I'm tired of this Colts are loaded with talent myth

[JackBauer]

Brown has barely even touched the ball. If you think Addai is overrated you obviously don't pay much attention to Colt football not to mention Addai is arguably one of the BEST blocking RB in the league...No runningback would flourish on the Colts they are not built for that. Not a single RB the Pats have would be considered above average if even average on the colts.

This is one of the most ass backwards things I've read on this board in some time.

Addai sucks, and BJGE is easily better.

 

[goheels22002]

If BB had this squad, they'd be contending for a playoff spot.

More to the point, with Brian Hoyer at QB this team is a 5-6 type team. Curtis Painter is a stiff.

 

[karran_s]

The Colts are talented, in my view, as they do have good players.

However, they have a horrible coach and they are missing their key player on their offense (Manning) as also their OC (again.. Manning), as he would not only call plays but also change plays at the line of scrimmage just before the snap and had great instincts on what the defense was showing and how to take advantage of that. Tom Brady does it also but Manning was more than a QB ... he was their OC, their chief motivator and knew everything going on at the line. Don't get me wrong.. I'm a Manning hater but I have to admire the enemy, particularly a strong and skilled one like Peyton.

No one could replace that talent and that's where the Colts as an organization fails. In the case of BB, although Cassell didn't play many snaps, he knew every drill and was always talking to Brady and knew the offense really well. The Colts, on the other hand, did not develop their back up QBs.

Having said all of the above, I don't see how NE could lose, unless they don't prepare at all and show up like they did against the Browns last year, where an inferior team won. Of course, anything is possible on any given Sunday and you could have a dropped punt, a blocked field goal and a couple of lucky interceptions with a score by the defense which could defeat the Vegas spread. However, even if the Pats are down by say, 2 TDs at the beginning of the 4th quarter, they should still win.

It would take a real miracle for a Colts victory tomorrow and I think even their players, fans and everyone in Colts nation know it.

 

[karran_s]

Then we just simply disagree.
I don't know why you needed to confuse this.
If you want to think the Colts players, despite not playing as well, as just as good as the Patriots plays, feel free. I think you will continue to have trouble finding anyone to agree with you.

Couldn't have said it better.. Football is a team game and for a team to work and play together, you need a strong leader and without one, what happens .. the team falls apart, which is exactly what's happening with the Colts. No amount of individual talent / brilliance can rescue the Colts. It's not like baseball, where one swing of the bat can get you a grand slam and win you the game if you are down by 3 in the ninth inning. In football, comebacks do happen but you need someone like a Manning or Brady or Rodgers or Drew to pull it off. If the Colts are down by a single TD, they will be out of this game.. I don't see any interest in watching this after half time, IMO. Who knows, it may be over in the 1st quarter itself.

However, this is football and BB knows it better than anyone else. He will have to have his players fully motivated, weak opponent or not. For all you know, the Colts could be super motivated tomorrow and play this like a SB, for they know that even if they win just one game (to prevent the 0-16), this is the game they would die for, so to speak !!

 

[Rob0729]

Part of that is by design, however. The Colts have been losing players to injury.

Do they make claims on waived guys who could be an upgrade?
NO.

Do they bring in veteran free agents for tryouts?
NO.

Before the trade deadline, did they try to do anything?
NO.


You can give them the "woe is me, we have no talent at the bottom of the roster" excuse when it is central to their philosophy of tanking to get Andrew Luck.

Who have the Vikings signed or claimed off waivers? Or the Rams (other than trading for Brandon Lloyd, but that was in October when they thought they might turn around the season)? Or the Panthers?

Usually teams with no shot of winning do not make waiver claims or add free agents. Few make trades either unless they can pick up a great player like Lloyd who has the potential to stick around for more than this year. By your definition, the Panthers and Vikings are "Sucking for Luck" too.

If you know you aren't going to be competitive in a particular season, there is no reason to take on additional contracts for players who will probably not stick around after that season.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

My argument is simply that it is silly for a Pats fan to call the Colts talentless and us not, because they are very close to the same, minus the coach and healthy QB (as well as the desire to win now and not lose for draft position). That a lot of Patsfans favorites like Benjarvus and Branch are not that good just like this guy is saying of Colts players.

But that only works if you believe that Indy is purposely losing, which I do, if you disagree then ignore my comments. I think they could have beaten a few of teams this year even with their horrible QB, now you add in a decent-good starting QB like Cassel with a great coach and they are a playoff team.

