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Iran Was a US Ally Before 1953 When We Killed Their Democratically Elected Leader

Discussion in 'Political Discussion' started by maverick4, May 23, 2007.

  1. maverick4

    maverick4 Banned

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    Neocons, stop trying to paint it like they hate us because it's a religious war by 'crazy' Islam, or because the Middle East hates us for our freedom and democracy.

    Please correct me if I'm wrong, but WASN'T IRAN A LONG HISTORICAL ALLY before they found out we assassinated their democratically elected leader? They didn't find out the truth until the late 1970's, we tried to hide it and lie.


    The real reason we are going to attack Iran is because of the power of AIPAC, and because we have to protect the petrodollar. Just tell it like it is, the lies are pathetic.
     
    Last edited: May 23, 2007
  2. Turd Furguson

    Turd Furguson Rotational Player and Threatening Starter's Job

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    1953 you say?


    What, cant go back in time any further? Perhaps Marty McFly is our only hope in this great big global mess. What shenanigans is that Biff Tannen up to now?
     
  3. QuiGon

    QuiGon Banned

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    Yup... just more of the same from the "Blame America First" crowd... nothing we haven't seen before from the usual people who make that the creed they live by...
     
  4. pats-blue

    pats-blue Third String But Playing on Special Teams

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    If your going to try and pull stuff out of your A** at least try and get your facts right. No one was assasinated in fact the PM was relieved of his duties by the Shah but he refused and was replaced in a military coup. Even Mohammed Mosaddeq closest allies stated his dissolving parliment to avoid impeachment was UNCONSTITUTIONAL. I have no doubts that the Brits and US were not helping the Shah for the good of the government of Iran but for oil interests...but since your post FIRST is not correct (big surprise) NO ONE WAS ASSASINATED (nice try..where did you pick that gem up?). SECOND Mohammed Mosaddeq tried to dissolve the Iraninan Parliment in an UNCONSITUTONAL procedure that even his allies did not agree with. So while the US and Brits motives I am sure were not "pure", Mohammed Mosaddeq was not the "leader" you make him out to be. He did things against the CONTITUTION of Iran and got called on it and when he did he got outsted when he reused to step down. OH and he lived until 1967 so he seemed to live years after he was "assasinated" Nice job with the facts!
     
  5. QuiGon

    QuiGon Banned

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    Since when do facts get in the way of Maverick's extreme ignorance...? He is long established as this forum resident idiot.
     
  6. Turd Furguson

    Turd Furguson Rotational Player and Threatening Starter's Job

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    Maverick's usual platform is to blame Israel. I'm suprised he's changed his target.

    Allah Ackbar Maverick!
     
  7. PressCoverage

    PressCoverage Banned

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    and so what does that make YOU? the forum's resident hyperactive child? ...

    fact is, the U.S. overthrew their government, and that set the stage for that nation's revolution... we attempted the same in Guatemala a year later... and then, well, Cuba...

    the Islamic government of Ayatollah Khomeini supported terrorist attacks against American interests largely because of the long American history of supporting the shah's suppressive regime.... even under more moderate rulers, many Iranians still resent the United States' role in the coup and its support of the shah....

    but don't let facts get in the way of your curious righty police-state version of truth...
     
  8. patsfan13

    patsfan13 Hall of Fame Poster PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Didn't go back far enough they hate us brcause of the Crusades. ;)
     
  9. pats-blue

    pats-blue Third String But Playing on Special Teams

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    Funny my girlfriend is Iranian and her family lived under the Shah and had to ESCAPE Iran after the Ayatollah came into power...last time I checked he wasn't elected either. For the record we didn't overthrow thier government, we supported thier government by assisting them in getting rid of a PM that was violating thier constitution....but thanks for the revisionist history lesson.

    My girlfriends family would STRONGLY disagree with you on the "moderate" rulers and "Iranians" resentment of the US for support of the Shah...I know about 30 Iranians that lived there...how many do you know?
     
  10. PressCoverage

    PressCoverage Banned

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    what are you, 7? are you next gonna suggest your dad can beat up my dad? i don't really give a sh!t how many Iranians you know...

    i'm well aware that the student population there wants change, and the older secular generation is largely the ones holding resentment... what is your point?... there are still widespread resentments for our meddling in their affairs for decades... meddling that Boy King and his cabal are evidently trying all over again... their rulers trust us no less than ours trust them... wonder why? which country has infiltrated the other?

    your semantics argument aside, the U.S., while not doing the actual overthrow, certainly played a huge role in the process...
     
