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If Brady expects to be "considered" the best.....

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by Kid~Brady, Dec 28, 2012.

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  1. Kid~Brady

    Kid~Brady Rookie

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    #12 Jersey

    Does he have to get that 4th superbowl?

    Joe Montana 4
    Terry Bradshaw 4
    Troy Aikmen 3
    Tom Brady 3

    These are the other guys with multiple superbowls (3 or more). I honestly don't think Bradshaw is in the deabte based on true skill and talent but Montana and Aikmen were pretty darn good. Right now, should Joe Montana be considered the best? He's never lost a superbowl nor has he thrown an interception in a superbowl. Brady will no doubt be a 1st ballot HOF but knowing Brady, he wants this last ring to solidify the position as "the best".

    Brady has been so close the last 2 trips and I know it pains us all that he could have 5 and would easily be considered the best with 5 rings. Does he need that 4th ring to be considered the best, or in his role model's class, Joe Montana? We all understand that his window is closing and I give him 3 years max.

    Thoughts?
  2. F0nSY

    F0nSY Rookie

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    #22 Jersey

    If Brady wins this one he knows that he'll be inmortal for ever..
  3. BritPat

    BritPat Rookie

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    I think he needs 5 to pass Joe Cool.

    Montana is the GOAT simply because he was at his best when the game was on the line, especially in the Playoffs.

    We've not seen that from Tommy recently, bar the Cowboys game last year, and maybe the Ravens game the year before.
  4. MoLewisrocks

    MoLewisrocks PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Please not this again and again and again...:bricks:

    And who says what his expectations are. Certainly not a message board poster who thinks he has three years left max. We do know because he has told us so that he anticipates playing for at least 5 more seasons if not longer. And he has shown no signs of his personal window closing...any more than his team has. He's been in the hunt for league MVP for the last 3 seasons...
  5. KontradictioN

    KontradictioN Do you even lift? PatsFans.com Supporter

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    No Jersey Selected

    I already think he's the GOAT, but if he wants universal approval from the mass media and generations of football fans after he retires, the 4th Lombardi is a necessity.
  6. mayoclinic

    mayoclinic PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    If he wins the next 10 it won't be an issue.

    But then, it shouldn't be one now.
  7. MoLewisrocks

    MoLewisrocks PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    People act as if Montana never lost a playoff game. He was 16-7 in his career including 2-2 after leaving SF. Brady is 16-6 here. Montana also played in a different era, prior to the salary cap and FA so his teams were able to maintain talent consistently. Brady is the last man standing from his first Superbowl victory. And the only ring bearer on his offense these days is a 3rd string WR who was unavailable to him in most of his prime.

    Brady somehow managed to bring his team back in each of the last two Superbowls with less than a couple of minutes to spare only to see his defense cough up a furball...and leave him no time to do anything about it.
  8. aluminum seats

    aluminum seats Rookie

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    Far and away the most frustrating thing about the losses...would love to hit rewind on those games with Brady having a minute or so left in each as opposed to seconds.
  9. patsfan13

    patsfan13 Hall of Fame Poster PatsFans.com Supporter

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    There is already a strong case to be made for Brady as the GOAT.

    Better playoff record than Montana overall, 1 less SB but 1 more Conf Championship + Brady's winning % as a QB is far higher (.776 vs .713). Of the top 50 QB's of all time only 3 have >/700 winning % (Staubach is the other .746, but far fewer starts than Brady & Montana).

    If Brady wins a 4th SB objectively he is a mortal lock as the GOAT, especially given the salary cap era restrictions that Staubach, Starr, Montana didn't have to deal with.

