Idle thoughts - The Houston Match up. (Texan fans welcome)

[supafly]

Arian Foster ran the ball 32 times against the Bengals tonight. I doubt they'll be able to pound the rock against the Pats' front seven, definitely not if they're playing from behind. Foster also caught 8 passes. He has to be beat up after 40 touches.

Strangely enough, Foster isn't the type of RB that seems to get all that worn down, so although I hope you're right, I don't know if those 32 carries are going to keep him tired come next Sunday.

As far as Dalton, I think he's so insanely overrated to be honest. AJ Green makes him look good at times, and he does throw a nice deep ball on occasion, but I just don't think that Dalton belongs in some of the conversations that he ends up in. Just my opinion.

Going into the game, I thought today's matchup had an easy double digit Texans win written all over it, yet somehow it appeared to be a lot closer than it needed to be.

CIN played tough defense down the stretch, and they should be lauded, but they also did it against lousy competition in the likes of the Eagles, Raiders, Chargers, Chiefs, etc. Their biggest win was vs a beat up Roethlisberger who handed them the game on a silver platter with less than a minute to go at midfield, where they needed a FG to win it. The Ravens game the next week saw the Ravens backup QB T.Taylor doing his best Terelle Pryor impression, so I don't think that was too impressive either.

I'm hoping that the fact that Cincy somehow hung around yesterday bodes well for us next week vs Houston, because I don't think that the Bengals are that tough at all. On top of that, their gameplan yesterday was a downright laughable joke. They failed to convert even ONE 3rd down attempt, and their entire offensive output consisted of 2 FG's. Had it not been for a poorly thrown Schaub pass they would've been blown out by 13-17 pts.

 

[supafly]

Ken, you seem to be suggesting that BB will assign two different Pats to be the personal watchdogs for two different opposing players. Really? When has he done that before in the history of ever?

Great call on your part if he actually does it.

Fencer, are you able (or anyone else for that matter) to elaborate at all on the specifics of what Cincy was doing yesterday in terms of playing zone pass defense?

They seemed to do it very effectively for the most part, and it greatly limited Johnson.

I assume the thought was simply to make Schaub the one to beat them, in a more of a BBDB kind of way? Is that also why they weren't getting as much pressure on Schaub as most expected them to?

I could be wrong, but I was under the impression that we used more of a man to man scheme in the first meeting, although admittedly I only saw the one go around on television and haven't revisited it since.

Are you expecting much of the same as to what's been working in the past month or so (assuming that it's been a lot of man-to-man, which I am), or do you think that Belichick may see the effectiveness of what Cincy was doing yesterday and try more of that?

Basically my question is "why" Cincy seemed to be much more effective in a zone coverage scheme than we ever seem to be? Or was this thought totally wrong due to the fact that their scheme allowed too many TE passes and they didn't shut down the running game and RB passes effectively?

Thanks in advance.

 

[Warren1985]

Houston up front with Watt is where their strength lies on D but with our O-line being so good it counters that, so then Brady exposes their backfield and also we have Gronk back this time to help with blocking and also for the red zone etc.

It will be interesting but Patriots should be on the look out for new things on that Texans D, more blitzing!

 

[ausbacker]

Houston up front with Watt is where their strength lies on D but with our O-line being so good it counters that, so then Brady exposes their backfield and also we have Gronk back this time to help with blocking and also for the red zone etc.

It will be interesting but Patriots should be on the look out for new things on that Texans D, more blitzing!

I was surprised with the ease that Cinci moved the ball on the Texans when Marvin took his foot out of his mouth and called run plays for Green-Ellis. Even more surprising was Brooks Reed was back in the line up.

I keep looking at the match ups and keep trying to talk myself into this game being closer than what I see it being.

 

[TheBostonStraggler]

Houston is an inflexible team IMO.

They will play the same, but merely execute better. That's enough to worry us - they didn't execute against the Patriots.

The Texans have won 14 games this year with their "inflexible" style. When you win that many games, where is the imperative to significantly change what you do? I just don't see what some other posters do regarding a change to their gameplan. To me, as you said, this is about execution. If the Texans come in and don't turn the ball over, score TDs not FGs on their red zone opportunities and don't give the Patriots any easy scores? Their team has demonstrated the kind of potency that says they can win under those circumstances....whether in New England or Denver. And those circumstances speak to execution as much as anything.

I don't know if the Texans win that Monday night game if they executed better but it would have been competitive if they had.

 

[Fencer]

Sorry, Supafly. I didn't even watch the Houston/Cincy game.

 

[mayoclinic]

I was surprised with the ease that Cinci moved the ball on the Texans when Marvin took his foot out of his mouth and called run plays for Green-Ellis. Even more surprising was Brooks Reed was back in the line up.

