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idle thoughts - scapegoating and....

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by patfanken, Oct 1, 2011.

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  1. patfanken

    patfanken Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

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    ....and other random thoughts

    I haven't been on line since Monday. I got hit with some kind of virus that appeared for no apparent reason and then, for no apparent reason, simply disappeared. Very frustrating. Almost as frustrating as listening to all the knee jerk reactions to the loss in Buffalo. This is a post that I had wanted to write very badly on Tuesday. Its been in my head all week. I know its late for some of it, but I just need to get it off my chest before I can move on. Thanks in advance.

    What bothered me the most has been the rampant scapegoating. The angry pointing of fingers at individuals in the most team oriented sport being played. I feel the need to point out 2 specific plays that really have pissed me off all week.

    1. Ocho's "supposed" error in not rounding off a route on the Pick thrown by Brady. I knew it was going to happen as soon as Gannon protected Brady by saying Ocho hadn't run the correct route. First neither Gannon or any other analyst, observer, or pontificator had any way to actually KNOW what the route was supposed to be run. Secondly the defender HAD taken the inside position on the play well before the ball was thrown. It was Brady's mistake. That ball had to be thrown deep and to the sideline.

    If you want to kill him for the drop of the TD pass later, that's fine. It was a horrendous drop. But on THIS particular play Ocho is getting the same "he doesn't know his playbook" crap JUST because its so easy to pile on. Which leads me to the 2nd play.

    2. McCourty was killed by many for a couple of plays, but the one I found so unjust was the long pass he gave up in the first play of the final drive. I defy anyone to explain to me what exactly McCourty could have done to prevent that completion. When the ball arrived he was in text book position. What is ironic is that he was in the exact same position as he was when he made the pick on Johnson in last year's Detroit game. He was in the exact same position as the Buffalo defender was when he picked off Brady. What's the difference. The Pass was perfectly thrown. NO ONE aside from Kevin Garnet assuming he could get into the position McCourty was in when the ball arrived. could have defended that pass. Yet it was used by far too many as an example of McCourty's "sophomore slump". I just don't get it.

    Again if you want to complain about his coverage on the first TD, where he was beaten cleanly feel free, but this need to continually find blame so vehemently is kind of pathetic and sad. I shouldn't be surprised because it seems to mirror a flaw in our national character which has evolved over the past few decades. which is that it seems that it is much more important and satisfying to a fix BLAME for any perceived mishap than it is to find the SOLUTION to fix the problem. Its like we no long care if the problem is solved as long as someone is blamed for it.....and its not us

    Well thanks for the forum to vent. I really do feel better now. And here a few more general thoughts

    1. We all knew in our hearts that Brady couldn't match what he accomplished last season. He now has 5 picks and 3 have been random deflections that found their way into enemy hands. Last year they fell harmlessly to the ground. This year...... Well, I just hope its not a trend.

    2. There were a lot of reasons that led to the loss last Sunday besides the missed opportunities, bad luck, and occasional poor execution. The officiating for one. I still don't know what Sergio Brown could have done in the endzone on the PI that was called. I thought the defender had a right to his position. He happened to be standing in the endzone when the receiver attempted to come back to the ball and contact was made.

    What was he supposed to do, say "excuse me" and stand aside? If THAT was PI, then is it any wonder that 300 yd passing games have become the norm. Personally I have no idea what a defender is now allowed to do or not do. The inconsistent calling of roughing, illegal contact, and PI is the worst I've ever seen. The league HAS to do something this off season to put some balance back into the game, or welcome to the age of arena league foootball.

    3. In typical Pats fashion the Pats have been very low key when it comes to injuries...and the Pat have had a bunch of them...and it showed

    4. Another great job by Solder, including the holding call, which he got by merely touching the defender's back with an open hand. The call was not only late, but his actions never impeded the defender. I have no idea what they call and don't call. It really seems so very arbitrary

    5. I wish the Pats would run the ball more consistently. They seem to do it well. It was another game where they averaged over 4 ypc. Does anyone still remember when getting 4 ypc seemed like an unachievable goal for Pats RBs and the rare games where ASmith reached that number were games to remember

    6. I know its only 8 carries, but Steven Ridley seems to have a burst that BJGE doesn't.

    7. Hard to believe that Branch didn't have a catch in a game where Brady goes for nearly 400 yds again

    8. It would be nice to see some pressure on Campbell this week....and about time.

    9. You know its not the Pats day when making a TD saving tackle is the reason they didn't have time to tie the game. Hard to blame McCourty on the play. I don't think this was a situation BB gave them. But it will be one he gives them now.
     
  2. BlueThunder

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    I haven't been a McCourty critic yet....but I have been one of Ocho's....

    I agree cpmpletely about the officiating so far...seems alot of fans of ALL TEAMS have been scratching their heads on some calls......If the ref's could keep their hankies pocketed except on blatant penalties, I think the fans of ALL teams would appreciate it.....fans don't come to see delays..replays...and penalties.....they come to see FOOTBALL plays being made.....catches...runs...passes.....returns.....not a show of the clowns the NFL calls refs.....

