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Is Catholic University allowed to be Catholic?

Discussion in 'Political Discussion' started by The Brandon Five, Oct 28, 2011.

  1. Mrs.PatsFanInVa

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    #24 Jersey

    Sorry...thought it was rather self-explanatory. All of those are links to the types of federal aid that Catholic University accepts and the conditions they agree to.
     
  2. Real World

    Real World Moderator Staff Member

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    It isn't self explanatory. Can you explain it please, and how it pertains to this thread. Thanks.
     
  3. Mrs.PatsFanInVa

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    #24 Jersey

    If a school accepts federal funding or if it accepts students using federal funding, which Catholic University does, it is obligated to follow federal guidelines.

    Federal guidelines prohibit certain religious things - they allow certain other religious things - but those things must be made available for all religions. (For instance, if there is a Catholic prayer group which meets in room 103 on Wednesday at 4PM then the same sort of arrangement must be made available to Buddhists or Muslims or Baptists.)

    I am certainly not an expert on federal guidelines - I simply offered the thought that a school which accepts federal funds is, most likely, bound to abide by federal guidelines.

    Personally, if someone chooses to attend a religiously oriented school they should expect to be schooled in that particular religion - and they should not expect to practice their different religion in that school - but that's just me.

    We had non-Catholics attend the schools I attended while growing up - they were expected to sit through religion class with the rest of us - they were not, however, expected to make their first communion or go to confession on Friday or do any of the other religious things that Catholics did. But their parents were well aware that they were getting a "catholic" education.

    My son is sending his children to a Catholic school and he is quite disturbed, actually, at how much of a part religion plays in every subject taught. I do not recall the same things from my own education but that may be because I wasn't aware of a slant at the time. To me, what I remember, is an hour of religion every day along with an hour of math, english, history, etc..

    Apparently it's different now - or maybe it's just different schools, I don't know.
     
  4. PatsFanInVa

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    And it still didn't take...
     
  5. sdaniels7114

    sdaniels7114 Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

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    The Greek Orthodox kid who went to school with me here in Boston in the late 70's/early 80's was allowed to skip (Roman Catholic) religion class. He had to make up the hours after school or on the weekends. I guess there weren't enough Greek Orthodox people around for a school; but there were enough for a tutoring program or something.

    This was right at the height of the 'bussing' problem here in Boston. I know some white parents did whatever they could to keep their kids away from the minorities, but others just wanted to keep their kids away from the demonstrations and strife. So I don't know if there was special dispensation made for this kid because of that or what.
     
  6. DarrylS

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    It all sounds pretty silly when you write it out..

    Sometimes there is so much focus on process, rather than product.. everything is diminished.

    Sometimes I think I may have been better off without the "Baltimore Catechism", which had little to do with thought & belief and everything to do with regurgitation of what older men wanted us to believe. We must all just follow along..
     
  7. Mrs.PatsFanInVa

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    #24 Jersey

    I don't know...I find it pretty interesting. When I hear about someone else's experiences it teaches me things. After all, none of us really know anything about reality other than our own, do we?

    It makes sense not to force non-catholic kids to sit through religious instructions - Catholics aren't real notorious about proselytizing so I am unsure why my particular school made the non-catholics kids sit through the classes. It's good to know there were other schools which did not.

    Also interesting that bussing may have been behind the reason in SDaniel's school. I don't think that was the case where I was. There was the belief that the Catholic schools gave you a better education when I was growing up. Maybe because our class sizes were smaller, maybe they felt that lower paid teachers were more dedicated, I don't know. I don't know that we turned out any smarter than the public school kids. I do know we were disciplined much more closely - and much more violently, for that matter.

    There were parents who regarded that as a good thing.
     
  8. wistahpatsfan

    wistahpatsfan Pro Bowl Player

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    #75 Jersey

    I have the exact same experience. When I was in HS, the Iranian Revolution was going on, and the rich Iranians who could escape did so. We had about 6 or 7 Iranian boys (no girls) at our school. They were loaded with money and partied their brains out. They also made our soccer team instant contenders. These kids would have gotten their arse kicked in public school. They didn't go there anyways because they would have had to pay the same amount as they weren't residents and Catholic school was cheaper then. THose kids took a lot of crap at our school, though, because the Islamists were holding the American hostages. Eventually most of them fit in.

