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is the cb position a lot better than we think

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by patsfan55, Mar 23, 2006.

  1. patsfan55

    patsfan55 In the Starting Line-Up

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    #95 Jersey

    a lot of ppl (and mocks for that reason) feel we should draft a cb in the first rd
    or that we should at least address it in fa, or early in the draft

    but lets take a look at the position as of now:
    assante samuel
    randall gay
    ellis hobbs
    chad scott
    hank poteat

    okay, so its not great, but its def not the worst position for the pats (that reward has to go to the wr's), but even that aside, the pats are obviously trying for a youth movement, at cb its not really needed
    look at the top three guys: samuel, gay, hobbs
    while samuel is only signed through this yr, thats still three guys that could be around for quite some time, and should only get better
    i love hobbs, i think this guy could be a stud
    and we are kinda forgetting how good a job gay did down the stretch in 04
    samuel dissapointed most of last yr, but started to come on at the end of the yr

    wr is obviously a more pressing need, but i think so is lb (we need to add youth, and a fourth lb for that matter at the position)

    some could even argue that te, rb, and safety are more pressing needs
    te-we need a number three, plus graham is a fa after the yr
    rb-we need a young guy to replace dillon either soon, or right away(if he keeps gettin banged up)
    s-rodney might not be back to full strength, geno was a huge dissapointment last yr, never making plays, guss scott cant ever stay on the field, james sanders couldnt stay on the field last yr

    so, maybe cb isnt so bad
     
  2. PatsRI

    PatsRI PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I worry more about safety than corner right now. Wilson had a definite dow year without Rodney last year and I don't think the Pats can afford to get off to a slow start this year if Rodney is out for a chunk of time. Hawkins did a decent job but can we count on him to continue?
     
  3. Flying Fungi

    Flying Fungi In the Starting Line-Up

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    I think that calling Asante out for having to play in a new formation and virtually non-stop prevent-defense, isolated from the rest of the team's challenges (injuries, coaching changes, schedule) might be a little unfair. His turnaround seemed to come right about when Hawkins, Bruschi and Vrabel began closing down the middle of the field. Same could be said for Wilson.
     
  4. Pats726

    Pats726 Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal

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    I do think CB is importnat. No, not as imprtant as the depletedWR corps, but I really believe another vet is needed...and do not be surprsied if another rookie CB is brought in as well. I just think a vet would help a great deal..someone with the leadership capabilities to help with the young players.
    An established CB...No it's not in bad shape Samuel and Gay and Hobbs are fine..but it seems one can never have enough. Get a wily vet to help teach these guys some tricks..bring a bit of savvy play. Rodney always helps..but I agree, safety may also be a concern. TE and RB will take care of themselves..
    a young RB and a young TE...but beyond WR. CB and LB to me is where moves need to be made. I am not in a rush..but I know that will be addressed.
     
  5. mgteich

    mgteich PatsFans.com Veteran PatsFans.com Supporter

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    As of now, I see a greater need on Day one of the drafts at OLB, TE, OT and DL (are you really happy with counting on three of Hill, Klecko, Wright, Thomas).

    Our defensive backfield is as good as what it was throughout the last half of the year and into the playoffs, where the defense was fine.

    C. Scott, Samuel, Hobbs, Poteat, Gay
    Wilson,Hawkins,Sanders,G. Scott

    Add a Ster (Stone anyone) and we are fine, if this were the first day of the season. But even then, I would prefer another veteran corner.

    Personally, I think we overrate Samuel and Gay.

    Another issue is injuries.

    The bottom line is that we will add more defensive backs.

    BTW, I see no reason to believe that Wilson, Hawkins and Sanders won;y be fine at corner. We have Guss Scott as insurance, plus Harrison on PUP. I don't see a great need at safety.
     
    Last edited: Mar 23, 2006
  6. big mike

    big mike Practice Squad Player

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    I agree entirely.

    I'd also say that S is not the big concern that people keep making it out to be - everyone seems to ignore the fact that in addition to Rodney, James Sanders and Gus Scott were also injured last year, and both are pretty good safeties. Any time a team's top three players at one position get injured within two games of each other, there's going to be some struggling at that position. You can't plan for the possibility of having your starter, your main backup, and your backup's backup all injured. Or should we draft a QB in round 1 also, in case both Brady and Cassel get injured?
     
  7. BelichickFan

    BelichickFan B.O. = Fugazi PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #24 Jersey

    For sure CB is looking solid at the top and reasonably deep. The top four guys can legitimitely compete to be starters and Poteat is a decent 5th guy. We still don't have a #1, maybe one of the young guys will develop. What we desperately need is one of them to become an INT machine, like Law, even if they give up plays along the way. Hobbs seemed to have a way of getting the ball in his hands and Samuel has the ballhawking ability if he could just catch. I do agree that CB isn't a high priority on Day One and will likely only be addressed if there's a great value sitting there.
     
  8. big mike

    big mike Practice Squad Player

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    OLB and OT sure - but TE and DL? Graham and Watson are very solid at TE. Sure, we should have a 3rd stringer also - but it's definitely not a position in such need that it requires a day 1 pick.

