Idle thoughts - The Yawn from TB

[DaBruinz]

If I'm thinking of the right play, it was a miscommunication between Solder and Thomas. Don't know who screwed up but I'm thinking it was Solder. He slid outside to pick up a blitzing DB expecting Thomas to pick up the blitzing LB. I'll have to look again to see if Thomas was on a double-team (his bad) or if he was singled on a DT (Solder needed to block inside-out).

If you are referring to the 11 yard sack by Hayward on Brady, then you are incorrect. Solder didn't move out to take a DB. He moved to take a downlineman. Hayward, who WAS lined up outside of the downlineman, stunted inside through the open hole left by Thomas who blocked to his right because Wendell also blocked to HIS right. The problem was then compounded by the RB (Ridley?) also going right to help block.. I would have to say that it was a blown call by the line protection, which is usually the Center's call.

 

[DaBruinz]

And my assessment, that you disputed, that Moore would be demoted after his awful performance against the Eagles was validated when Cole and not Moore was the #4 corner.

No, your opinion wasn't validated, actually. In fact, quite the opposite could be taken. That because Cole had been doing so horrible up to that point, the Pats felt the need evaluate him more fully based on a full game.

You seem to forget that, with 3 games in 10 days, the Pats rested quite a few people in this game.

 

[DaBruinz]

That's because Sterling Moore, who I called out here for his awful play against the Eagles, was demoted.

Yes. He gave up 3 passes in total against the Eagles, one of which was to one of the best deep route WRs in the league and he was demoted because of it..

 

[QB12]

No, your opinion wasn't validated, actually. In fact, quite the opposite could be taken. That because Cole had been doing so horrible up to that point, the Pats felt the need evaluate him more fully based on a full game.

You seem to forget that, with 3 games in 10 days, the Pats rested quite a few people in this game.

Nice try at spinning the truth.

 

[QB12]

Yes. He gave up 3 passes in total against the Eagles, one of which was to one of the best deep route WRs in the league and he was demoted because of it..

Another nice try at spinning the truth.

 

[supafly]

I don't honestly know how much we can take away from the lack of Moore's playing time, QB12.

McCourty and Arrington didn't play vs PHI, so there could be a point made that the thinking was to get them more time and the majority of the reps. DaBruinz certainly has a point in wanting to evaluate M.Cole too, as he is certainly on the bubble.

I don't even know how much it really matters even IF Moore were 'demoted' as you say, due to the fact that he will almost surely make the team, and won't contribute too much unless of injury besides some subpackages etc.

I think solid points could be made for both sides, we'll have to wait and see.

 

[DaBruinz]

Nice try at spinning the truth.

How am I "spinning the truth"? You are the one making a SWAG as to why Cole played more than Moore did..

 

[DaBruinz]

Another nice try at spinning the truth.

There is no spin here. That is the total number of pass completions that Moore allowed against Philly. Cole, on the other hand, was abused all day long by Philly.

I suggest you go back and watch it because you clearly can't tell the difference between a 29 Jersey and a 23 Jersey.

 

[NinjaZX6R]

Still think Connelly fits better at Center than Guard but since Brian Waters is MIA, it will have to do. His game vs the Bucs reminded me of the Jets playoff loss performance by him.

 

[QB12]

Neither Cole nor Moore would ever be mistaken for Revis. But Cole has special team value that Moore doesn't. After an incredible postseason run, Moore has played himself onto the bubble ths summer, like it or not. And BTW, the rookie QB was targeting Moore. And was 3/3 against him. Put that in your pipe and smoke it big fella'.

 

[supafly]

Neither Cole nor Moore would ever be mistaken for Revis. But Cole has special team value that Moore doesn't. After an incredible postseason run, Moore has played himself onto the bubble ths summer, like it or not. And BTW, the rookie QB was targeting Moore. And was 3/3 against him. Put that in your pipe and smoke it big fella'.

I know your comments are pointed towards DaBruinz, but I was under the impression that Moore allowed 1/3 last week, which no one disputed at the time when we were talking.

