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Kiwan's an idiot

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by slash83, Aug 29, 2008.

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  1. slash83

    slash83 Rookie

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    1. Albert Haynesworth, Tennessee Titans

    2. Tommie Harris, Chicago Bears

    3. Kevin Williams, Minnesota Vikings

    4. Richard Seymour, New England Patriot

    5. Ty Warren, New England Patriots

    6. Jamal Williams, San Diego Chargers

    Honorable mention: Vince Wilfork, New England; Pat Williams, Minnesota; John Henderson, Jacksonville; Marcus Stroud, Buffalo; Kris Jenkins, New York Jets; Aaron Smith, Pittsburgh and Shaun Rogers, Cleveland.

    This guy cant be for real, Wilfork is better then Jamal Williams anyday of the week. Where the hells Casey Hampton and Haloti Ngata id take them over Jenkns and Rogers any dam day this guys clueless man.

    Oops Kirwan oh well
    Last edited: Aug 29, 2008
  2. spacecrime

    spacecrime Rookie

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    Not to mention Wilfork is better than Seymour
  3. BPF

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    I love Wilfork but Jamal Williams is pretty damn good player, it's a close call between the two. Also regarding Casey Hampton, he showed up to camp overweight this year and he is in danger of losing his starting job, the Steelers are extremely dissapointed with him. Ngata is a bit young and hasn't done enough yet to be the choice over these vets. Don't forget Jenkins was a dominator at one point. I agree with you on Rogers, a bit overrated - you never know which player will show up with him, the fat and lazy out of shape guy or the load that's impossible to block. Too inconsistent to be a top player for me.
    Last edited: Aug 29, 2008
  4. BPF

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    It's very hard to compare these guys since they play in completely different defenses as well and are asked to do a lot of different things.
  5. BPF

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    Over the last two years, yes.
  6. slash83

    slash83 Rookie

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    Yeah Ima pats fan and Jamal is a great player but I gotta go with Wilfork over him just cause Jamals had a couple of knee surgeries over the last couple of years and is a couple years older then Wilfork to. Both are great players tho top two NT's in football imo.
  7. HEY BRO! WHAT UP?

    HEY BRO! WHAT UP? Banned

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    When are people going to realize that Seymour and Warren are not a DT's! I guess they think Wilfork plays end, that is why he is not on the list.
    Last edited: Aug 29, 2008
  8. LeonPowe

    LeonPowe Banned

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    They aren't DTs, and Wilfork is better than both anyways
  9. Brady'sButtBoy

    Brady'sButtBoy Rookie

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    Why does it now require that we condemn others before we give differing opinions? Slash83, is this how you conduct your every day life? God help those close to you if so.

    BTW, Williams has been an all-pro 2 times (2nd team once also) and has gone to the pro bowl 3 times, while our own Vince Wilfork has been all-pro and pro bowl bound just once. Obviously, only an idiot could deduce Williams was better...
  10. slash83

    slash83 Rookie

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    shut the hell up you dont even know me so dont come at me like that. Talk all the **** you want on a board you cyber tough guy.

    Wilfork is better then Williams go ask anybody that knows about football who they would take right now then get back to me chump.

    And Kirwan is and idiot sey and warren arent even dts to begin with and wilfork is better then both of em.
    Last edited: Aug 29, 2008
  11. Fencer

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    Your command of logic, grammar, and spelling are remarkable.

    As for football -- well, Seymour made the 2007 Pro Bowl roster (and I believe his others as well) as a DT. That's just how many people classify 3-4 DEs.
  12. Fencer

    Fencer Rookie

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    And by the way, Kirwan twice referred to 3-4 DEs in general or Seymour in particular as being guys who play essentially the same role as tackles. And he's right. Defensive tackles are guys whose responsibilities include BOTH controlling blockers and getting to the QBs and ballcarriers. The same is true of 3-4 DEs.

    4-3 DEs, by way of contrast, generally are just focused on getting to ballcarriers, QBs, and occasionally receivers. Their main concern with blockers lies in not getting successfully blocked by them.
  13. Joker

    Joker PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    You are being too logical and correct...prepare to be HATED by the neo-Patriot sky is falling crowd
  14. PATRIOT64

    PATRIOT64 Rookie

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    Kirwan is one of the best sports writers out there and knows more about the NFL then 90% of other writers IMO
    - If you don't agree because you are doing the homer thing thinking such as the infamous 'there is not a better NFL player at any position unless he is a Patriot' then so be it, but homers are beyond obnoxious anymore and I don't expect anything else from any of them in here.

