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Iraqi PM suggests US might be asked to leave

Discussion in 'Political Discussion' started by weswelker#83, Jun 14, 2008.

  1. weswelker#83

    weswelker#83 In the Starting Line-Up

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  2. otis p. driftwood

    otis p. driftwood Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

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    Do you have links of this story from anyplace that counts? You know, like a real news outlet.

    BTW--you're overlooking a couple of things, O Bearer of all News Rotten: one, it's a negotiation ploy. He knows he's a dead man 36 hours after the US leaves. Second, the US has always said we'll leave if and when they ask.

    Put those things together, and you have your usual *yawn* bs post.

    Sleep tight, little wessy, sleep tight.
     
    Last edited: Jun 14, 2008
  3. weswelker#83

    weswelker#83 In the Starting Line-Up

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    Since 1857
    The McClatchy Company is the third-largest newspaper company in the United States, a leading newspaper and internet publisher dedicated to the values of quality journalism, free expression and community service. Building on a 151-year legacy of independence, the company's newspapers and websites are steadfast defenders of First Amendment values and advocates for the communities they serve.


    http://www.mcclatchy.com/


    I would believe them (McClatchy ),and not Fox news ,with no hesitations.
     
  4. otis p. driftwood

    otis p. driftwood Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

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    Really? Who do you supposed told them? Because...have you looked at their papers? The Belleville Democrat?

    I suppose merging with Knight-Ridder gives them a little more leverage, but it's still not the AP.

    Which brings up an interesting point, and the reason for my post. If you search for it under news...you don't find it reported except by McClatchy and then regurgitated on HuffPo and RawStory and IHateAmerica.com and so forth...so how come no one else has a story this big?
     
  5. PressCoverage

    PressCoverage Banned

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    they already have asked us to leave... several times... the Bush League ignored them.... i see this being no different...

    in the infamous words of Boy King:

    "they're occupied... i'd be unhappy too if i was occupied."
     
  6. Stokes

    Stokes In the Starting Line-Up

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    Has this government officially asked us to leave? I did not think they did.

    Hey, if they do that would be great! Get on out of there without any worries that we're leaving them high and dry!
     
  7. Patriot_in_NY

    Patriot_in_NY Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal

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    File this right up there with "Moss is on the bubble" rumors. There is 0% chance of this occuring. Stokes is right. The would relieve us of any obligation to stay.
     
  8. FootballYouBet

    FootballYouBet On the Roster

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    This story was also in the Washington Post.

    The issue here is not be about "leaving when we are asked". It is about why our government is asking to maintain 60 permanent military bases in Iraq, why we want control over their airspace, and why we want to be the ones who can make the determination of when Iraq is being threatened. Many of us already know the answers to these questions and those that don't know need to be educated.

    This is nothing more than colonization and empire building, and this plan, like the invasion of Iraq, is yet another part of a much larger plan forged out of the neoconservative think tank "Project For The New American Century". Iraq was step 1, military superiority in the region is step 2, and Iran is step 3.
     
  9. Patters

    Patters Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    McClatchy is a real news outlet:

    http://www.mcclatchy.com/100/story/179.html
     
  10. PressCoverage

    PressCoverage Banned

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    You've got to be kidding... Yes, they have...


    BAGHDAD, June 19, 2005 (IslamOnline.net & News Agencies) – Eighty two Iraqi lawmakers from across the political spectrum have pressed for the withdrawal of the US-led occupation troops from their country.

    The Shiite, Kurdish, Sunni Arab, Christian and communist legislators made the call in a letter sent by Falah Hassan Shanshal of the United Iraqi Alliance (UIA), the largest bloc in parliament, to speaker Hajem Al-Hassani, reported Agence France-Presse (AFP).

    “We have asked in several sessions for occupation troops to withdraw. Our request was ignored,” read the latter, made public on Sunday, June 19.



    When George Bush visited Baghdad on June 13, Iraq's vice president, Tariq al-Hashimi, asked him for a timeline for the withdrawal of foreign forces from Iraq. The following day, President Jalal Talabani released a statement expressing his support for the vice-president’s request. Then in an op-ed in the Washington Post on June 20, Mowaffak al-Rubbaie, the Iraqi national security adviser, called for a significant reduction in US troops this year, with most leaving next year. “We envisage the US troop presence by year’s end to be under 100,000, with most of the remaining troops to return home by the end of 2007,” wrote Dr. Al-Rubbaie. Al-Rubaie said that Iraqis now see foreign troops as occupiers rather than the liberators, and that their removal will strengthen the fledgling government by legitimizing it in the eyes of the Iraqi people.

    When was the Bush League and their corporate enablers "obliged" to stay? Never.
     
    Last edited: Jun 18, 2008
  11. otis p. driftwood

    otis p. driftwood Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

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    Would seem to me, PC, that if they want us to leave, we should get the frick out of there as fast as the cargo planes can be loaded, and leave them to whatever happens. Except for the pipelines. After all, this whole thing was for oil after all...
     
  12. Stokes

    Stokes In the Starting Line-Up

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    But you're ignoring the fact that the official request of the Iraqi government was that troops stay there, they even say it in the letter they sent:

    "“It is dangerous that the Iraqi government has asked the UN Security Council to prolong the stay of occupation forces without consulting representatives of the people who have the mandate for such a decision,” it said."