If Moore allowed a 3/3 night to Foles last week, then that certainly makes a ton more sense as to why you saw him as having such a down night, and if that is true--then I certainly apologize for being incorrect. From what I understood, he allowed the one long 40 yd completion to Jackson, and that is why I was defending him. I just wasn't sure why a 1/3 night would cause so much controversy from you.

Either way, I definitely agree that he didn't have the best of nights vs PHI, and we didn't get to see him too much last night for whatever speculative reason one may choose to go with. It could be due to his demotion, as you say, or it could be due to McCourty and Arrington not playing vs PHI and Belichick wanting to see more of Cole.

I still personally think he makes it, but I can see now (if true) why you wouldn't think so. I tried to find something on it, but couldn't. If you get a chance or are able, let me know if it was 1/3 or worse...as it makes a big difference.

If he doesn't make it, I'll still have to leave my 'prediction' sig up out of respect since it'd be the right thing to do

 

[ATippett56]

I can foresee the New England Patriots play four cornerbacks against the NY Giants Wednesday night:

Will Allen
Marquice Cole
Alfonzo Dennard
Sterling Moore

Four cornerbacks competing for two roster spots.

In the meantime, Josh Barrett and James Ihedigbo will be thrown into a steel cage to determine a potential fifth safety spot.

 

[supafly]

I can foresee the New England Patriots play four cornerbacks against the NY Giants Wednesday night:

Will Allen
Marquice Cole
Alfonzo Dennard
Sterling Moore

Four cornerbacks competing for two roster spots.

In the meantime, Josh Barrett and James Ihedigbo will be thrown into a steel cage to determine a potential fifth safety spot.

One would have to think that a rookie 7th rd pick who has legal trouble and has been in the tub for the entire training camp would have to be significantly further behind the rest, and a potential practice squad candidate.

Then again, if he makes it--they must really like his potential here, because that would never normally fly with a Bill Belichick coached team.

I didn't see anything at all from Will Allen but camp fodder since the day he was brought here, but there were a few who did like him, so I started putting him on a few of my pre-TC projections. I don't think he makes it at all personally.

If anything, I think that one of those players is likely already not on the 53 man, if not two. It may however, come down to 2 of 3 making it.

 

[supafly]

In the meantime, Josh Barrett and James Ihedigbo will be thrown into a steel cage to determine a potential fifth safety spot.

Has Barrett even played significantly at all in the preseason games?

The only one I was able to see was the PHI game. I tried messing with one of those lousy feeds last night, but it wasn't worth the delay and the buffering.

 

[ATippett56]

The only one I was able to see was the PHI game. I tried messing with one of those lousy feeds last night, but it wasn't worth the delay and the buffering.

NFL Network has a replay of the Pats/Bucs Preseason Game at 1:00 PM Eastern Sunday afternoon.

 

[ATippett56]

Has Barrett even played significantly at all in the preseason games?

Another consideration is the New England Patriots keep six cornerbacks and four safeties on the roster, that is if you label Will Allen strictly a cornerback.

 

[supafly]

Another consideration is the New England Patriots keep six cornerbacks and four safeties on the roster, that is if you label Will Allen strictly a cornerback.

I think this could be a possibility, although it would also depend on how good/bad they see the injuries to Chung and Gregory. From what I understand at the moment, they don't fear bad injuries or much time lost for either, although there is certainly limited information.

6 CB's could be: DMcC, Arrington, Dowling, and any combination of 3 of 4 choices from Moore/Cole/Dennard/Allen.

I think a lot will depend on where the team sees Dennard as a fit. I agree with your thoughts in another thread re: departure of Arrington next yr due to FA, and the need for a more developmental CB in the making. I think the big question is if the team thinks they can move Dennard to the practice squad or not, as that will dictate a lot.

Another potential decision could be the fact that Moore can play both safety and cornerback, although Allen can too. By keeping 6 CB's, they could potentially keep ALL of Moore, Allen, Cole and Dennard (practice squad), with Moore and Allen also contributing at the position of safety if/when needed.

 

[patsfaninpittsburgh]

I didn't see much on Friday that either got me excited or sent me in fear from the room. But this has become a habit. I hope it isn't too bad.