    And DL? Let's see, starters are Seymour, Wilfork, and Warren, with Jarvis Green, and Marquise Hill as backups at DE, and Wright and Klecko (and Thomas) as backup DTs. Why do people seem to think that we need first or second round players as backups? We can get decent backups on day 2 - there's no need for finding a new starter anywhere on the DL.

    WR and LB are clearly the biggest needs, with OT also being a big one. The RB position is all set for this year, but Dillon and Faulk are getting on in years - combine that with the fact that there are going to be some good RBs available around picks 21 and 53, and that could also get a look.

    I agree with that entirely.
     
  9. BelichickFan

    BelichickFan B.O. = Fugazi PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #24 Jersey

    Belichick often drafts a year ahead. With strong TE in Round Two I think there's a good chance we'll take one as the #3 guy and Graham's replacement in 2006 unless they think they can re-sign him.

    DL, we likely need a better backup NT unless they think Mike Wright can come on. And a DE wouldn't hurt unless they think Marquis Hill can develop . . . we're only one injury away from him being the top backup.
     
  10. PatsFan37

    PatsFan37 2nd Team Getting Their First Start

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    #37 Jersey

    The argument sounds right and on the surface I'd agree that CB is solid and safety is weaker, but that doesn't explain why the FO targeted Deshea Townsend as one of their biggest attempts at a FA acquisition (Givens being the biggest attempt.)

    Clearly, the FO sees CB as a weakness. I'll take their word for it.
     
  11. Garbanza

    Garbanza In the Starting Line-Up

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    ...and the health history for Pats DB's is what exactly?

    Exactly.
     
  12. DocAdkinsDiet

    DocAdkinsDiet Practice Squad Player

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    I would LOVE to see OSU's Bobby Carpenter come to us in the first round. That to me seems like a position we are going to need help with, more so than corner. A good argument can also be made for bringing in a solid safety. I want to see either a RB or LB in the first round. Corner doesn't worry me as much as those two, and possibly safety.
     
  13. mgteich

    mgteich PatsFans.com Veteran PatsFans.com Supporter

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    We targeted Givens? Did we even give him an offer?


     
  14. drewdagreat

    drewdagreat On the Game Day Roster

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    Hobbs = our best corner.
     
  15. mgteich

    mgteich PatsFans.com Veteran PatsFans.com Supporter

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    WR may be a big need, but the solution isn't the current class of Day One in this draft.
    ----------------------
    TIGHT END
    You may want a Day 2 scrub. That is not bb's way. He strongly values the TE position. He has often indicated that we need three TE's capable of starting. Fauria was an able starter. We let him go because we needed BETTER, not because he was too expensive. Graham is on his contract year. bb is not going into the next offseason with Graham as a free agent, Watson and a maybe from Round 6.

    DEFENSIVE LINE
    The first and second round is where the value has always been at DL. Hill is a big question mark. Are you really saying that you are fine with Hill, Wright and Thomas as our backups, ready to start or be the designated pass rusher, if someone is injured? I know what we get on Day Two. Perhaps you would prefer Klecko. Why do believe that an untested 4th rounder would be an upgrade?


     
  16. big mike

    big mike Practice Squad Player

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    I just don't see using a round 1 or 2 pick for a 3rd string player. edit - of course I should add that people said the same thing to me two years ago when I predicted (and was right for once) that the Pats would draft Ben Watson at #32. But, back then there weren't any glaring needs (unlike WR and LB right now), and Fauria couldn't be viewed in the same way then as Graham and Watson can now - just the age factor.

    Drafting a year ahead is why they should look at RB - since there will be some good RBs in the draft, and both Dillon and Faulk are getting older. Both Watson and Graham are young enough that they could be here for many more years.

    The key there is the word "backup". We're missing a starting WR and a starting LB - why then use a high draft pick on a backup, when we still need starters at other key positions?

    And we're negative one injury/lost player away from having a backup serving as a starting WR and OLB.

    Backups are nice. My point is - why use day 1 picks on people who are just gonig to be backups, when they don't have *starters* at other positions?
     
    Last edited: Mar 23, 2006
  17. DaBruinz

    DaBruinz Pats, B's, Sox PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #50 Jersey

    I honestly think that Samuel's best position would be free safety. Especially with the way he likes to hit.

    Wilson might be better off at CB, but I am not sure.

    I am not sure that the Patriots will make a strong attempt to keep Samuel next year. And that will be tell-taled by what they do in the draft. If they draft a CB, then I expect them to let Samuel walk.
     
  18. Dagg

    Dagg Third String But Playing on Special Teams

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    #95 Jersey

    I would put TE very low on the list, we have 2 studs and all we need is a scrub blocking TE which are a dime a dozen. Certainly nothing which needs to be looked at the 1st day of the draft.
     
  19. Ochmed Jones

    Ochmed Jones Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

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    #12 Jersey

    Playmakers needed

    Look at that list of DBs and tell me who is the playmaker in that group????? I didn't see one either.
    I'll disagree with everyone else and state it simply like this. We need a playmaker in the secondary. Especailly if Rodney goes to the PUP.
    I'm not saying we don't have other needs as well, because we do, however I'm not comfortable with the current group as it stands now.
     
  20. BelichickFan

    BelichickFan B.O. = Fugazi PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #24 Jersey

    You know as well as I do how much Belichick values the DL.
     

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