Your problem is your argument has no bearing on the OP's original contention. The Colts aren't loaded with talent. No one is talking about NE being loaded with talent... If the Colts had a healthy Manning and a great HC and staff is like saying if my aunt had balls she'd be my uncle...

That's the problem with you contrarians. Can't participate in a rational discussion because you keep trying to turn it into a referendum on something else...

A healthy Manning on essentially the same team last season playing an easier schedule and being gifted more than once won 10 games. They neither lost much nor gained much in this offseason and like Bill says, if you aren't getting better you're probably getting worse. Given their 2011 schedule they'd have been lucky to win 8-9 games with Manning. Might have fallen below .500. Without him they are a perfect .000...

 

[MoLewisrocks]

LOL.........

quick question........without brady, what'e the pats record this year?.....I already know your answer, but I want to hear it anyway.....I'm figuring 1, maybe 2 wins.....

That's what the morons here predicted when Cassel took over in 2008, too...

Tell you what though, it's not 0-16...

 

[MoLewisrocks]

Who have the Vikings signed or claimed off waivers? Or the Rams (other than trading for Brandon Lloyd, but that was in October when they thought they might turn around the season)? Or the Panthers?

Usually teams with no shot of winning do not make waiver claims or add free agents. Few make trades either unless they can pick up a great player like Lloyd who has the potential to stick around for more than this year. By your definition, the Panthers and Vikings are "Sucking for Luck" too.

If you know you aren't going to be competitive in a particular season, there is no reason to take on additional contracts for players who will probably not stick around after that season.

It's as if some here have been living under a rock. Polian is adverse to FA. He's also snakebit with the exception of our former kicker. The last time he signed a big ticket FA it cost him $13M for a handful of games in just one season... He signed one name FA this offseason, can't remember who, and Colts fans were stoked. Guy never made the roster... Polian believes you can't teach an old dog new tricks. With the coaching staff he assembles that's probably true. Even most of his own FA he extended have burned him of late... That coupled with his recent draft decline (particularly in the early rounds) and a stagnant cap has killed him and that team. Manning opted for a cap friendly deal this time around with the stipulation that Polian use the difference to add talent to the team. Didn't happen... And as for the fascination with waiver wire claims, do people grasp why these guys were waived??? Most are addition by subtraction guys with the faint hope some other sucker picks up the rest of the tab because the team who is waiving them is done with them either way... The only teams who take a shot at them are desperately clinging to playoff hopes. Indy realized they had none about 7-8 weeks ago...

 

[Patsfan1102]

This is one of the most ass backwards things I've read on this board in some time.

Addai sucks, and BJGE is easily better.

No its not you just don't understand it...BJGE is not better then Addai...BJGE on the colts would be absolutely horrible

 

[Patsfan1102]

I think we'd all agree EDGE was elite. But his # look HORRIBLE. Addai puts up similiar numbers just with less carries. The arguement about rb's is just pointless anyone who thinks Addai isn't better then every RB the pats have is just wrong. End of story. I would love to trade RB's with the colt's(cept for vereen and ridley for potential) just so everyone can see how well Addai could run behind practically 7 O-LINEMAN with Gronk and Solder. PLease addai runs behind a horrible run blocking o-line with all tight-ends going on routes. BJGE yes I love him but he sucks he is a product of the pats system anywhere else he may not even make the team...

People saying Donald Brown was a bust that's hy he got no carries....uhhhh no he's not a great recieving back and Manning likes to have a reciever at every position..ADDAI...so Brown got no touches. Brown's 4.7 yards per carry this year looks pretty good if you ask me. If you watch the games you see just how talented he is. Both of these 1st round RB"S would flourish on a team that runs the ball consistently. Would BJGE or Woodhead? NO

As for their WR's please were talking talent here. Wayne is older now so he is gettin worse he's still a HOF like having an old moss but different talents. Garcon compared to who BRANCH? are you kiddin me talent wise that is not even close!!!! Garcon is one of the most elusive wr's in the league who drops a few passes but lets not forget who led the league or close to it in drops last year WELKER. Collie is hurt but to have a perfect passer rating going to him is nuts he'd looked better then Wayne when he was out there.

The only thing really getting to me is people who think Addai isn't better then everyone we have...why? because ITS NOT EVEN CLOSE. We dont have TALENTED RB's maybe Vereen and Ridley one day. But BJGE and Woodhead aren't very good they run behind 7 o-lineman!!!!!! Kind of like when Maroney was here and he had solid stats. Where is he now? NOWHERE just like BJGE will be when he leaves NE. The only thing he has going for him is he doesn't fumble and runs hard. Without any holes he is not gaining yards. Addai almost NEVER has any holes and makes his own.