    I think the refs missed their training camps this year......

    Lunging at QB's knee to tackle...penalty flag not thrown...

    Tackling the QB with a textbook tackle...Flag thrown...

    Late flags thrown mean the ref sucks at getting it out of his pocket...or, if he really has to think that long aout a call...it shouldn't be a penalty to begin with... JMHO

    </vent> :)
     
  3. oldskool138

    oldskool138 In the Starting Line-Up

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    That's the first time I've ever heard gravity called "a trend".
     
  4. MoLewisrocks

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    OK. Turnabout is fair play so let me get something off my chest while we're at it. The mindless scapegoating is pathetic and has sadly become part of the fabric of this fanbase. It annoys me most when the HC, QB or organization are the mindnumbing targets of an entitled media and fanbase they created. That said, there are clearly mental mistakes being made by players in game and decisions by coaches that are fair game for criticism either based on the result or even irrespective of it.

    Gannon wasn't the only one who pointed out the lackluster route Chad ran in that instance. Effort isn't complicated. Great QB's get that way by making tough throws to worthy receivers...the kind still pulling in $6M at 33... Brady wasn't making small talk with Chad on the sidelines after that pick... Jermaine Wiggins knows a little bit about being one of Tom's targets and how routes are run here and what is expected and he said Ocho was expected to make a sharper break on that throw that would have resulted in either a reception or a PI call, similar to the one you don't understand in the EZ where the DB should have pulled up as the receiver approached the end line because had he gone out of bounds he's off the grid...so he was bound to come back and a kid not used to playing beyond ST made a classic mistake that a situationally aware receiver showcased for the zebra's benefit. That said, the zebra's are indeed performing inconsistently and below the curve this season as if the lockout set them back even moreso than players.

    We all wish they would run the ball more. Unfortunately the lost off season probably has something to do with their reluctance to use weapons they clearly felt they could use since they drafted two of them. We're down a TE and a swing tackle for blocking and we don't know how comfortable the staff is with the kid RB's as blockers and Benny had a tough day.

    McCourty is simply not playing at the same level as his rookie performance. It happens. Loss of the offseason may have exacerbated a sophomore slump. He's also had some real mismatches to deal with and not much safety help he can count on. The good news is he's usually in position to make a play, just hasn't panned out. And Bodden is looking eerily like guy he became when he got his last long term contract. Hopefully they are all working on all of that.

    Branch was blanketed or doubled most of the day. Would it have been better to be picked on throws to him?? I'm more concerned about injuries and to Hernandez in particular because he is such a potential force but he will never achieve his potential if he can't shake the seasonal injury bug. Here we thought Gronk was the one to worry about because of injuries impacting his draft stock...

    They aren't playing situations well consistently, and it's a tossup whether that is on personnel or coaching or youth or age or injuries or is a little bit of all of the above. Hopefully they can yet get it all sorted out. They need their best or most talented players on the field or available to be and so far that seems to be an issue.
     
  5. Patriot 37

    Patriot 37 On the Game Day Roster

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    No matter what spin people put on it McCourty has played poorly in 3 straight games. This fact is painfully obvious to anyone who isn't a mindless homer.
     
  6. PATRIOTSFANINPA

    PATRIOTSFANINPA Pro Bowl Player

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    Stats show McCourty receivers he covers has been thrown at 36 times and his receivers have caught 24 passes

    Last year all year he was thrown at only 104 times

    It's obvious teams see McCourty struggling and are piling it on
     
  7. Jackson 2

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    The wildest one this past week was the one suggesting that perhaps Edelman was somehow to blame and should be cut.
     
  8. Triumph

    Triumph Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

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    Regarding the NE DBs.

    Are the Pats playing more man coverage this season vs zone?
     
  9. AndyJohnson

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    What he did wrong was impede the receiver from getting to the ball without making a play on the ball. You can't play the receiver and stand in his way of getting to the ball. The position you have a right to is with respect to the football, not regardless of it.
    Look at it this way. If the ball came down where the receiver was standing, Brown running into him is clear intereference. The fact that the ball came down short of him and Brown kept him from coming back to it, while ignoring the football makes it even more of a violation.

    He needed to play the ball. Playing the receiver without respect to the ball is always PI.

    Agree with the commentary but this play is a bad example.




    But no one has come close to stopping the passing game anywhere near consistently. Aside from the bizarro world of 4 Ints I don't know why we would run when they can't stop the passing game. Any strategy that says we win unless Tom Brady throws 4 Ints is one I would support using every time out.

    Agree 100%


    I don't think you ever want a player thinking about whether to make a play or not. Granted when they were at the 1 let them score is smart, but you really dont want that thought entering anyones mind at the 35.
     
