35. 2ndly, McGinest is still the Patriots BEST pass rusher at OLB. Giving him a 6-7 million dollar bonus over the course of a 4 year extension means that Willie doesn't take a pay cut for this year and it actually lessens the cap hit by almost 4 million. You adjust the contract to be cap friendly and keep one of your best players around.

Also, while Willie's megadeal contract was signed in 1998, its gone through numerous iterations including a 5 year extension under Pioli and BB. Also, it should be noted that 1 year after signing that extension, it was reported that Willie's contract was renegotiated after the 2001 season and that he essentially gave back 2 million to the Pats. Since then, Willie has "renegotiated" his contract every year. Granted, most of the renegotiation has just been guaranteeing salary and treating it like a signing bonus, but he's done everything for this team.

 

[DaBruinz]

You are high if you think this will happen. It doesn't matter what we want to happen. Be realistic and think what BB/SP will do. Did Troy Brown get big money from the Pats last year? Willie is in the same boat this year.

How am I high? Willie isn't in the same boat as Troy and that is what you fail to understand. Troy was reduced to being a PART TIME PLAYER. That is why the Patriots couldn't afford to give Troy the money. Willie is still a FULL TIME PLAYER. Do you understand the difference?

Also, a 6-7 million signing bonus is not big money anymore. Not sure where you've been the last few years, but its chump change nowadays for good players. And if you spread it out over the course of a 4 year deal, it minimizes the cap hits that the team takes. And it can be done whether the CBA is extended or not.