 

[strngplyr]

I think we'd all agree EDGE was elite. But his # look HORRIBLE. Addai puts up similiar numbers just with less carries. The arguement about rb's is just pointless anyone who thinks Addai isn't better then every RB the pats have is just wrong. End of story. I would love to trade RB's with the colt's(cept for vereen and ridley for potential) just so everyone can see how well Addai could run behind practically 7 O-LINEMAN with Gronk and Solder. PLease addai runs behind a horrible run blocking o-line with all tight-ends going on routes. BJGE yes I love him but he sucks he is a product of the pats system anywhere else he may not even make the team...

People saying Donald Brown was a bust that's hy he got no carries....uhhhh no he's not a great recieving back and Manning likes to have a reciever at every position..ADDAI...so Brown got no touches. Brown's 4.7 yards per carry this year looks pretty good if you ask me. If you watch the games you see just how talented he is. Both of these 1st round RB"S would flourish on a team that runs the ball consistently. Would BJGE or Woodhead? NO

As for their WR's please were talking talent here. Wayne is older now so he is gettin worse he's still a HOF like having an old moss but different talents. Garcon compared to who BRANCH? are you kiddin me talent wise that is not even close!!!! Garcon is one of the most elusive wr's in the league who drops a few passes but lets not forget who led the league or close to it in drops last year WELKER. Collie is hurt but to have a perfect passer rating going to him is nuts he'd looked better then Wayne when he was out there.

The only thing really getting to me is people who think Addai isn't better then everyone we have...why? because ITS NOT EVEN CLOSE. We dont have TALENTED RB's maybe Vereen and Ridley one day. But BJGE and Woodhead aren't very good they run behind 7 o-lineman!!!!!! Kind of like when Maroney was here and he had solid stats. Where is he now? NOWHERE just like BJGE will be when he leaves NE. The only thing he has going for him is he doesn't fumble and runs hard. Without any holes he is not gaining yards. Addai almost NEVER has any holes and makes his own.

Your analysis of how amazing Addai is is quite impressive. I am now a Colts fan because of this. Thank you!

 

[IllegalContact]

That's what the morons here predicted when Cassel took over in 2008, too...

Tell you what though, it's not 0-16...

you should go back and check your facts before spouting stupidity.........and its not the same team now

 

[Rob0729]

I think we'd all agree EDGE was elite. But his # look HORRIBLE. Addai puts up similiar numbers just with less carries. The arguement about rb's is just pointless anyone who thinks Addai isn't better then every RB the pats have is just wrong. End of story. I would love to trade RB's with the colt's(cept for vereen and ridley for potential) just so everyone can see how well Addai could run behind practically 7 O-LINEMAN with Gronk and Solder. PLease addai runs behind a horrible run blocking o-line with all tight-ends going on routes. BJGE yes I love him but he sucks he is a product of the pats system anywhere else he may not even make the team...

People saying Donald Brown was a bust that's hy he got no carries....uhhhh no he's not a great recieving back and Manning likes to have a reciever at every position..ADDAI...so Brown got no touches. Brown's 4.7 yards per carry this year looks pretty good if you ask me. If you watch the games you see just how talented he is. Both of these 1st round RB"S would flourish on a team that runs the ball consistently. Would BJGE or Woodhead? NO

As for their WR's please were talking talent here. Wayne is older now so he is gettin worse he's still a HOF like having an old moss but different talents. Garcon compared to who BRANCH? are you kiddin me talent wise that is not even close!!!! Garcon is one of the most elusive wr's in the league who drops a few passes but lets not forget who led the league or close to it in drops last year WELKER. Collie is hurt but to have a perfect passer rating going to him is nuts he'd looked better then Wayne when he was out there.

The only thing really getting to me is people who think Addai isn't better then everyone we have...why? because ITS NOT EVEN CLOSE. We dont have TALENTED RB's maybe Vereen and Ridley one day. But BJGE and Woodhead aren't very good they run behind 7 o-lineman!!!!!! Kind of like when Maroney was here and he had solid stats. Where is he now? NOWHERE just like BJGE will be when he leaves NE. The only thing he has going for him is he doesn't fumble and runs hard. Without any holes he is not gaining yards. Addai almost NEVER has any holes and makes his own.