    To call him an idiot,Well I think the mirror you look into should come into effect here,If Kirwin is an idiot as a sports writer then I don't know what to say about the rest of them.
    Last edited: Aug 30, 2008
  15. Jackson 2

    Jackson 2 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Pat Kirwin is the brightest football mind out there, in my opinion. He used to work with BB and always speaks of him as highly as one can. He and Tim Ryan host a show on Sirius NFL Radio each day at 3:00 pm and are always highly complimentary when speaking of the Patriots. In fact, during the whole spygate BS, they were a voice of reason in the wilderness when they defended NE every single time some yahoo from across the country would call to complain about it. Actually, it got to a point where they opened every show with a statement that if anyone intended to call and complain about the Pats' videotaping, they should call somewhere else because every team does, or did, something similar or equal. Kirwin, in fact, said he used to do it for the teams he worked for. Listen, I get upset too when I perceive that we're being slighted nationally. But Kirwin is as fair and supportive as it gets. Just my 2 cents worth.
  16. PATRIOT64

    PATRIOT64 Rookie

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    You are correct - If a person does not like Kirwin as a sports reporter for the NFL then I want to know who is much better out there - The list should be extremely small and anyone who says Reiss is better needs a b!Tch slap since Reiss is a Patriots reporter guy
    Last edited: Aug 30, 2008
  17. cstjohn17

    cstjohn17 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Rankings are rankings, Kirwan likely got the information from league sources, asking scouts, GMs and coaches.

    He is far and away the best writer out there (and my personal binkie!), he may be an idiot but I don't think he developed the rankings.
  18. TheGodInAGreyHoodie

    TheGodInAGreyHoodie Rookie

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    Whether you agree with Kiwan's list or not, the discussion is much more interesting if you disagree without being disagreeable and support your opinion than simply call someone and idiot.

    You offer no reason to why you feel Wilfork is better.

    I have had interesting discussion (granted never resolved) about if Brady or Manning is the better QB, TO vs Moss, Rice vs. Moss, etc. But good discussions were always fact driven not name calling.

    So what facts lead you to feel Wilfork is better? Sacks, tipped balls, leadership?
  19. fgssand

    fgssand PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Kirwan's show is EXCELLENT, he is a top notch guy, loves the game, knows the game.

    I have learned a lot about the inner goings on of the NFL from his show.

    As for his list, I saw nothing wrong with it at all.

    As a long time Patriot fan to have two of the top six & an Honorable mention...that is unreal. Anybody remember Ken "game day" Sims??
    Last edited: Aug 30, 2008
  20. Robdude

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    I agree here 100%. Kirwan's show is one to watch. Also when he had BB on his show they really seemed to have a good understanding of eachother and a lot of respect for eachother.

    I also think bashing his article is a little ridculus. Wilfork receives the first honorable mention. So the way I see he has listed 3 of our ineman in the top 7 in the NFL. Honestly how can any Patriots fan complain about that?
  21. Miguel

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  22. PATRIOT64

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    Slash83 only wishes he had a 1,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 of an ounce of football knowledge that Kirwan has
  23. Deus Irae

    Deus Irae PatsFans.com Retired Jersey Club PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Eh..... his list is his opinion, nothing more. My opinion is that Wilfork is the best 3-4 NT in the game, and that putting Seymour up there after last season was a stupid decision, but so what? It's some guy's opinion, nothing more. Read it. Digest it. Evaluate the information. Move on.
  24. DaBruinz

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    You are seriously suffering from what is know as Cranial-Rectal inversion. I suggest you get it taken care of.

    1) I love Wilfork, but Jamal Williams has been the better player. Wilfork may supplant him this year, but Williams is no slouch and your actions are as if Wilfork didn't even make the list. He was right there behind Williams.

    2) It would seem to me that you shouldn't be calling people idiots when you don't understand the game. Warren and Seymour ARE, in fact, DTs when they play the 4-3. The 3-4 basically puts 3 defensive tackles on the field because all 3 line up INSIDE of the opposing tackles. This moves the responsibilities for making the plays from the D-line to the LBers. The Linebackers become the ones responsible for rushing the passer or setting the edge on runs. Seymour and Warren are called Defensive ends because they are the outside of the defensive line, but they are still DTs in how they play. In the 4-3, one or both of the DEs line up outside the opposing tackles with the DTs in the middle tying up the O-line. The DEsare the ones responsible for setting the edges on the run and applying pressure on the QB in the pass. I know there is more to it, but I don't want to take up an entire page educating you.


    3) I think it is debatable as to which NT (Wilfrok or Jamal Williams) a coach would take 1st. It depends on their schemes. The Chargers system is only a single gap system and very different from the Pats 2 gap system.

    4) The only cyber tough guy around here seems to be you. You are the one who got all uppity becases BBB called you out for over-reacting the way you did. And yes, you did over-react. Its pretty hypocritical of you to slam Kirwan and then get all upset because people don't like your opinion and have one of their own. Best way to handle it is to dispute the facts. So far, I've only seen you throw up your opinion and not base it on any facts. Throw out some facts that you believe support your opinion on Wilfork.
    Last edited: Aug 30, 2008
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