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Lets stop measuring Obama's ears for Mount Rushmore

Discussion in 'Political Discussion' started by cupofjoe1962, Feb 9, 2009.

  1. cupofjoe1962

    cupofjoe1962 In the Starting Line-Up

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    From what I have seen of Obama so far, I am less than impressed.

    He is in over his head & he is stimulus plan is a disaster.
    We are a country in crisis, and he adds 3/4 of a trillion dollar spending bill with a phony tag
    of a stimulus bill.

    Nobody will receive a dollar in tax cuts until they file their taxes in 2010.
    He is already breaking his campaign pledge on who will receive tax cuts.

    Socialism is now a reality.

    My grade for Obama so far D -
     
    Last edited: Feb 9, 2009
  2. Wildo7

    Wildo7 Totally Full of It

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    I'm so surprised.

    P.S. what you call "socialism" (which has nothing to do with socialism whatsoever) is the reality for every ex-imperial power in the world. It's just a natural progression.
     
    Last edited: Feb 9, 2009
  3. Michael

    Michael Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #12 Jersey

    Actually he said, before the fools elected him, he would let the present tax cuts expire. So we'll actually be coughing up more in 2010 not less.
     
  4. IcyPatriot

    IcyPatriot ------------- PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #87 Jersey

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG][​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Feb 9, 2009
  5. cupofjoe1962

    cupofjoe1962 In the Starting Line-Up

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    I hope you are wrong..... I got this link from Wildo during the election.
    I hope he is right and you are wrong.

    Taxes under Obama and McCain
    Taxes under Obama and McCain
    Click on the pdf file

    Senator McCain would permanently extend all
    of the income tax cuts enacted by President
    Bush. Senator Obama extends almost all of the
    income tax cuts except those that apply to highincome
    households: he would raise the top two
    income tax rates, currently 33 and 35 percent, to
    their Clinton-era levels of 36 and 39.6 percent;
    restrict the value of exemptions and deductions
    for high-income households; and raise the top tax
    rate on dividends and capital gains to 20 percent
    from 15 percent.
    Both candidates would limit but
    not repeal the alternative minimum tax (AMT)

    From what I can see this would affect individuals
    making more than $143,500 or Married filing jointly or Qualifying widow(er)
    making more than $174,700
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jobs_and_Growth_Tax_Relief_Reconciliation_Act_of_2003
    Page down until you see the Tax bracket comparison
     
    Last edited: Feb 10, 2009
  6. Kdo5

    Kdo5 Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

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    Obama dodges foreign policy questions like Bush dodges Iraqi shoes.

    I was half asleep listening to his weak answers void of substance, along with his remarkable usage of um and uh. I lost some brain cells listening to his rambling.
     
    Last edited: Feb 10, 2009
  7. cupofjoe1962

    cupofjoe1962 In the Starting Line-Up

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    Without a teleprompter... he is the Wizzard or Uhhhhh''''s
     
  8. Patters

    Patters Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    The conservative approach to economics created the worst recession since the 1930s. Now, Obama is trying a much more liberal approach. Clearly, the money will create jobs and clearly the tax cuts will help the middle class and poor. Those who favor helping the wealthy are screwed. We're certainly not socialist, but hopefully his health care plan will rely more on a European Democratic-Socialist model than the failed American capitalist model. At any rate, we've been a hybrid economy since the 1930s (with a strong bias towards capitalism), and that will continue.
     
  9. STFarmy

    STFarmy In the Starting Line-Up

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    I would say it was more like the neo-conservative approach, a real conservative would have cut gov't spending. And there was also a few other problems that built up. But you're right, Bush's ridiculous spending didn't help.
     
  10. BelichickFan

    BelichickFan B.O. = Fugazi PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #24 Jersey

    That's not true, the Conservative approach of low taxes is a perfectly fine model. What created "the worst recession since the 1930s" was the housing/banking mess. We can all blame who we want for that but it's off to the side of Conservative economics.
     
  11. BelichickFan

    BelichickFan B.O. = Fugazi PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #24 Jersey

    In Obama's defense, no-one ever is ready to be President. Personally I have been disappointed in him even going in with low expectations. I'm surprised he's bent over for Nancy on this bad bill. I'm surprised he's been so overly negative; telling the truth is one thing but a little hope and optimism would be nice. I'm surprised he's allowed so many waivers for lobbyists in his administration after saying he wouldn't. I've been disappointed at the tone of his voice, almost yelling (in a controlled way) to make his point. And I was disappointed when he seemed so frustrated trying to explain the spending bill when he said "stimulus has to be spending" but not realizing the point that not all spending is stimulus and it's the non stimulative spending that people are upset about. I'm also disappointed that onlyh 37% of voters (according to Rassmussen) support his bill but he's happy to push it through anyway.
     
  12. shmessy

    shmessy Maude Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #75 Jersey

    The fools are the folks who are happy saving 10% after the two major tax cuts of the Bush administration, but who forget that their 401(k)'s are down 20% over that 8 year period.

    Oh, and that the American dollar has lost 40% of its value versus other currencies.

    Congratulations, Einstein. But keep focusing all your attention on tax rates.
     