    And at any rate who are these 82 people? Are they all members of parliament? I doubt it, since then they would be called "members of parliament" instead of "lawmakers." Even if they all were members of parliament, that would be 82 out of 275, well short of a majority.

    The other thing you point to is a request for a timetable for withdrawal, not a demand to pull troops out of Iraq.

    I think you've got to be kidding, thinking that THIS is good evidence that the Iraqi government has officially asked that US troops leave the country. Nice effort though. Maybe you've got something better?
     
  13. PatriotsReign

    PatriotsReign Hall of Fame Poster

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    #18 Jersey

    There are so many "If only"'s in life. If only we knew that removing Saddam from power would leave us in the position we face today. Which to me is;

    1. Stay in Iraq and make them set up a democratic government that will be our ally

    2. Leave Iraq knowing that they might become a strong ally of Iran and their psycho president Mahmoud Ahmadinejad.

    How long do we stay and how much do we "persuade" Iraq to conform to our wishes? I definately don't want them to become an expansion of Iran's growing threat. At the same time, we're spending billions/trillions on Iraq while our economy at home is weakening.

    If only we knew.
     
    Last edited: Jun 18, 2008
  14. otis p. driftwood

    otis p. driftwood Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

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    Hand wringing gets us no where. Playing the what if game is great at 2AM...what if I'd married her what if I'd taken that job--but in the real world it sucks.

    I believe it was Patton who said something like a good plan executed today is better than a great plan that's never implemented (again---paraphrase, I'm too lazy to look up the exact quote right now. So I expect GJAJ or Reign will be more than ready to "assist me". :D).
     
  15. wistahpatsfan

    wistahpatsfan Pro Bowl Player

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    A threat to whom?:cool:
     
  16. otis p. driftwood

    otis p. driftwood Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

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    A nuclear equipped Iran, a threat to whom?

    Try everyone, wistah.

    You know that.
     
  17. PressCoverage

    PressCoverage Banned

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    I'm ignoring nothing... I read the story in its entirety.. Did you?

    Regardless, you said they never asked us to leave.

    I provided examples of "the largest bloc" of their Parliment doing just that, and now you're making qualifications that suggest my examples somehow don't count... well, because they're not Maliki. That's excellent.

    If you actually read the story slowly enough to grasp it, you would see the part where it says "The Shiite, Kurdish, Sunni Arab, Christian and communist legislators made the call in a letter sent by Falah Hassan Shanshal of the United Iraqi Alliance (UIA), the largest bloc in parliament...."

    Do you still "doubt it?" Or will you be keeping your argument mobile by suggesting they somehow don't count?

    So, you're certain, by default, that the other 193 members who are not represented in the request are actually in favor of troops staying in Iraq? If so, please provide a link. You've shown no sentiment at all besides that of al-Maliki, so please don't talk to me about what any "majority" must feel.

    Among the most transparent semantics arguments this forum has ever endured... I don't even need to address it, as this sentence above is utterly laughable.

    Smarmy much? I would say the latest news, as presented in the original post of this thread, is pretty good evidence that they want our forces to let the Iraqis stand up and for us to get the hell out -- whether that means immediately or a phased withdrawal. Regardless, I know it was a nice effort. And an accurate one, as well. Considering you punted to a semantics argument regarding a "time table" request by their vice president, and supported by their president, while ignoring the sentiment behind the request, I'd say you're the one doing whatever you can to extrapolate and obfuscate the basic premise here: The Bush League HAS been asked to leave, and the Bush League has ignored it on any level.

    You Bushies and your constant "yeah, but" confusion game is not fooling anyone anymore. The Iraqis want us out, and our leaders, time and time again, have shown they don't really care what Iraqis think.
     
    Last edited: Jun 18, 2008
  18. Stokes

    Stokes In the Starting Line-Up

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    They still haven't asked us to leave, they favor a timetable for withdrawal, but that is VERY different from asking us out once the UN mandate runs out in 2009. How can you wave that off as an unimportant difference? NEVER has the Iraqi government (executive or parliament) asked for US troops to leave and been ignored, have they? (I couldn't find anything yet) There is sentiment that they want us out, which is a good thing, but never any official action, never a change in policy. That may change now with the negotiations becoming more strained, but to this date it has not happened.

    It is clearly not just a semantic argument. Look, say I'm renting you an apartment, and we sit down to talk about renewing the lease. You want to, but I'm not so excited about it, and the real boss (my wife) wants you gone. Is me saying "I want you gone by Tuesday" and finding you still there Friday the same as saying "Let's talk about you moving out by the end of the year?" Of course not, in one case I've officially asked you to get out and you haven't, in the other case I'm not real happy about you being there, but I'm still allowing you to stay.

    And sorry if my post was smarmy.
     
    Last edited: Jun 18, 2008
  19. wistahpatsfan

    wistahpatsfan Pro Bowl Player

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    #75 Jersey

    EVERYONE?
    Oh...you mean everyone on their borders, right?
     
  20. otis p. driftwood

    otis p. driftwood Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

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    Not just their borders. If they can produce warheads, they've got the money to buy missiles.
     

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