Is anyone else a little nervous about the D changes??

[cstjohn17]

What makes me nervous is that for the 4-3 to really work Wilfork and Haynesworth will be playing a lot. Big Vince has proven that he can handle it but Albert is not exactly a specimen, I don't think he will contribute more than 20 snaps per game.

Last year the Patriots were awful, 99 out of 210 47% conversion rate on 3rd down.
2010 NFL Team Downs Stats - National Football League - ESPN

If they can make one more stop per game it puts them around 83 / 210 , about 40%

Still brutal but better than dead last, wow were they bad last year.

 

[VJCPatriot]

What makes me nervous is that for the 4-3 to really work Wilfork and Haynesworth will be playing a lot. Big Vince has proven that he can handle it but Albert is not exactly a specimen, I don't think he will contribute more than 20 snaps per game.

That's why the Pats depth will be important. They are looking at Tommy Harris as a sub. Wright could certainly sub in for a penetrating role on 3rd downs, etc. Umenyiora though could really take this defense over the top. I hope BB is working the phones and manages to talk down the Giants to say a 2012 2nd plus a conditional pick.

 

[strngplyr]

That's why the Pats depth will be important. They are looking at Tommy Harris as a sub. Wright could certainly sub in for a penetrating role on 3rd downs, etc. Umenyiora though could really take this defense over the top. I hope BB is working the phones and manages to talk down the Giants to say a 2012 2nd plus a conditional pick.

I think we need to agree to get Mankins to resign before we could sign someone like Osi, what does our cap look like with Light resigned? I haven't seen any details on his contract yet, and unless we somehow talked Osi into keeping his 3.1m cap hit (unlikely, he already has a ring) we can't afford him without extending Mankins longterm and probably restructuring someones deal.

I'm all for signing this beast, been saying it since the very first rumors, but we need to know more about our current situation and get Mankins under a long term contract before this is possible I'd say.

 

[Rob0729]

I'm not so nervous. The Pats made a change to a 4-3 midseason in 2001 (actually after game 2 or 3) and they won the Super Bowl. The Pats have moved to primarily a four man front last year. If they ditch the 3-4 for the most part, they have already started the transition last year.

Although I wish they had a DE who is a good pass rusher (possibly Osi), I think they have most of the personnel to be in a 4-3 base. Obviously Wilfork and Haynesworth can start at DT. Mayo can play OLB in a 4-3. Spikes should be able to handle the MLB position especially playing behind the bohemouths. Cunningham was a DE in college.

 

[patfanken]

Is it even possible to scheme for two DT's that require double teams and can penetrate? The recent examples (Williams Wall/ Stroud/Henderson) were not exactly penetrating guys.

I don't see Vince as a penetrater. He's is though a perfect 2 technique guy who compliments and protects the core of the defense while the OTHER guy gets to make the big plays. He he might be good at, but he's hasn't done since College; Hard for a guy to change what he's been for the past 7 seasons.

But who knows. .

 

[Bigatrop]

Realistically we couldn't have gotten much worse on defense than the past few years. I think shifting the scheme and mentality of our D will only be an improvement.

Now if they were doing an entire offensive overhaul, there would be need for concern. But since that isn't the case, I can't complain.

 

[cstjohn17]

I don't see Vince as a penetrater. He's is though a perfect 2 technique guy who compliments and protects the core of the defense while the OTHER guy gets to make the big plays. He he might be good at, but he's hasn't done since College; Hard for a guy to change what he's been for the past 7 seasons.

But who knows. .

Thats funny because the knock on big Vince was the he was a one gap penetrator coming out of the U... but that was at least 50 pounds ago.

 

[Rob0729]

Thats funny because the knock on big Vince was the he was a one gap penetrator coming out of the U... but that was at least 50 pounds ago.

Yeah, how times have changed. People questioned the Pats selection of Wilfork because they didn't think he could handle the two gap and now people don't think he can handle the one gap.

 

[PowerRunRevival]

I have the same concern about this defense as I did the other defense. Who is going to rush the passer from the outside. We traded our 3-4 olb deficiency for a 4-3 DE deficiency. I'm also curious who starts in a 4-3?

Cunningham- Haynesworth- Wilfork- Moore?
Guyton- Spikes- Mayo?

 

[patfanken]

I think we need to agree to get Mankins to resign before we could sign someone like Osi, what does our cap look like with Light resigned?.

I made a rough calculation off of Miguel's page. Assuming the Pats have redone Chad and Albert's deals to save at least a 3rd off their current cap hits, and the cowst of Light and the 3 top rookies comes to around $10MM . And its true they can take 50% of the dead money hit and another 3MM from the $3MM "keep the vet" credit that won't come due til 2014, AND sign Mankins as shave $3MM off his current cap charge, THEN the Pats would have at least $10MM left to make other signings. Plenty enough to add whomever we want....if BB actually wants them.

Plenty of ifs in that assumption, but at least its more accurate than what you'll get from John Clayton. (now there's a new definition of "damning with faint praise" if I ever hear it. )

For what its worth I hope it helps answer your question

 

[strngplyr]

I made a rough calculation off of Miguel's page. Assuming the Pats have redone Chad and Albert's deals to save at least a 3rd off their current cap hits, and the cowst of Light and the 3 top rookies comes to around $10MM . And its true they can take 50% of the dead money hit and another 3MM from the $3MM "keep the vet" credit that won't come due til 2014, AND sign Mankins as shave $3MM off his current cap charge, THEN the Pats would have at least $10MM left to make other signings. Plenty enough to add whomever we want....if BB actually wants them.

Plenty of ifs in that assumption, but at least its more accurate than what you'll get from John Clayton. (now there's a new definition of "damning with faint praise" if I ever hear it. )

For what its worth I hope it helps answer your question

Another if, IF you're correct, that could easily pay Osi and someone like Lawson I'd say.

Thanks for the answers, lots of speculation there but it sounds like a good rough estimation.

We have to be under the cap by August 4th, correct? If we add anyone else soon I think we'll be hearing about a Mankins deal very shortly followed by some another addition(s).

 

[patfanken]

Another if, IF you're correct, that could easily pay Osi and someone like Lawson I'd say.

Thanks for the answers, lots of speculation there but it sounds like a good rough estimation.

We have to be under the cap by August 4th, correct? If we add anyone else soon I think we'll be hearing about a Mankins deal very shortly followed by some another addition(s).

I'm sure Miguel will have a much more accurate picture by Wednesday or Thursday, depending on his work load. In the mean time this will have to hold you.