I think of the 169 yards rushing (or something like that) against the Dolphins with a one-armed Gronk back and the full RBBC. I hope that the Pats use a very healthy dose of the running game, based on Cincy's limited success, to wear down the Texas D. Get ahead and then keep them off the field.

Also, remember the 49ers game? I don't want the Pats exhausting all their energy against the Texans. I'll be happy with a nice, sloppy win followed by an annihilation of the Broncos (or whoeever) the following week. :singing:

 

[nukin]

Texan fans "Welcome" - we don't want them to feel disrespected or anything negative :deadhorse:

 

[Rob0729]

I think people forget in the december game that after the intial 21 pts , we went 3 and out or had very short drives for long a time. They really started getting hits on brady and forced brady to throw deep which kept trying until he hit stallworth. Gronk can make a diff but they also didnt have reed .Plus our oline has shown tendencies to crap the bed at times namely vs 49ers and jax. If brady is forced to throw quick and isnt give much time, this could be trouble for the pats and the texans are certainly capable of that. Somehow iam not so buoyant as some here proclaiming the texans cant stop us. This is how everyone used to think about the colts in the playoffs .A good defense like the texans can certainly stop us especially since they played us once and have some knowledge of our tendencies.

And you forget that the Pats scored at least 7 points in every quarter (14 points in each of the first and fourth quarters although one TD in the fourth quarter was a garbage time TD with the back ups in) and won the game 42-14 with the Texans' points coming in garbage time. The Texans never stopped the Pats' offense completely and it is human nature to take your foot off the gas.

You seem to desperately want to rewrite history on this one. The Pats blew the Texans out of the water and beat them in every phase of the game. Besides,I am not concerned about a handful of three and outs when the offense scores 42 points with 419 yards with a 50% third down conversion rate (the Pats were 6 of 12) and only one sack.

 

[shmessy]

fans that actually come in with good conversation? wow a first here at pats fans becasue it sure as hell doesn't come from bronco or jets fans..

Not a first.

They were first class in December also.

 

[Rob0729]

The Texans are an easy team to beat if you can do several things:

• Slow down Foster. You don't even need to stop him. You just need him to not to dominate.
• Not bite on the play-action. That is why the Bengals lost yesterday. They are a dumb undisciplined team and on virtually every play-action pass you saw Cincy defenders bite on the play-action either giving Schaub plenty of time to throw or leaving receivers uncovered. The Pats showed in the first game that they are disciplined enough not to bite. Their ability to defense the run well in sub packages also helps that.
• Get a lead early. Not as important if you can do my first two points, but absolutely necessary if you can't. If you can force Schaub to throw as a normal QB without relying heavily on the play-action because you have a several TD lead, he becomes ordinary. The Texans are not built to play from behind.

Obviously not every thing can do this (see the Bengals yesterday), but a disciplined team with a good run defense can do it. Like the Patriots.

 

[shmessy]

I don't know if the Texans win that Monday night game if they executed better but it would have been competitive if they had.

That's a myth that has been repeated over and over for some reason.

That was a 42-7 game before the garbage time TD.

"Executed better"???????? The only thing they could have possibly executed better was to bribe the bus driver to take them to New Jersey instead that night.

 

[Rob0729]

The Texans have won 14 games this year with their "inflexible" style. When you win that many games, where is the imperative to significantly change what you do? I just don't see what some other posters do regarding a change to their gameplan. To me, as you said, this is about execution. If the Texans come in and don't turn the ball over, score TDs not FGs on their red zone opportunities and don't give the Patriots any easy scores? Their team has demonstrated the kind of potency that says they can win under those circumstances....whether in New England or Denver. And those circumstances speak to execution as much as anything.

I don't know if the Texans win that Monday night game if they executed better but it would have been competitive if they had.

First, with yesterday's game, the Texans have won 13 games, not 14.

Second, if the Texans executed better in the first game they might have lost by 14-21 points rather than 28. The Texans played their usual game plan. Their usual game plan turns to crap if teams can do the things I stated in my previous post and the Pats did all of them.

 

[Rob0729]

That's a myth that has been repeated over and over for some reason.

That was a 42-7 game before the garbage time TD.

"Executed better"???????? The only thing they could have possibly executed better was to bribe the bus driver to take them to New Jersey instead that night.

It was actually 35-7 because the Pats scored a garbage time TD themselves. But your point is correct. You can make the "if they executed better" argument in a 3-7 point gamem but the Pats won by 28 points. If the Texans executed better, they would have been blown out by the Pats by less points.