  11. pats-blue

    pats-blue Third String But Playing on Special Teams

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    Funny I just called you on INCORRECT statements and point out WHY they are incorrect since I know many Iranians that lived under BOTH regimes and that dosen't seem to be thier take at all....my girlfriend, her Mom, Dad or her Grandmother who still lives there. 90% of the Iranians actually like the US it is the 10% mob that runs the country now (that is from my girlfriend and her families opinions) I don't know how I can be more fair before YOU stp acting like a child. You think I'm 7? You need to read what you write, your like a little internet tough guy. You were not careful on what you wrote, I called you on it and you threw a hissy fit and tried to insult me...wow real adult. You need to grow up.
     
  12. PressCoverage

    PressCoverage Banned

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    so says the guy i've never talked to who addressed me first with a snotty antagonistic post, misrepresenting my words "moderate" and "Iranians"... when, in fact, i said "more moderate" and "many iranians"... huge difference... tell you what... try quoting me accurately, and enter a debate with some class and respect, and it won't be necessary to hold your p!ssy attitude accountable...

    anyhow... yup, you're 7... and a hypocrite... you're pissed because i called you on the fact that your own broad-brushed post had major holes... then you throw out some percentage against the wall above, as if it's fact... even though i conceded that the younger generations of that nation want regime change... you're gonna set a number to it... ok ambassador... tell us where you arrived at such a specificity...

    further, internet tough guy, ... tell us all, if a foreigner stayed with an American family of 3 generations that sat around watching Fox News together each night, would he deduce that all three generations were no doubt indicative of overall American sentiment?

    if you're gonna sit here and suggest that a mere 10% of that nation hates america, you're sadly mistaken...

    it's ironic that i'm a guy who pleads in my blogs that the iranian situation can take care of itself from within, and that the student population is ripe for change, and yet a Bush Leaguer is here trying to give me a lesson on how much Iran loves us... you guys are all over the map... all you really know is that you love American military might, explosions, and capitalistic exploitation... the longterm consequences from other cultures be damned...
     
    Last edited: May 24, 2007
  13. pats-blue

    pats-blue Third String But Playing on Special Teams

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    See the difference with my "broad strokes" is that I actually have talked to THREE generations of actual Iranians who lived there...those are y FACTS..where are yours from?

    Again your broad strokes I DO NOT advocate action on Iran. BUt that doesn't matter to you because you are an idiot. You need to read your posts because yours was the ones with holes in it. You made calims that weren't true and had to back track and claim "semantics" sorry it wasn't semantics. THE FACT was your statements were not reality, regardless what you wanted it to be. (we didn't overthrow thier government, we actually supported the governement which was the Shah) Oh and who is playing semantics oh you said..."MORE" moderate wow such a difference. Your pathetic.

    I find it amusing that you find a post that I point out that my girlfriend and her extended family lived under the Shah and had to escape from Iran under the "new" regime espouse a completely different belife than what you said. I see noting antagonistic pointing that out. I think the 30 Iraninans (her extended family and friends (who are mostly Persian)) have a better handle on what Iranians think than you or I so pardon me if I take thier word for it. I also pointed out on my post that I was stating THIER opinion..so this ambassador got his percentages from my girlfriend and her family who were all either born in or currently live in Iran (grandmother). Thats THIER opinion.

    So I a sorry that the people I know from Iran do not agree with you (by the way they HATE Bush, but completely disagree with your assesment of the Shah and Iran politics) I guess that hurts your feelings and you feel that is antagonistic. This one IS antagonistic because you threw a tantrum when someone disagrees an degenterated into your tough guy routine. Still not sure where me pointing out I was getting my information from ACTUAL Iranians and that you take as antagonistic. Guess facts that don't agree with yours are an affront to you I guess...sure sign of adulthood.:rolleyes:
     
  14. PressCoverage

    PressCoverage Banned

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    let's review, shall we? your unsolicited d!ckishness in post No. 9 included two blatant misquotes of what i said, which you've acknowledged and tried to minimize above, as well as a condescending suggestion that i was revising history... both antagonistic... which is fine, but to cry about my post in response to your "shot across the bow" is the utter definition of cowardice... not to mention your immature "my girlfriend's family (says blah blah blah).... how many Iranians do YOU know?" grade school comment

    again, so you've alledgedly gotten first-hand sentiment from one family from Iran... whoopie!!!!!!.... because you asked, my sources are Time, Newsweek, the New York Times, the Washington Post, the L.A. Times, Life magazine, various history books taught at major universities, and so on... you know, the kind of stuff your president refuses to read... or can't... now, you can rest your hat on the information your chosen Iranian family relays to you for the rest of this conflict if you wish... a conflict our "leaders" appear bent on willfully inflaming... I, however, will stick with learned scholars, award-winning journalists, theologans and official governmental documents... all of whom confirm there is a lot of lingering anti-U.S. sentiment there as a direct result of our meddling in their affairs throughout the cold war... now if you want to dispute that by referencing to your family exclusively, that's your decision... and the forum can decide for themselves the truth behind Iran's breakdown of pro- vs. anti-U.S. passions... we largely happen to agree that there is a lot of pro-U.S. sentiment there, and yet you're trying to lecture me about just how much and being smarmy about it in the process... how unproductive... striking, however, that you completely ignored the Fox Family parallel... yet predictable...

    further, i never gave an "assessement of the Shah and Iranian politics" .. i offered one sentence about the U.S.'s history of support for the Shah... . so, once again, you're being as overdramatic as an emotional schoolgirl...

    lastly, you NEVER hurt my feelings, cool guy... i was merely holding your crying accountable by reminding you who lit this fire...
     