Edgerrin James played for the Colts for seven seasons he had one season where he rushed for over 1700 yards, three other seasons where he rushed for over 1,500 yards, and one more where he rushed for over 1200 yards. The two seasons he failed to get over 1200 yard, he missed ten games one season and 2 games the other. Addai has never rushed for more than 1,100 yards. He rushed for over 1,000 twice and the last time was 2007. I hate Edgerrin James, but I am insulted for him that you would compare Addai to him. Addai couldn't hold James' jock.

The Colts think Addai was so good that they drafted Donald Brown in the first round three years ago. Why would you draft another RB in the first round if you think your first round RB is any good. It has been nearly four seasons since Addai has rushed for a 1,000 yards. The Colts' o-line hasn't been that bad for nearly 4 years.

Addai is a third down back. Plain and simple. The guy lost his nerve or burst in his second season and never regained it. He is now a far better receiver than RB. He is not as good as BJGE as a lead back plain and simple.

Brown is a bust. You can make up whatever theories you want to explain why he is a bust, but until this year he never rushed for more than 4.0 YPC. So even when he was on the field, he didn't make the most of his opportunities. He sucks and a wasted draft pick. Brown has 4.7 YPC because he has only rushed 76 times and got huge YPCs in garbage time in blowouts against Bengals, Saints, and Panthers. Look at the Saints' game, he rushed for 7.0 YPC for 47 yards, 24 of those yards came on one carry in the final minute of the game with the Colts down by 55 points. Pure garbage time stat padding. The only competitive game where he had a good YPC was against the Chiefs.

I already said the Colts' WRs are better than the Pats. Again, that is the only group that the Colts have the edge.

You claim I don't watch the Colts yet, you are just looking at the stat sheet and drawing conclusions without any context. Donald Brown sucks and garbage time yards doesn't change that.

 

[BradyFTW!]

Let me fix it for you.

Wayne- ELITE
Garcon- Drops passes but one of the most elusive wr's in the game
Collie- One of the best slot recievers in the league....sucks this year because horrible qb's cant use slot recievers.. Collie is better than Garcon with a solid QB
Blair White- good enough to be playin but nothing above good
Jeff Saturday- Old but still one the best C's
Dallas Clark- Elite pass catching tight end that is getting older
Tamme- great pass catching TE
Joseph Addai- Top 20 RB in the league....he'd be an amazing 3rd down back but is an ABV AVG STARTING RB
Brown- maybe the best RB on the team!!!! He hasn't gotten oppurtunities but when he has he has shown he has the skills to be a starting rb.
Delone Carter- looking solid for a rookie
Everyone says their o-line worst in the league every year...it is one of the worst but nowhere close to the worst

Freeney- ELITE HOF
Mathis- HOF underrated because everyone thinks Freeney makes him.
Angerer- extremely solid LB but yes stats are padded
Brackett- Colt's Bruschi
Bethea- One of the best safeties in the game
Powers- Underrated future probowler
Nevis- Solid rookie

With an OK QB this team is .500 or atleast 5-6 easily

I think you're considerably overrating Collie, White, Tamme, Thomas, Addai, Brown, Mathis, Brackett, and Powers almost as badly as Rob was underrating them. Regardless, though, you're right that, on this Colts team, it doesn't really matter how good or bad they are. The Colts' QB situation is just terrible, and it's compounded by the fact that the entire team is built to be the Peyton Manning Roadshow.

 

[condon84]

More to the point, with Brian Hoyer at QB this team is a 5-6 type team. Curtis Painter is a stiff.

Yup. On top of that, coaching staff is even worse.

 

[Lansdowne]

Donald Brown is actually playing better of late, getting the attention of his coach and teammates, and is the Colts offensive player I would fear most heading into this game.

NFL Videos: RB Brown, 36-yd, run

Brown was scrutinized for his lack of blitz pickup, highlighted by this gem, while protecting Manning was a strength of Addai's, and why they keep bringing him back despite his mediocre play as a rusher. But Brown has improved in that regard and is light years ahead of how he looked even this preseason. As long as the Pats contain him they're solid.

As for Wayne, I'd still call him a great WR but not elite. He's already the same age as Ochocinco, and while he hasn't fallen off the map all things considered, he's looking like he's on the downside of his career. Getting awful close to the point where his former teammate Marvin Harrison fell off. A guy like Larry Fitzgerald is elite, he put up numbers despite taking passes from awful QB's of his own the past couple of years. Fitz is in the elite tier of NFL receivers, but Wayne isn't far behind. He's still great.