Disclaimer - I have to admit I only watched the first 2 quarters and a half closely. After that circumstances forced me to be an occasional watcher for the last quarter and a half where I just got to watch a few plays now and again. So nothing real special about these observations tonight. More like gut feelings than astute observations

THE OFFENSE

1. Still very sloppy ,disjointed and otherwise uncoordinated. You can see the potential, but its like a jig saw puzzle without quite all the pieces put together.

2. RB's Ridely is going to give us a very solid running game. This is a 2nd game out of 3 where he averaged over 5 ypc. The 2nd game out of 3 where he broke off at least 20+ yd run

We know what we will get from Woodhead. Its a shame that Vareen got hurt again. I hope its not long term. And while I would caution against any overdue excitement about Demps vs the TB scrubs. its hard not to get a jolt watching him run, and will look forward to seeing him take some kickoffs in a few days

3. WR's - 3 exhibition games and still waiting for a serious WR sighting. Still I want them to keep working on that back shoulder throw to Lloyd and I don't care if they never complete it now...or in September. I want them to keep working on it until they get it down. THIS is the kind of pass wins games in the playoffs. Its the kind of pass that simply has no defense other than a straight visible front and back double team. It might take a while to get down, but in the end (the playoffs) it will be worth the wait.

So thus far we have a little from Branch, a little lessl from Lloyd and Edleman, and nothing from Gaffney, Welker, and Stallowrth. Lots of good reasons why. Nothing to get worried about. BUT......I didn't want to have to wait until the first game before I saw a concerted and consistent passing offense offense. Too bad for me.

I case you didn't notice - No "no huddle" No real direction or meaning in the play calling. They weren't game planing the Tampa D, or calling plays in a progression. It looked to me that they were calling the game with other purposes beyond moving the ball. ie. how a play looks. How different players look running a play. They might run a play in a certain situation they might ordinarily pass, etc

I've said in previous posts that losing about 40% of their practices so far has put our offense behind. Its a high precision offense with a lot of small pieces and delicate parts. In other words, "it ain't the ground and pound", so it WILL take time to see the kind of offense we have been used to seeing the past several years. It will get there.

4 TE's They're back and bad.. with even a Daniel Fells sighting.

Don't you ever get the feeling that if they wanted to, the Pats could pass to Gronk or Hernandez EVERY play. They don't just because it isn't fair to the other kids and want to share the ball.;'

What I DON'T want to see is that 3rd hand 6 where we throw a 3 yd pass to someone who's totally covered. Or watch a receiver with his back to the endzone catch a ball short of the yard markers. Receivers have to make sure they have a first down, and QB's have to make sure that when they throw to a guy short of a first down, he has at least a fighting chance to make on YAC. Brady is usually very good at this....just not tonight.

5. The OL - Not good enough, but a lot than last week. I saw a lot of improvement from Solder who was left out on a island a lot. I saw less from Cannon but some.....I guess The point is that they built on the previous week and are on an upswing. After tonight I'm not worried too much about Solder, but I would like to see Volmer get a bunch of reps against the Giants.

Good to see Connolly back at C quite frankly. I'll be interested in seeing how BB uses the other OLman in the Giants game. IIRC he kept Solder and Cannon out there the entire game. REPS REPS REPS.

On the 2 sacks - the first one was partially on Brady. He held the ball a bit too long. imo but it still wasn't good enough by Cannon. He was beaten wide and deep, but normally it wouldn't have mattered...but this time it did.. BTW- on a second notice from the NFL.com feed, Spencer Larsen also didn't cover himself with glory that play

The other sack was well designed blitz or a blown assignment that wasn't picked up. It happens. Better now than then. It only goes to prove that when a D lineman is unblocked....he's a hell of a pass rusher.

The run blocking seemed to pick up again a bit. Several creases that the running backs turned into bigger gains. Something to build on.

DEFENSE -

Very strong and consistent run defense (at least from what I watched) Good tackling. Good edge setting. Strong in the Middle. Another good game from Ron Brace. I didn't watch him every play, but those that I did I found myself noticing that he was usually the first guy off the ball and into the OL showing a quickness I hadn't noticed since his first TC.

Aside from the first drive (only 51 yds) and into a soft zone, I thought the 2ndary continued to play well. Most of the completed passes were highly contested, and Safety help was again conspicuous.

