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It's so bleak, one energy analyst wants Peak Oil talk muzzled

Discussion in 'Political Discussion' started by PressCoverage, Nov 17, 2008.

  1. PressCoverage

    PressCoverage Banned

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    Think to yourself for a moment... What does this sentiment tell you?

    Robert Hirsch, former senior energy program adviser for Science Applications International Corporation and Senior Energy Advisor at MISI and a consultant in energy, technology, and management:
    TruthMove Forum

    I suggest that the peak oil community minimize its efforts to awaken the world to the near-term dangers of world oil supply. The motivation is simple: By minimizing our efforts in the near term, we may not add fuel to the economic fires that are already burning so fiercely...

    Businesses and the markets are in what might be called a free fall. If the realization of peak oil along with its disastrous financial implications was added to the existing mix of troubles, the added trauma could be unthinkable.

    In other words: "Yes, Peak Oil is upon is... but go back to sleep!"
  2. TheGodInAGreyHoodie

    TheGodInAGreyHoodie Rookie

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    Not necessary.

    The problem with Peak Oil is it is self-fulfilling.

    As you may recall in 1973 Johnny Carson joked on late night national TV that there was a toilet paper shortage. (There was none.) The next day by noon every store in the country was out of toilet paper and the country was in fact now in a toilet paper shortage.

    If I can convince enough people that a perfectly healthy bank is failing, I can cause it to fail, because there is no bank in the world that could survive a run of all of its depositors coming in one day and making withdrawals.

    Most recently gas reached $4.00 /gal, not on an actual shortage but because of speculation of a shortage that continued to loop on speculation.
  3. PressCoverage

    PressCoverage Banned

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    except this isn't heresay... this is geology... among many other indicators...
  4. PatriotsReign

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    It is a fact that the supply of oil is limitted. To allow the public to believe it is endless or even relatively endless for our lifetime is bs and a lie.
  5. BelichickFan

    BelichickFan B.O. = Fugazi PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #24 Jersey

    For our lifetime ? I don't believe it's a proven fact that oil won't be endless for kids born today especially if more drilling is allowed, new technology is found for finding tougher to discover oil and new technology is found for turning oil shale into usable oil. I'm not saying it's endless forever but our lifetime is fairly short in this respect depending on where we go with oil development.
  6. PatriotsReign

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    Well BF...I can tell you I would never want to see "panic drilling" to suck up every last drop with oil dericks everywhere you look. The Peak oil theory just states that we are on the downside of supply. I'd say there is no denying that fact.

    My point isn't that it WILL run out in our lifetime, I'm saying it very easily could run out. We don't want to rely upon it and any "panic" we use should be focused on alternative sources. I'd say that's pretty tough to argue against.
  7. BelichickFan

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    #24 Jersey

    I'm on the record as being in favor of all energy sources - unlike our President elect.
  8. patsfan13

    patsfan13 Hall of Fame Poster PatsFans.com Supporter

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    The near term is because some existing oil fields are at peak, it ignores new pools or other sources of oil/fuel that are not online. Which is why the announcement that we were going to drill offshore cause futures price to drop prior to the financial panic.
  9. PatriotsReign

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    I would say that the scientific consensus is that we are at or beyond the halfway point of the earth's supply. And if we combine that with the rate of growth of emerging nations, the second half will last about half as long as the first half.
  10. TheGodInAGreyHoodie

    TheGodInAGreyHoodie Rookie

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    I agree.

    But the peak oil cult is not about advocating a solution it is about advocating anarchy.

    Nobody claims we have an endless supply of oil. That is why we need solar power, wind power, fusion reactors (much safer than fission reactors) etc. and conservation.

    The peak oil folks are not advocates of developing alternative energy sources. They are the marketing department for a company that sells survival gear.