 

[Patsfan1102]

Edgerrin James played for the Colts for seven seasons he had one season where he rushed for over 1700 yards, three other seasons where he rushed for over 1,500 yards, and one more where he rushed for over 1200 yards. The two seasons he failed to get over 1200 yard, he missed ten games one season and 2 games the other. Addai has never rushed for more than 1,100 yards. He rushed for over 1,000 twice and the last time was 2007. I hate Edgerrin James, but I am insulted for him that you would compare Addai to him. Addai couldn't hold James' jock.

The Colts think Addai was so good that they drafted Donald Brown in the first round three years ago. Why would you draft another RB in the first round if you think your first round RB is any good. It has been nearly four seasons since Addai has rushed for a 1,000 yards. The Colts' o-line hasn't been that bad for nearly 4 years.

Addai is a third down back. Plain and simple. The guy lost his nerve or burst in his second season and never regained it. He is now a far better receiver than RB. He is not as good as BJGE as a lead back plain and simple.

Brown is a bust. You can make up whatever theories you want to explain why he is a bust, but until this year he never rushed for more than 4.0 YPC. So even when he was on the field, he didn't make the most of his opportunities. He sucks and a wasted draft pick. Brown has 4.7 YPC because he has only rushed 76 times and got huge YPCs in garbage time in blowouts against Bengals, Saints, and Panthers. Look at the Saints' game, he rushed for 7.0 YPC for 47 yards, 24 of those yards came on one carry in the final minute of the game with the Colts down by 55 points. Pure garbage time stat padding. The only competitive game where he had a good YPC was against the Chiefs.

I already said the Colts' WRs are better than the Pats. Again, that is the only group that the Colts have the edge.

You claim I don't watch the Colts yet, you are just looking at the stat sheet and drawing conclusions without any context. Donald Brown sucks and garbage time yards doesn't change that.

Edgerrins James got more touches...its that simple look at his YPC...heck his CAREER YPC was 4.0....ELITE player averaging 4.0 ypc. On any other team I think we both agree he would've had a much better YPC statistic.

Why would they draft another RB in the 1st round? because its the Colts...you have Reggie Wayne, Dallas Clark and an old Marvin Harrison. You also have Peyton Manning is a 1st round wr necessary? No but they took Anthony Gonzalez. You have Mathis and Freeney do you need a 1st round DE? okay yes give him time to learn under them but is 1st round necessary? NO BUT ITS THS COLTS. Brown avg'd 3.6 yards his rookie year? OMG BUST...no. next year 3.9...omg bust....no. How many times did ELITE EDGE average under 4 ypc on the SAME OFFENSE? BJGE never comes close to touching 4 ypc on the colts cuz he can't make his own holes, he needs one made for him. Every RB on the pats gets worse if they played for the colts and every RB on the colts gets better if they played on the Pats. Addai is a probowler on the patriots....OH WAIT ADDAI WAS EVEN A PROBOWLER ON THE COLTS!!!! He has a better YPC the ELITE EDGE...playing on the same cant run horrible run blocking not built to run the ball offense.

Brown is avg 4.7 YPC behind a horrible run blocking o-line and with a offense with NO QB threat....that is impressive if you ask me especially for a "bust".

Don't forget Addai is one of the best pass blocking RB's in the league. I agreed he'd be better suited as a 3rd down back that will bring out his best skills but as a #1 back he is still a good bit above average better then anyone the Pats have. Also Don't forget these guys DO NOT fumble combined they have 7 career fumbles.


You said Im just using stats.....uhhhhh because I can't say I pay more attention to the Colts then you because my bestfriend is a die-hard Colts fan and all we do is talk football and compare teams. What do you want me to say I am smarter then you and watch the games so I am right? Would that be an answer you'd accept? No so you have to use stats and LOGICAL thinking. If anything I am saying stats are misleading because of the style the Colt's play...Yet there stats STILL aren't bad. ALso saying the Colt's run blocking hasn't been that bad for 4 years may be the idiotic thing ive heard in a long time...Their run blocking is 2nd to none when it comes to being the worst.

 

[Patsfan1102]

Your analysis of how amazing Addai is is quite impressive. I am now a Colts fan because of this. Thank you!

I am just as much of a Colt hater as everyone here...trust me. But I can give credit were credit is due. If a player is good they're good no matter what team.

 

[strngplyr]

I am just as much of a Colt hater as everyone here...trust me. But I can give credit were credit is due. If a player is good they're good no matter what team.

Chad Ochocinco. Theory destroyed.

 

[Patsfan1102]

Chad Ochocinco. Theory destroyed.

Hmmm except by "If a player is good they're good no matter what team" was meant more like....I'm a Pats fan but if a Colts player is good im not going to instantly think he isn't good out of hate...smartazz