  13. Patters

    Patters Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    To his credit Obama obviously is not listening to the polls, but the fact that his approval ratings (CNN) are in the mid-70s reflects well on his leadership ability and the trust people have in him. Perhaps what you call his controlled yelling is really sour grapes because he is so effective? The stimulus bill has no pork and directly creates jobs. Tax cuts may lead to job creation, but certainly won't stem in the short term the loss of jobs. My guess is that after his press conference yesterday, support for the stimulus bill will begin to climb, and what's it's passed it will climb more. Though, curing the deep distrust of government that Republicans have instilled over the last 25 years will take awhile. At any rate, with Wall Street losing the trust of Americans, I think Obama is well poised to win back faith in our government during his first term. He just has to show that Bush was an anomaly, and remind people that government is rarely that inept.
     
  14. BelichickFan

    BelichickFan B.O. = Fugazi PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #24 Jersey

    We'll see. But spending almost $1T against the will of the people, making over a dozen exceptions to his no lobbyists pledge and nominating known tax cheats to his cabinet, all within three weeks, isn't a good start to win back faith in government. Yes, he poll numbers are high partly because of his charisma, partly because people are going to give him more than three weeks and largely because people have so much hope they can't let it be dashed so quickly.

    Regarding your line about the spending bill having no pork - wow, LMAO :singing:
     
  15. shmessy

    shmessy Maude Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #75 Jersey

    I have to agree here.

    This Stimulus Bill should be in the $200-250 Billion range.

    It should be efficiently targeted to Infrastructure, Alternative Energy and Medical Records Computerization. Lean and Mean.

    Drop the Democratic Party Way of Life Maintenance Pork

    Drop the 44% Concession to the Republicans Tax Cuts
     
  16. Patters

    Patters Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Overall, Obama has done a good job with transparency and appointing good people, but come on give the Repubicans credit for exploiting any inconsistency between what he says he stands for and his appointees records. Except for Daschle, I don't think any of his proposed appointments made serious tax errors. (Daschle made too many for me to believe they were oversights), and Obama said from the start he would consider highly qualified people even if they were lobbyists.

    As far as his spending plan, well of course we disagree on that, but perhaps even you might agree that spending (right or wrong) will create jobs more quickly than tax cuts.

    Lastly, I don't think the bill has pork, if you define pork as steering money to a specific business or institution in a specific region.
     
  17. BelichickFan

    BelichickFan B.O. = Fugazi PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #24 Jersey

    We have gobs of natural gas, a great stimulus plan would be :

    - Research into most efficient natural gas cars
    - conversion of current cars to run on natural gas
    - conversion of gas stations to natural gas

    I read before that we could run cars on our own natural gas for hundreds of years, don't know for sure that's true it may have been a natural gas person. But it's cheaper and less pollutive and imagine the jobs created from above both white and blue collar.
     
  18. BelichickFan

    BelichickFan B.O. = Fugazi PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #24 Jersey

    Pork is wasteful spending, it doesn't need a definition as tight as yours. Whether it's the NEA spending or the Digital TV or whatever, there's plenty of non stimulative spending here which should be judged on it's own merits not lumped into this.
     
  19. Patriot_in_NY

    Patriot_in_NY Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal

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    Actually, if your were listening, Obama flat out LIED to the American people, not once, but twice. (Not little ones either)

    From the Presser

    Obviously talking about the "pubies". Republicans in both the House and Senate have offered at least two alternative stimulus packages. None of them demanded that Obama “do nothing”. He may want to do it "his way" because "He Won". but that is a fundamental LIE that one side want's to DO NOTHING.

    They wanted changes to the uber-bloated mess he is proposing, not to do nothing.

    Next lie...........

    Ummm, dumass --------- you do realize that more then HALF of that deficit comes from the BAILOUTS and that hideous TARP disaster that that mostly DEMOCRATS pushed through congress last year. Democrats have been in charge of spending in the last couple years (abetted by Bush - who certainly the fukc wasn't fiscally conservative by ANY STRETCH).

    He's just another typical revisionist LIBERAL POLITICIAN that will lie to that american public if it serves his needs.

    Lets not even get into the fact that he's also a moron when it comes to economic historical president. Cuz he also said this.

    Jesus, he doesn't even read his own liberal RAG on the topic.

    It implies they actly plenty bold & swift. Just on the wrong sh!t. Pretty much what Porkulus is. He just throwing darts at this point. :rolleyes:

    he concerned about the deficit he inherited, so his first official move is to double it. FUKCING BRILLIANT.
     
    Last edited: Feb 10, 2009
  20. Real World

    Real World Moderator Staff Member

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    I was thinking the same thing. That deficit is largely the TARP, which was a creation of Pelosi, Bush, and Reid, that HE voted for. He was supportive of it. Meet the new people, same as the old people.

    As for Japan, OMFG. The guy was pointing to Japan to reinforce his position on spending a trillion dollars, when Japan spent a trillion dollars in that decade, and doubled it's national debt, while reversing NOTHING! We had a thread about that in this very forum.

    I've got no problems with the gubmit doing something, but this bill is a typical political bill, that doesn't really do much to fix the real problem, and largely serves the political agenda of the party passing it. That's business as usual, and typifies what the republicans did for 6 years in power, so I say, so much for "change". The only change we're seeing, is in the name of the party in power.

    Meet the new people, same as the old people.
     

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