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Discussion in 'Political Discussion' started by Harry Boy, Feb 25, 2007.

  1. Harry Boy

    Harry Boy Look Up, It's Amazing PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Will Hollywood and The Left Wing Liberal attack "This God", I doubt it.

    ATLANTA (Reuters) - Islam is growing fast among African Americans, who are undeterred by increased scrutiny of Muslims in the United States since the September 11 attacks, according to imams and experts.

    Converts within the black community say they are attracted to the disciplines of prayer, the emphasis within Islam on submission to God and the religion's affinity with people who are oppressed.

    Some blacks are also suspicious of U.S. government warnings about the emergence of new enemies since the 2001 attacks because of memories of how the establishment demonized civil rights leaders Martin Luther King and Malcolm X.

    http://today.reuters.com/news/artic...OC_0_US-USA-MUSLIMS-BLACKS.xml&src=rss&rpc=22
     
  2. patsfan13

    patsfan13 Hall of Fame Poster PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I never viewed the Saudi Royal family as oppressed, whatever! ;)
     
  3. iguide

    iguide Practice Squad Player

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    I wonder how they equate this to the Islam oppression of their women?? I would really like someone to try and defend that! At least in Judaism and Christian communities women have equal rights.
     
  4. PatsFanInVa

    PatsFanInVa PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    "Their" women, huh? ;)

    Perhaps we're all theologically closer than we think.

    PFnV
     
  5. iguide

    iguide Practice Squad Player

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    Would it be more PC to day the women of the Islam religion? ;) {Sorry, I tend to loath the PC crap} :) In any event I still want someone to explain my original question. I understand that Islam and Judaism have their roots in the same place, but I really do not understand the equation and would like someone to give me a credible answer. :confused:
     
  6. Harry Boy

    Harry Boy Look Up, It's Amazing PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Womens Rights:
    To the American Far Left Liberal, defending womens rights is the same as defending "free speech", it all depends on who the "Offender" is, Free Speech all depends on who is giving the speech.

    Examples:
    Free Speech
    Ann Coulter--Pie In The Face, Shut Her Up
    All Bush Haters--Standing Ovations

    Womens Rights
    Abuse by Billy Blue Dress—Look the other way
    Abuse by Muslims—Look the other way

    The Muslim Women Abuser is the enemy of the “Bush America” the phony liberal “Womens Rights Rats” don’t want to do anything that might make the Hated Bush or the Rignt Wing Conservative look like “Hero’s”, so, to hell with the Muslim Women.

    The National Organization For Women (NOW) lost all their credibility with their response to the Death of Kathleen Wiley’s Cat and the RAPE of Juanita Broderick by their Handsome Lip Biting Sex Symbol the impeached immoral scumbag Bill Clinton.

    Now these “Phony B!tches” completely ignore the treatment of women in the Muslim Religion because SUPPORTING THEM would mean SUPPORTING many of the things that the “Bush America” is trying to do in that Barbaric Sh!t Hole called “The Middle East”.

    America is now trying to bring civilization to the barbarians in Iraq and help those women who spend their days behind a veil cleaning up donkey sh!t, the phony liberals want nothing to do with helping these women simply because the "The Hated Bush" is leading the way.

    The liberal democrat phony's want to go to Africa and do the exact same thing :confused:

    Liberal Left Wing Defenders Of Womens Rights:
    PHONY DOUBLE STANDARD BASTARDS
     
  7. iguide

    iguide Practice Squad Player

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    Straight shootin Harry!!! :agree:
     
  8. Pujo

    Pujo Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

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    I spent 7 years living in an Orthodox Jewish home and I can unequvically tell you that women do not have equal rights in the religion. It's nothing like the oppresive Muslim countries, but it's not exactly equality. Likewise in most denominations of Christianity. How many of them allow female priests?
     
    Last edited: Feb 26, 2007
  9. iguide

    iguide Practice Squad Player

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    I have not pleasure to have traveled the entire world, so I can not give you an accurate count. I will give you an example of a very conservative Christian country, the Philippines, do have some female priests. They are the only Christian nation in Asia.

    Since you want to play this silly game why don't you list all of the countries that are predominantly Muslim that allow the women to vote, go to school, drive a car, take an active part in politics etc . Then list all of the predominately Christian/Jewish counties that do not let the women vote, go to school, drive a car, take an active part in politics. You will quickly find out that heavily slanted to the woman in Christian/Jewish countries have equal rights, unlike Islamic countries where only a very small number of countries will allow the women to have an education.
     
  10. Pujo

    Pujo Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

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    I said in my last post that the Muslim world is much worse than the Christian/Jewish world in that regard, but I was taking issue with you saying that in those religions men and women are treated equally, as opposed to just more equally. We're 90% there, not 100.
     
    Last edited: Feb 26, 2007
  11. Patters

    Patters Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Islam is backwards in its treatment of women, but women have made progress there. (In a few of the countries, they can hold professional jobs, have equal access to the secular courts, and don't have to wear veils.) Unfortunately, like here, the religious right got control, something we fomented with our war machine.

    Once we're out of Iraq and the military, which is generally right-wing wherever you look, plays less of a role, the Middle East will once again progress. But, it will take awhile. Even Europe took a full generation after WWII to recover. It will take Iraq at least that long to recover from the damage we have done, so women's rights are a long way off.