    We also had religion separated from the curriculum, except that sex ed was forbidden. Our bio teacher would sneak information to us, though. I heard he got fired for it after I graduated. Religion was first period every day, so we'd go out back into the woods after homeroom check-in, smoking reef and butts, and then sneak back in. Our religion teacher was very old and a bit senile so when attendance was being taken, whenever someone was missing, other students would say "here" when their name was called. Even though chairs were empty, she would say "Good, everyone's here" knowing full well that there were kids skipping- at least I didn't think she was that far gone..
     
  9. DarrylS

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    Stand by what I said, as a product of highly regulated education by the church there was so much focus on process and little on product. To think that a Greek Orthodox student has to make up "hours", because he missed something that was adverse to his religion.

    It does all sound pretty silly that this kid had to make up "hours", for what seems to be no good reason.
     
  10. sdaniels7114

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    I'm pretty sure that was about state requirements for daily hours of instruction. He may have been learning about religion from his faith's perspective or he may have been learning Calculus for all I know.
     
    Last edited: Oct 30, 2011
  11. chicowalker

    chicowalker Pro Bowl Player

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    Yeah, there are going to be things like that whenever certain requirements are in place -- not just religion classes. I remember that at the end of senior year, I had to go into school a couple mornings to play soccer and ultimate frisbee because I had blown off a lot of gym classes... even though I played 2 sports, was at the top of my class and knew where I was going to college. (It was actually pretty fun. Playing sports non-stop for a couple hours was much better than the 15-20 minutes of screwing around that went on during most PE classes.)
     
    Last edited: Oct 30, 2011
  12. Real World

    Real World Moderator Staff Member

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    The schools acceptance of "federal funding", and its federal obligations thereafter, are totally dependent upon the specific types of funding, and the language associated with it. It's not one size fits all.

    The bolded I completely disagree with. If the federal government gives me a welfare check each month, when I purchase or pay for items with that money, the vendor, or recipient of that cash, isn't obligated to follow any federal restrictions associated with it. Only I am. Why should a private university be subject to federal restrictions, when it's patron (a student) is the one given the money?

    Federal money comes in different ways. With each federal program or grant comes a different set of restrictive attachments. I do agree that if you recieve funding from entity X, then you are obligated to follow the rules and restrictions that come with it. The key though, is what those specific rules and restrictions are specifically. The HUD/MHFA programs we're involved with here work that way. Different funding comes with different rules and requirements. Some are more involved and restrictive, others are not.

    Every private school teaches differently. Every public school has it's own way of operating too. I'm sure many parents are also "disturbed" by what their kids are learning, or how "slanted" some of the ciriculum is in public schools. It's why parents have to be involved in their kids education. Schools will put information into a kids mind, but it's up the to the parents teach them what that information truly means. IMO anyway. One benefit your son has over most other people, is that he can pull his kid out, and send him some where else, whereas most of the parents of kids in public schools are more or less ****ed.
     
  13. Mrs.PatsFanInVa

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    #24 Jersey

    Using this sort of example, wouldn't the "student" compare to the "welfare recipient?" The welfare recipient has no federal restrictions, but the vendor does, doesn't he? If the store gets caught taking food stamps for cigarettes, for example, he may lose his contract with the government to accept food stamps for anything. Hence, the federal restrictions or guidelines are for the vendor, (ie: the school) not the welfare recipient (ie: the student.)

    Government grants for education costs is not like a welfare check - it's more like food stamps in that is designated for a specific purpose. The vendors allowed to provide that specific purpose are bound to follow federal guidelines if they wish to remain providers of that specific service.

    Not really. His wife won't let him. :)
     
  14. Real World

    Real World Moderator Staff Member

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    Your example goes to my point. It always depends on the specifics involved. Food stamps are a specific source of funds, and hence come with a different set of rules and restrictions. Cash payments don't. It's not one size fits all.
     
  15. The Brandon Five

    The Brandon Five Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

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    #75 Jersey

    After watching an interview with the professor who is behind this, I am suspicious that there is some Saudi money behind it. The professor refused to answer whether he was working with CAIR or any other group.
     
  16. The Brandon Five

    The Brandon Five Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

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    #75 Jersey

    Who forces them to choose a Catholic university or college? There are about 2,400 four-year institutions to choose from.
     
    Last edited: Nov 10, 2011

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