Marquise Cole for some reason stood out to me in the 2nd half. He made a case for himself to be more than just a special teamer. Anyone else see this too?

I thought I saw Stevenr Gregory on the ground in the 2nd half in a cutaway I saw. Please tell me it was someone else....and NOT a safety.....again.

If I was disappointed in anything by the defense it was an absence of a good 4 man rush. Even Jones didn't make much of a headway until he got his sack on a great rip move. Personally I thought he was playing it very carefully in controlling his rush, respecting Freeman's scrambling capabilities. In fact I thought the entire defense did that too much.

Also it was clear that blitzing (unlike TB) wasn't something that was in the Pats "game plan" for this scrimmage. I'm sure Locker will see more, though he too is a excellent athlete/runner

Special teams coverage was once again excellent. KO return blocking....not so much. For example on that first TB KO, there was a clear gap that had been blocked out by the TB KO blocking team. All the TB runner did was run up that crease until it disappeared. I'm not seeing any "creases" like that from the Pats. I know its real hard to practices, since the only time you see it live in in a game, but (I hate to say it) the Jets do it as well as anyone. I'd like to see us do it more....especially since we have someone who can take REAL advantage of that crease....should he get one.

OK guys - I can't wait to get up and see which of our guys you have elevated to Gods, and which have be cast down. In the meantime I'm calling it a night, and hope sometime soon we can get at least an afternoon game so I can write one of these without being sleep deprived.

BTW- is there a way you can email or send a DVR recording to someone. I would think that kind of technology is around, or at least something like it. I don't have access to game replays and I'd love to be able to get games from those who do. Just a thought....if possible.....maybe.....

Good job, ken

Having attended the game on Friday and the 3rd preason in Detroit in 2011, it's true last year was the bigger debacle. The Lions sold the game out and used it a measurement. Ditto Tampa.

Spikes is a beast. Spikes tackles and they stay tackled.

Absolute zero game planning. Was kinda expecting SOMETHING.

The offense.....If this is suppose to be post Welker football.....sign the beast!!!!

I hope this means "hurry up" isn't dead. Never, ever seen things so,so slow.

 

[The Gr8est]

I can foresee the New England Patriots play four cornerbacks against the NY Giants Wednesday night:

Will Allen
Marquice Cole
Alfonzo Dennard
Sterling Moore

Four cornerbacks competing for two roster spots.

In the meantime, Josh Barrett and James Ihedigbo will be thrown into a steel cage to determine a potential fifth safety spot.

Well since McCourty CAN play FS, I would like to keep an extra, more athletic CB, over a lesser S.

In other words, I'd prefer not to lose a CB with gr8 potential like Dennard, who I doubt will make it to the PS, over JAGs like Barrett or Ihedigbo.


Other teams scrutinize Pats' cuts closely, and last year the plan to put Lee Smith and Will Yeatman on the PS didn't go as planned.

I would expect a team as bad as the Rats, who are likely to have NO cut players claimed, to claim Dennard; he is a "name" and shiny in a way that a true Rat cannot resist dragging back to their nest.

 

[patfanken]

There's no chance for Dennard being cut....at least in this round. Given his lack of playing time and the fact that Coles has looked better than expected, I'd like to find a way to get him to the practices squad. Its not like he's been the most enticing prospect to begin with, with the off field stuff and his inability to get on the field. That helps.

Also I wonder if there are some finagles they can run. Here's one. On the cut down day, the release Will Allen, with the understanding (wink wink) that they will re-sign him after the first week. They keep Dennard on the roster for that first week when most teams are getting the bottom of the roster together.

Then after the first week they release Dennard and re-sign Allen. Though I don't think its real likely that the Pats would lose him in the first place, this way would make it even less likely. This way the Pats get a solid veteran depth at BOTH S and CB, plus the kid stays with the team and gets a red shirt year on the PS at full rookie pay. Because Allen plays both S and CB the Pats can keep only 9 DB's opening up a roster spot elsewhere Its a win both ways.

BTW- That position versatility plus his experience in an otherwise very young secondary ,is one of the reason's Will Allen is going to be one of the more surprising guys to make this team