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Interesting claim: The Jets are more talented than the Patriots by a wide margin

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by Deus Irae, Jan 12, 2011.

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  1. Deus Irae

    Deus Irae PatsFans.com Retired Jersey Club PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I just saw this post on a Jets board (it's the topic of another thread here) and thought it might spark some interest.

    Discuss. [​IMG]
  2. billdog3484

    billdog3484 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    laughable, but what do you expect.

    There's no right answer. we will find out sunday. i will keep my mouth shut till then
  3. CrazyDave

    CrazyDave Rookie

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    A case of believing their own hype perhaps?
  4. patsinthesnow

    patsinthesnow PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #87 Jersey

    Part of that is true. Give Brady Holmes, Edwards, Crotchery, Keller, and that defense they probably are unstoppable.

    Luckily, Sanchez is one of the worst qbs in the league and Brady is the best.
  5. DanishPatFan

    DanishPatFan Rookie

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    I will say it like this, i would not swap teams. This young core of players we have, makes me so exited for the years to come! I Actually like this team better than the 07 team, but i dont know why :)
  6. robertweathers

    robertweathers Rookie

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    I hate the argument of which team has more talent. I think the Jets are talented. I think the Patriots are talented. Each team is capable of beating the other.

    If the Patriots win on Sunday, I don't think that necessarily means that they are more talented. It does mean that they played better on that day and are perhaps a better team overall.

    I use the same logic as 2007 Pats/Giants. Giants played better that day. That doesn't mean that they have more talent or are the better overall team.
  7. dhamz

    dhamz Rookie

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    If by more talented they mean the Jets have more guys with reputations based less on production and more on name recognition (Scott, Cromartie, and Pace come to mind) or more once great now mediocre guys (Tomlinson, Taylor) then they certainly do.

    If they are talking about the talent to make plays on the field in January 2011 I could not disagree more.
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2011
  8. 363839

    363839 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I'll take Welker, Branch, Gronks and Aaron over anyone of those guys.
    They don't (usually) drop easy passes and they are good team leaders.
  9. PYPER

    PYPER Rookie

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    I think that's b/c of our style. We're much more balanced this year. In '07, McDaniels fell in love w/the passing game (hard to blame him) and we must have run 80-90% of our offense out of shutgun. This year we not only run the ball but we also utilize play action and spread the ball around much more. On top of that there is the issue of expectations. There was considerable talk about that team going undefeated even before the season began whereas nobody really knew what to expect out of this team. Many mediots even predicted a 3rd place finish. Opposing fans taunted us with the idea that the empire was crumbling.

    I look at it like this. The '07 team proved everybody right while this team has proven everybody wrong. It's always more fun to prove everybody wrong.
  10. Ice_Ice_Brady

    Ice_Ice_Brady Rookie

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    Talent is used for acting, so let's draw up a good analogy.

    Sanchez vs. Brady is like Stephen Spielberg versus me. You could give Stephen Spielberg a bunch of soap opera actors, crappy editors and cameramen, a pretty bad script, and throw in some third-rate music. You could then give me Russell Crowe, Edward Norton, a great script, all the best producers, a John Williams score, and basically everything else.

    Spielberg makes a much better movie than I do.

    Same is true about Brady and Sanchez. If you don't have the right director, all of your talent doesn't really amount to much.
  11. blackglass3

    blackglass3 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    What's REALLY funny is Saturday afternoon I looked at Gang Green for a bit. The thread I focused on was called "Not feeling it" or something to that extent. And it was basically almost all the posters on that site saying they thought they had no chance in hell, how they were ready to go into the offseason and make the changes to get better next year, ect ect.

    Then Sunday I went back and it was all about how there is no way the Jets lose in New England. :rolleyes:
  12. upstater1

    upstater1 Rookie

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    You look at the Jets WRs, RBs and some of their defneders, like Revis and Harris, and you say, yes, they are very talented. Who wouldn't want Santonio and Cotchery.

    Then you say, would you swap Santonio, Cotchery, Edwards and Keller for Welker, Branch, Gronk, Hernandez and Tate. I say no.

    Would you swap LaDainian and Greene for Woodhead and Green-Ellis. heck no.

    Would you swap the Jets OL for the Patriots OL. No.

    Would you swap Wilfork for Shaun Ellis? No.

    Would you swap Mayo, Spikes and Cunningham for Harris, Pace and Scott? To tell the truth, I haven't watched Scott enough to know how he's been performing for the Jets, and I can easily see how 31 out of 32 fanbases would say yes, but I'm just going to say no.

    Would you swap McCourty and Arrington for Revis and Cromartie? The latter is better, so chalk one up for the Jets.

    Safeties? Patriots.

    Only at LB and CB do I see a Jets advantage.
  13. BSR

    BSR Rookie

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    The surgeon general warns that frequent exposure to a Jets message board can lead to brain damage...seriously.


    Personally, I think both teams have talent but much of that wasn't evident until the end of the season. I think nobody would have claimed at the beginning of the season that we had a better TE situation, but at this point our TE absolutely dominate over theirs. I'd take Gronk or Hernandez over Keller. Same probably is true of some of some of the other rookies/pick ups. BJGE, Branch, Woodhead, Arrington, Cunningham, Spikes make this team much more talented then we had previously given them credit. Its not unusual that those on the outside haven't realized this yet.
  14. Deus Irae

    Deus Irae PatsFans.com Retired Jersey Club PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Ok, so we can give the QB matchup to Brady without question, and there's no question as to the head coach. So, let's move on from there. Both teams run a 3-4, so the matchups should be even. Let's break it down.