    If we were to assume Brady had 4 more 'average' years in terms of wins, we might be looking at 25 Playoff wins 50% more than Montana, and perhaps catching Farve for overall wins in the reg season (with Brady having a far higher winning % and more playoiff wins by far).
  10. MassPats38

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    I expect Brady may need two more wins. The statement I hear mentioned in programs now is that Montana never lost a title game. If Brady ties Montana's win total but has 2 more losses, I expect that will be a more familiar refrain when going with Montana. For those who don't like Brady and the Pats, there will always be some reason to go in a different direction (e.g., Brady is a "system" QB).

    Brady has a combination of stats and titles, and has been a star for years in a game without personnel stability. He already is the greatest, but I don't consdier myself objective as to that question.
  11. Sivy

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    and the last two superbowls. (Brady dont play D)
    And the SF game (Brady dont play D, or special Teams)
    and this years Ravens Game (Brady aint a replacement ref)
  12. BigTea

    BigTea Rookie

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    Not to take anything away from Montana, but the easiest way to ensure that you don't lose the superbowl is by failing to get there. What's better, a 4/7 or a 5/6 conference championship record? For "playing the best when it matters most", people have such a skewed vision. How would we react if Brady had three straight one and done seasons? Most seem to forget Montana did that one.

    And the killer is that Bradys legacy won't be determined entirely by his play. In 2007 he takes the lead with a couple minutes left in the game. Turn back time, have him replay every down exactly the same, but if we get the int or the helmet isn't sticky, this isn't even a question. And Brady would have literally done nothing differently.
  13. TommyBrady12

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    #12 Jersey

    Montana was great in super bowls, but this guy lost 2 NFC championship games. If brady wns 2 more, it would be 5 out of 7....5 super bowls > 4
  14. everlong

    everlong Rookie

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    #12 Jersey

    Montana was my favorite player growing up because he beat the Cowboys in the catch game and my step brother was a huge Cowboys fan. It's a bit of revisionist history that Montana was always clutch. He went one and done three straight years and sucked in every one of those games.

    Brady was clutch enough vs the Giants in both games considering he was playing on a bum foot in one game and the line blew. The second game he was lights out until Tuck planted him and then his accuracy was off. Even then he drove them for the go ahead score and if not for everybody dropping balls he might have led them back again. Even then it took one epically lucky catch in one game to beat him and one superb throw in another to do so.

    If he wins another he moves ahead of Montana with 4 wins and 6 appearances. There's this stupid notion out there that SB losses count against QBs. So by that logic Warren Moon always losing before the SB had better post season credentials than Jim Kelly who got there 4 times but simply ran into far superior teams? No.
  15. MassPats38

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    #87 Jersey

    You're preaching to the choir.

    Looking past pure numbers, if the Pats could hold on to every good player by not having to deal with salary cap issues, how many titles might they have now?
  16. Ivan

    Ivan On the Roster

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    This is how i see it.
  17. New England Seahawks

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    The last two superbowls, the games ended with Brady and the offense on the field with a chance to tie or win the game.

    In the SF game, Brady had a chance down 38-31 and about 2 min left to drive his team for the tie score. He didn't get past their own 12 yd line.

    In the Ravens game, Brady and the offense had the ball around mid field and 2 min left to put the game away, and didn't.
    Last edited: Dec 28, 2012
  18. RIPATS

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    Lots of great points here. I had forgotten just how "human" Montana was. I am surprised no one is mentioning Goober on this thread. You know if he beats us in the playoffs and wins the Super Bowl (God forbid) the Manning lappers will be at it again. Thankfully the stats/facts don't hold up for Manning as we all know. But that has not stopped them.
  19. TommyBrady12

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    #12 Jersey

    He didn't have much time left on the clock in the last 2 super bowls, a game the seahawks would know nothing about. 3-5 on the road this year...let's see how good you are away from seattle.
  20. SoCal Pmen

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    #54 Jersey

    When Brady wins his 4th SB and suppose he takes MVP in the process he will cement himself as GOAT. That would be a total of 4-2 in SB's. Montana wasn't able to get his team to that many SBs which would make Brady's feat (and Belichick's for that matter), special.
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