  10. AndyJohnson

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    Gannon said the Bills told him we were playing man 80% of the time. That is way, way more than we ever have, probably 4 times as much.
     
  11. AndyJohnson

    AndyJohnson PatsFans.com Veteran PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Do you have a link to those stats? That is great info.
     
  12. TB146

    TB146 On the Game Day Roster

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    Well, it is a pretty consistent trend... but I think he was referring to the ball ending up in enemy hands after a deflection as the trend he did not want continuing...
     
  13. Deus Irae

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    Patriots’ McCourty refuses to take cover - The Boston Globe
     
  14. PATSYLICIOUS

    PATSYLICIOUS Pro Bowl Player

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    Nice read as always Ken.

    What's most frustrating about the PI call is the fact that in each of the first 2 games we had guys that were practically tackled and no flag thrown. Just so frustrating when they throw such a huge flag on an iffy play given the way we've been getting screwed there on obvious infractions. No guarantee we would've won had it not been thrown but it changed the game completely.
     
  15. TB146

    TB146 On the Game Day Roster

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    So... are they experimenting? If it doesn't work will they switch back? I don't know much about defensive schemes... can they do Cover-2 zone with the DBs and that attacking-type defense with the front 7 that we saw during the first two preseason games?
     
  16. PatsWickedPissah

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    Great thread.

    OK I'm a Brady rump swab but I think the pick on 85s in route was on Brady. The defender took the inside and had it covered. Brady shouldn't have forced it in there.

    I watched McCourty. On the plus side, he has been in position lots of times and beaten by both good throws and frankly the wideout out playing him for the ball. You know what happens. McCourty's worrisome deficiency which I deliberately watched for was his limp wristed contact at the LOS where instead of impeding the WR makes a half hearted check and lets the guy blow by him so he's in futile, turn 180 degrees and play catchup mode. Needs serious coaching here since opposing OCs have justifiably painted a bull's eye on his jersey. What concerns me the most here is Darius Butler redux. I think a large part of Butler's problem was not his mediocre but acceptable NFL talent but his 2nd year onward total loss of confidence and mental inability to face the oh so visible challenge at the corner. Do we have a possible coaching inadequacy at the DB position?

    An as to Brown in the EZ, that PI is on him. Inexperience. The refs call that as PI the majority of the time. Brown needed ball awareness first and the experience to not get tooled by a savvy wideout changing direction and deliberately looking for the call which almost always gets made under the current though onerous PI rules.
     
  17. patfanken

    patfanken Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

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    Mo, we don't often disagree, but not one of your points sway me a bit. You have no idea if Chad's route was "lackluster" or not.....and neither do Gannon or Wiggins. MY GOD,Mo,are you actually are looking for back up to your point by a comment from Jermaine Wiggins. I have yet to hear a single insight from him in his weekly visits to 98.5. He is positively unlistenable, and not because of his accent or whiny voice. Because he has less to offer than 99% of the posters on a Jets board I am often struck by his LACK of insights given his playing experience.

    Gannon, who I actually like, an instant analysis based on NOTHING. Hey it was Tom Brady throwing the ball, it MUST have been the WR's fault. I got your back Tom. :rolleyes: And when Brady had Chad's back, its ignored as Brady being Brady. THIS time I don't think so.
    But we need a scapegoat, and its NOT going to be Brady
    Its fair game to criticize McCourty. Its the nature of the game, especially given the current rules. BUT not THAT play I still haven't seen anyone explain what Devon could have done differently or how the coverage was different from his pick in Detroit
     
  18. patfanken

    patfanken Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

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    OK since are putting yourself up as the resident genius of NFL secondary play, why don't you explain to me (in detail) what McCourty could have done on the play that would have resulted in an different result. Give me some insight here from someone who isn't a "mindless homer"....or maybe your are just a "mindless complainer"
     
  19. italia44

    italia44 In the Starting Line-Up

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    Agree with all,AJ......That was an egregious penalty by Sergio Brown...He had no idea where the ball was and got suckered by the WR...That is PI,every time...I don't have a clue,what PFK was looking at...must of been the "homer" channel.

    We're a superb passing team....get used to it...outside of the RZ,I don't care if we don't run much.The problem,if there is one,is that the offense is losing rhythem in the 2nd half with too much hurry-up....That,and the fact that this team must get control of their penalties or they're going nowhere......Oh....and that poor tackling thingy,is driving me insane.....that's right DB's....I'm talking to YOU.:mad:
     
  20. doesntmatter1

    doesntmatter1 Rotational Player and Threatening Starter's Job

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    IMHO i I believe our biggest issue right now is just tackling. The YAC has been killing us. I didn't get to watch Spikes as closely as I wanted but against Buffalo I noticed some flat out whiffs by Guyton and Barret.

    Also, the only thing McCourty could of done was trip the wideout before the ball arrived because i really think that play caught our defense by surprise. There was no safety over the top and Freddy Jackson was on fire so I have a feeling we were keying in on him.
     
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