Personally, you can make a stronger argument that if Cincy executed better the Pats would be playing the Ravens or Colts next week rather than the Texans than you can that if the Texans executed better against the Pats they might have won or at least made it a close game.

 

[NYCPatsFan]

That's a myth that has been repeated over and over for some reason.

That was a 42-7 game before the garbage time TD.

"Executed better"???????? The only thing they could have possibly executed better was to bribe the bus driver to take them to New Jersey instead that night.

I think he/she has possibly two Texas TOs in mind: (1) Shaub INT on a promising drive and (2) Forster goal line fumble. Both were momentum stuffing turnovers that prevented them from being in the game. And our O's lightning quick scoring right after those TOs removed most of their air and spirit.

Hope BB and the players always remember how the Jets spoiled our seemingly cakewalk playoff two seasons ago and are prepared for a ferocious Texans looking to avenge their humiliation. Pretty confident that we will do so and hopefully fly under the radar and let the world continue to focus their attention on Peyton.

GO PATS!!

 

[Rob0729]

I think he/she has possibly two Texas TOs in mind: (1) Shaub INT on a promising drive and (2) Forster goal line fumble. Both were momentum stuffing turnovers that prevented them from being in the game. And our O's lightning quick scoring right after those TOs removed most of their air and spirit.

Hope BB and the players always remember how the Jets spoiled our seemingly cakewalk playoff two seasons ago and are prepared for a ferocious Texans looking to avenge their humiliation. Pretty confident that we will do so and hopefully fly under the radar and let the world continue to focus their attention on Peyton.

GO PATS!!

The Schaub INT is a perfect example of the limitations of Schaub when he isn't throwing out of play action. He tried to get the ball out quick and threw into tight double coverage where the best thing could have happened on that throw would have been an incomplete pass because there was no way his receiver was going to come up with the ball based on the coverage.

The thing is that there are probably a number of plays that if the Pats executed better, the Pats would have won something like 54-0. There are always plays like that, the thing is the Pats have an opportunistic defense that preys on those mistakes (hence why they were near the top of the league in take aways).

 

[Uncle Rico]

Just saw this on Twitter:

Andy Hart ‏@JumboHart
Despite very different reputations on defense, #Patriots and #Texans each gave up exactly 331 points in 2012. #NFL

 

[PATSYLICIOUS]

I think we're okay in any AFC matchup as long as we don't turn it over. In the first game we put the ball on the ground twice but luckily it didn't bite us in the you know what. This time, we can't afford to tempt fate. Protect the football and I believe the result will be similar. Their secondary is a good matchup for Brady as long as Watt is somewhat neutralized and that was even without Gronk.

At the end of the day the key is what it normally is come playoff time. The trenches. Brady has time to throw, we protect the football, and it's an easy W.

 

[patfanken]

Good discussions and solid points guys. Thank you.

Here's what I'd like. I'd like if someone who has a copy of the game, better yet access to the all 22, and could go over those 4 series of 3 and outs. I really think it would be interesting to see what the Texans were doing to shut down an offense that up until that point had run roughshod on them. Maybe they didn't do anything. Maybe the fault lay in the Pats lack of execution. I seem to recall in some of those 4 drives, a penalty that negated a good gain or starting a drive first and 20. I'm not sure.

I really thing it would be interesting to break down those 4 drives and see if that can give us an insight on some of the problems the Texans might present come Sunday. You better believe that BB and Wade Philips have put those 4 drives under the microscope. Phillips is showing them to his defense saying, "see what you can do when you execute". While Josh is showing them to his offense saying "see what can happen when you DON'T execute".

I'm sure the Pats will come into this game with a high degree of confidence, but they also remember that they lost to the Cardinals. They will also remember that sloppy play put them into a 31 -2 hole just a few weeks ago. Plus for 23 guys there will be he memory of a night in January of 2011. So I doubt there will be any chance of OVERconfidence

BTW- My heart will be with the Colts this afternoon. They really ARE a great story. But my head wants a Ravens win. Not just because I think they have a better chance of winning and giving the Pats home field for the AFCCG, but even if they lose, they are more likely to put a physical beating on the Broncos, than the Colts. Its as cold blooded as that.

 

[Uncle Rico]

...I'd like if someone who has a copy of the game, better yet access to the all 22, and could go over those 4 series of 3 and outs. I really think it would be interesting to see what the Texans were doing to shut down an offense that up until that point had run roughshod on them.

I don't have a tape or all-22, but my memory is the Pats were basically going for the kill shot on those series, taking shots down field, and just not connecting. Basically gambling with a big lead, and the Stallworth TD was the payoff. (I'm sure someone here will correct me if my memory is wrong )