    Last edited: May 24, 2007
  15. pats-blue

    pats-blue Third String But Playing on Special Teams

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    HHHMM you are so offended about being misquoted but you have no problem misstating facts? Tell me Mr. scholar...when did the US overthrow the Iraninan government...or in all of your extensive Iraniian knowledge do you think we "assasinated" the Iranian PM like the OP posted? Do you read the same history books? It seems so because you are so offended I "misquoted" you yet you have no problem "misquoting" history? Your posts are the definition of smarmy. I guarantee you I am not a coward, however I am quite sure if in public you would hide behind your skirt as you insult everyone here hiding behind your keyboard. Go back to your "blog tough guy its obviou you are a do nothing complainer that can't do anything but whine and think they are "right" and can never see another side you are happy in your misery. It's obvious you label people out right throwing your comments when you know nothing about them or thier standing on issues. Typical of your post maybe you should review them I would point out post #7 (yeah wonder where I get smarmy from huh?) Then I would point out how you hate being "misquoted" and are so upset about it yet you post "fact is, the U.S. overthrew their government (wow did I misquote that? Oh that right "semantics"! how convieniant)...I know very boring reading...blah, blah, blah....
     
    Last edited: May 24, 2007
  16. Fogbuster

    Fogbuster Pro Bowl Player

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    I believe the main issues in the installation of the Shah were: friendliness toward the West, a willingness to allow Israel to exist, and free market access to oil. The Shah was on board with all these points but the former PM was much more shaky, had too many debts to extremist allies who were dead set against Israel.


    //
     
  17. PressCoverage

    PressCoverage Banned

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    what a confusing temper tantrum... right down to an insinuated threat... good stuff... but i guarantee you i wouldn't hide... i do much better in person, especially concerning all things Bush League...

    but for all your challenge, you won't acknowledge or deny the fact of who started this exchange... yes, that's right it was you... misquoting and baiting...

    as for the above quote, i know what i said... and i know what i didn't say... here's a couple things i didn't say: 1) that i had "extensive Iranian knowledge" ... 2) that we assassinated Mossadegh... never said... so, declaring that i must somehow feel that way is an insult...

    now, back to the meat of your post... yes, i said: "we overthrew their government"... wow, you got me... i suppose we didn't actually have U.S. agents over there who physically threw a bag over the man and ushered him into a waiting Jeep and hustled him off to some dark room... clearly, i was wrong for not writing a dissertation covering precisely what i meant .... instead i spoke vaguely, and now you're doing cartwheels over the minnow you were able to hook...

    back to reality, please don't minimize the U.S. government's role in Operation Ajax... if you would like to debate the specifics of Ajax, we can... but if you're going to take a "don't blame the U.S. stance", you're going to lose... i'll say it again by adding a simple word to hopefully calm you down a bit:

    "fact is, we helped overthrow their government"... helped immensely...
     
  18. QuiGon

    QuiGon Banned

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    Now y'all know why I've PLONKED PressCoverage. Not only is he a complete moron, but he is an immature jerk who loves to dish it out but always throws a temper tantrum when he receives 10% of the venom he spews.
     
  19. maverick4

    maverick4 Banned

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    OK, that was stupid of me to make a mistake in reading what happened. I obviously wasn't alive at that time, and it was retarded of me to misread. So Iran's democratically elected leader wasn't killed by us, but was overthrown by us (so much for 'spreading democracy'). My apologies to everyone, it appears I can't change the title at this point.

    Here is an excerpt about US involvement, from wiki:

    "Operation Ajax (1953) (officially TP-AJAX) was a covert operation by the United Kingdom and the United States to remove the nationalist[1] cabinet of Iranian Prime Minister Mohammed Mossadegh from power, to support the Pahlavi dynasty and consolidate the power of Mohammed Reza Pahlavi in order to preserve the Western control of Iran's oil infrastructure[2]. Former U.S. Secretary of State Madeleine Albright, during the administration of President Bill Clinton, made an apology to the Islamic Republic of Iran in 2000 for the United States' role in the overthrow."

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Ajax
     
    Last edited: May 24, 2007
  20. maverick4

    maverick4 Banned

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    Funny that this came from Quigon. All he knows is to insult whoever disagrees with him, be abrasive, escalate arguments with a dozen different posters on here, and he cares a LITTLE too much about an online message board.
     

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