    The solution to the oil crises is alternative energy sources not an uzi.
  11. DarrylS

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    Nicely stated...
  12. PatriotsReign

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    Yes, I agree with you as well. I am not a proponent of the anarchy fear propaganda. I was just trying to say that the theory is valid.
  13. patsfan13

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    If you look at Fossil fuels as a whole this is not the case. The US reserves of coal and tar sands is greater than the worlds oil reserves.

    Plus there are viable biofuel options are are 'renewable' to place oil...
  14. Leave No Doubt

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    I don't think anyone believes that anymore:cool:
  15. Leave No Doubt

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    The page wouldn't load so I couldn't read the article in it's entirety but based upon your quote it sounds as though the author advocates giving the public a Bad News Break. If it was a lesser topic I'd almost agree but the desire for/need for/protection of oil is one of the driving forces behind our foreign policy, among other things, so it should be at the forefront. OTOH I'd love America to be the one spearheading alternative energies so if he thinks keeping it quiet will make energy drop down on other country's priority list then that's ok by me;) jk of course.
  16. PressCoverage

    PressCoverage Banned

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    This is absolutely incorrect in its entirety... First, it's not a cult, and I find that jab very offensive... It's simply an awareness movement in the face of stubborn denial by your average american. Anyone who's aware of Peak Oil empahatically stresses investment in a greener planet, alternative energy, and rails against the accepted pessimism regarding wind and solar and geothermal.

    Second, we most certainly DO promote investment in alternate energy sources. Until we're blue in the face. The problem is A) our monetary system refuses to upset Big Oil; B) We're now broke.

    Next, MANY people claim there is an endless supply of "abiotic" oil. Including at least two right here on this forum. Where you got that statement that no one believes oil is running out is beyond me. The denial factor is precisely why we've trumpeted as loud as possible.

    Lastly, I'm not marketing for any survival gear company. And of the people i know who are aware of Peak Oil doom, none of them are either.

    You're usually a good poster here. But this post sounds like typical RW self-rationalization based on feel.
    Last edited: Nov 18, 2008
  17. PatriotsReign

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    Mr RW seems in denial about the reality we're facing.
  18. Fogbuster

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    Virtually everybody I know is very open to alternative energy, and the development of energy sources other than petroleum/gas. In fact, I cannot think of a single person I know -- or have even seen speak -- who is opposed to these alternatives, like solar, wind, geothermal, and nuclear.

    If nuclear "local packs" designed to provide electricity for communities of up to 20,000 people could be developed, as some are now suggesting, would you support that??

    In any case, the issue here is making a smooth transition. Those who want to immediately scrap all petro-source energy in favor of alternatives that haven't even been ramped up to make the transition are simply shooting THEMSELVES in the feet. The world is not going to roll over and be pushed that way, not without feasible alternatives on line.

    As an earlier poster alluded, the "green movement" seems to be about creating such a high-pitched whine, fear, and cacophony in the general public that they hope to ram home their preferred policies whether they are world-wide mass-feasible or not. Bad approach. Conflict inducing.


    //
  19. PressCoverage

    PressCoverage Banned

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    Fine, but the slow and steady "conservative" approach to this emergency isn't going to work on this one. ... You had better have some semblance of fear, especially out there in eastern Europe, and largely dependant on mother Russia for fuel. ... The time to be slow and steady was 1979, when our leadership warned us all of this impending calamity...

    Now, with the masses only finally waking up, your sentiment is like being down 18 points with 5 minutes left, and we're running off-tackle and dumping into the flat with no timeouts... It's time to take some tactical risks, and fire downfield a bit...

    Nuclear is acceptable to a degree, as long as the profit-making corporations open their books to government oversight. But I think much more is capable from wind, solar, geothermal and biodiesel than TPTB are admitting and letting on...
    Last edited: Nov 18, 2008
  20. atomdomb

    atomdomb Rookie

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    Is there any truth to the findings that the Green River Basin Oil Shale contains somewhere between 800 billion to 1.5 trillion barrels of oil? I have info on this quite a bit recently.

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