    By the way, many left-wingers were disappointed when Hamas won among the Palestinians. As corrupt as Fatah was, they were at least progressive in terms of women's rights, education, and other matters.
     
  12. Pujo

    Pujo Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

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    The problem was that their corruption was 1984-esque. People would vanish in the middle of the night never to be heard from again. We talk about having no good choices to vote for. Man, were the Palestinian people between a rock and a hard place when they had to vote between Hamas and Fatah.
     
  13. Real World

    Real World Moderator Staff Member

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    I've been on the female priest, priests should marry path for quite some time. I find it so odd that priests cannot marry, but more odd that women are not allowed to become priests. Is it a lock on traditionalist ideals, or is it something else? I remember growing up, it was taught that priests could not marry, and had to remain celebate as a sacrafice to God, or so as a show of their undivided attention to serving God. Someone else in here might know better, 3 to be 4 maybe, or Fog.
     
  14. Real World

    Real World Moderator Staff Member

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    I can always count on you for a good laugh. :D

    Yup, our 4 years in Iraq has so greatly impeded the progression of women's rights in the region, that when we leave they're sure to flourish.

    :rofl:

    [​IMG]



    Here's a great article that illustrates the move to free voting, especially by women, in some of the ME nations. Take note that most of the advances have occured in the last 2-5 years, so do the math. :D


    http://www.middle-east-online.com/english/?id=18748
     
    Last edited: Feb 26, 2007
  15. Patters

    Patters Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Women were achieving greater equality, and much of that happened in the 60s and 70s. Countries like Morocco have secular courts where women have rights; in Jordan, Egypt, and others, women don't have to wear veils; in many of the Arab countries women are allowed to attend college and hold professional jobs. Those are examples of progress. That said, since we went to Iraq, we unleashed the religious fanatics especially in Iran and Iraq, who want to set things back.

    Of course, the best solution would be for us to win and persuade them to adapt our values and follow a liberal constitution, but with 140,000 troops in a country of 170,000 sq. mi. and has a population of 26,000,000, I think the evidence is mounting that we won't be able to win the war.
     
  16. Real World

    Real World Moderator Staff Member

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    Gimme a break!

    Yeah, rights alright, like not having to cover your face in public, and breathing on your own free will. :eek: Hmmm....60's to 2007 = 40 years? Dang, that's some progress. To listen to you is funny sometimes. At any rate, women in Iraq are serving in office. They are a part of the elected body. Since 2000 a number of Arab states have permitted women to vote for the first time. Yemen, Oman, Qatar, Kuwait, etc. The article talks about them. LAst I checked, that wasn't during Clinton's presidency. Now, if you wantedto say that progress was made during his tenure, then fine, it clealry was, but if you want to say that it ONLY happened during his tenure, you're a fraud, cuz lots has happened since 2000. See, to me, partisan hacks, and party sheeple are those who are never willing to give credence to the opposing side. People point to Iraq and only talk about the negatives, and never want to discuss any positives. I understand how negative an issue Iraq is, but to ignore all things is ignorant.

    We very well may not "win" this war, but what's astounding is how many in here don't want us too.
     
  17. Pujo

    Pujo Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

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    It depends on what winning means, and what the price is.

    If winning really meant ridding Iraq of WMD's, I would have gone for that. But I'm not sure we should be nation-building, and I'm not sure what winning is or how we would do it.
     
  18. Real World

    Real World Moderator Staff Member

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    It doesn't depend on what winning is, and most in here know exactly what I mean by my statement. There are people in this forum who enjoy, and look forward too, negative news from Iraq. They harp on it. They want the US to fail there. I'm not saying everyone is that way, and those who don't feel that way will know not to take any offense by my statement, as it wouldn't relate to them. Those who feel offended, well....;)
     
  19. Patters

    Patters Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I think they were achieving steady progress up until the 1980s or so, but still they were a good 30 or 40 years behind us. (Let's remember that even here women did not have equal rights until starting in the 70s. For instance, prior to that it wasn't uncommon for woman to be accused of causing her own rape by dressing provocatively.) I think you lack historical perspective, like your adorable comments in another thread that politics are more dishonest today than they were in the past.

    Like I said, it would be great if we were successful in Iraq, but I don't think we will be. When we leave, it will curious to see what reforms survive. Under Saddam, some women had relatively equal rights (which aren't many rights in a dictatorship) and were allowed to pursue careers and get professional jobs and so on, so maybe Iraqi culture is more amenable than some others. It is good to see that some of the smaller Arab states took steps towards women's rights, but I still think the war in Iraq will be a setback in that regard because it has empowered religious groups. In interesting to see that in Kuwait, no women got elected, but many Islamicists did.
     
  20. Real World

    Real World Moderator Staff Member

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    Yup, some women had the equal right to be raped. Uday and Qusay split them up 50/50, you know, with equality in mind. :(

    Arab states are 30(0)-40(0) years behind us? Hmmm...I think you forgot a zero. :D

    Reformist won 37 of the 50 seats in Kuwait. BTW, in Kuwait, women now make up 57% of the voting public. I think this, and the other points put forth in the article, clearly show how progress post Clinton is being made. Again, this isn't to be taken as a slash at Clinton, it is merely being mentioned to show that progress is not pertinent to a Dem presidency as you like to always imply.
     

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