    Offense:

    QB - Brady
    RB1
    RB2
    LT - Even
    LG - Mankins
    C - Mangold
    RG - Moore
    RT - Vollmer
    TE1
    TE2
    WR1
    WR2
    WR3

    Defense:

    LDE
    NT
    RDE
    LOLB
    LILB
    RILB
    ROLB
    CB1
    CB2
    S1
    S2
    $.05B
    $.10B

    Special Teams:

    P
    K
    Units


    Anyone have other "no brainers"? For the sake of the cornerbacks discussion, because it's an overall talent question, let's use the 1 and 2 designations only as best and second best overall, not to match up Revis/McCourty and Cromartie/Arrington. I would keep the nickel and dime spots as is, though.

    I'll start by suggesting Mangold as the clear winner over Koppen, and Wilfork as the clear winner over Pouha.


    Edit: Also, if anyone thinks I should add any more slots for comparison, or consider any group besides the CBs to be interchangeable in slotting, let me know.
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2011
  15. luvbrain

    luvbrain Rookie

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    They may be more talented (higher round talents) compared to Pats but Pats have more real "football players".
  16. Real American Hero

    Real American Hero Rookie

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    They have a lot of fancy names and hype, I guess that equates to some perceived "talent" advantage, but as proven time and time again its not how much talent you have but what you do with what you've got. And that is where the Pats are miles ahead.
  17. Fencer

    Fencer Rookie

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    The Pats were 2 games better in the standings with Brady vs. Sanchez and BB vs. Ryan. Standings were close last year as well, especially if you count the postseason. It's reasonable to conjecture that those two advantages equaled more than 2 games.

    That said, it's tough to see where the Jets have an advantage other than CB and RB (or C if you split it out from interior OL).

    And the Pats have 8 Pro Bowl selections vs. 3 for the Jets, 7-3 if you exclude Brady, 6-3 if you exclude Meriweather as well. ;)
  18. ATippett56

    ATippett56 Rookie

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    NT Chris Jenkins, 31 years old
    NT Sione Pouha, 31 years old
    DE Shaun Ellis, 33 years old
    DE Trevor Price, 35 years old
    DE Mike DeVito, 26 years old
    OLB Calvin Pace, 30 years old
    OLB Jason Taylor, 36 years old
    OLB Bryan Thomas, 31 years old
    OLB Vernon Gholston, 24 years old (1st Round Bust)
    ILB Bart Scott, 30 years old
    ILB David Harris, 26 years old

    So outside of Mike DeVito and David Harris, where is the talent on the NY Jets defensive front seven below the age of 30? Looks like some of the defensive players on the NY Jets roster are well past their prime.
  19. aluminum seats

    aluminum seats Rookie

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    Pats were 3 better, just sayin'.

    I think upstater's take on it was more or less correct. Disagree about Jets' advantage at RB.
  20. godef

    godef Rookie

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    This is the NFL.

    The 1980 Patriots were talented. :cool:
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2011
  21. 37Harrison

    37Harrison Rookie

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    IF the Jests have more talent then it just goes to show that the Pats have the better coach and are a better t-e-a-m. As Bill is quoted as saying, "It's not about collecting talent, it's about building a team."
  22. Consent

    Consent Banned

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    the jets may have talent but people are forgetting that its not jets d vs pats d or jets o vs pats o. I'll take the pats o vs jets d and as long as sanchez quaterbacking ill take pats d vs jets o.
  23. livinginthe past

    livinginthe past Rookie

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    #12 Jersey

    I'll take your inane Jetsfan rant and raise you a:

    This Pats team is not THAT good!! - TheGangGreen.com Message Board
  24. sarge

    sarge Rookie

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    Not sure I agree with this analogy. In the grand scheme of things I would say acting requires some of the least talent as opposed to most other jobs. Though I certianly agree directing requires a lot of talent, and Spielberg is a master.

    But I agree with your premise.

    I heard something similar on the radio a few weeks ago. Essentially, great coaches and great players need one another to realize there full potential.
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2011
  25. Deus Irae

    Deus Irae PatsFans.com Retired Jersey Club PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Yes, that's the O.P. to the post that started the thread I was referring to:

    http://www.patsfans.com/new-england-patriots/messageboard/10/725224-greatest-thread-ever.html

    The post I pulled is from that thread. I find the takes on talent a lot more interesting than the "Brady is gay!"/"Rex is fat!" types of arguments, which I don't see impacting play on the field.
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2011
  26. RodThePat

    RodThePat Rookie

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    It's not laughable. The Jets are more physically talented than the Patriots. Their depth might no be as good, their QB might be a high-schooler when compared to ours, but if you put their starting 22 against our starting 22 they have more talented players than we do. That is no way means they are a better team, though.
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2011
  27. PatsBoy12

    PatsBoy12 Rookie

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    This was a pretty god analogy.
  28. ATippett56

    ATippett56 Rookie

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    Offense:

    QB - Brady by a solar system over Sanchez
    RB1 - BJGE over Greene
    RB2 - Tomlinson over Woodhead
    LT - Ferguson/Light Even
    LG - Mankins by a mile
    C - Mangold slight edge over Koppen
    RG - Moore/Neal Even
    RT - Vollmer by a mile
    TE1 - Gronkowski by a mile
    TE2 - Keller slight edge over Hernandez
    WR1 - Holmes by a mile over Tate
    WR2 - Branch slight edge over Edwards
    WR3 - Welker by a mile over Cotchery
  29. robertweathers

    robertweathers Rookie

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    Only two that are worth a debate.

    Ferguson is outstanding

    Mangold may be a wider edge over Kop.
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2011
  30. sieglo

    sieglo Rookie

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    I have no argument for the Jets fan here.
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