Idle thoughts - post game thoughts

[borg]

Moss is a player that has lost a couple of steps. He has zero cutting ability. He still feels that he is worthy of a star's salary and has demonstrated that he is unwilling to accept a reduced role. He may be a locker room favorite, but he has forced managements to deal with nonfootball related Moss issues. In the"football first" world at Gillette, that crap don't fly. NO WAY BB considers allowing this guy to return....NO WAY.
Add in the fact that he's an emotional basketcase and a potential disappearing act every week....NO WAY he ever plays for the Patriots again

 

[tasmlab]

I think the idea of how many rookies are playing is a sound metric for the success or failure of a draft may be overstated. If we look at the 2006 or 2007 drafts (failures by this metric) we have a bunch of rookies trying to make one of the most talented teams ever, with a defense that had Wilfork, Sey, Warren, Bru, Vrable, Rodney, AD, Seau, Asante, etc. and an offense that was about to go 16-0 and break scoring records.

How many rookies can you even put on that 2007 roster?

Just suggesting that the high number of starting rookies is just as likely to be because we had a lot of positions to fill that weren't occupied by top-of-their-game veterans.

This isn't a complaint, I love watching our throng of new rookies

 

[SuperPatsFan]

Good post.

Peterson had 25 rushing attempts overall, but 11 of them came in the first quarter.

I therefore concur with those who say the Vikings all but gave up on running the ball with Peterson.

 

[aluminum seats]

Have to say, completely disagree about Moss. I don't know that I would have predicted it, but the vibes around this team are markedly better since he left. Thanks for the pick, and it's time to move on.

 

[FloridaPatsFan]

Minnesota must have some major problems that is only now beginning to surface...

It was brought up yesterday on the NFL network, but both Favre and Moss have been saying, in so many words, that Brad Childress does not really know what he's doing.

Now, I'm not going to rush to join that opinion, but thats 2 HOF's saying the same thing...and this morning, I'm already hearing similar opinions from other former players.

When I listened to Moss's post game comments...what I was thinking was that he was saying "I want to come back to New England....and whatever took place that got me here, I am sorry as hell for it now".

 

[upstater1]

We can cross out Moss since there are so many teams that will do well with him.

Look at KC. Moss and Bowe with a great running game?

Don't underestimate that combination.

 

[willdeespats]

We can cross out Moss since there are so many teams that will do well with him.

Look at KC. Moss and Bowe with a great running game?

Don't underestimate that combination.

I thought the same thing. Plus Cassell and Moss are already very familiar with eachother as well as the other PatChiefs.

 

[Bella*chick]

If Moss ever ends up here there will be a senate investigation into how the pats could trade a player for a 3rd round pick and somehow get him back and keeps the pick. Maybe a senate investigation is a little exagerated, but i'm sure there would be a lot of GM's and Owners that would want to know how this could happen. In steps Goodell

And you are 100% correct. I doubt the Pats want to step into that potential uproar when we're trying to win the division and get a playoff bye.

 

[patsfaninpittsburgh]

If Moss clears waivers, Minnesota pays the rest of his salary and as a free agent, he can sign with anybody. Added gravy now and he might look for the best chance to put up numbers to get that last big contract. That will cost the host team minimal money.

If he now realizes that the "big" contract is not coming, the best chance is to get a reasonable incentive deal for the longest term possible. Branch was smart to restructure because a reasonable amount of money for 3-4 years is better than bouncing for vet minimum. Just ask TO, he feels he's playing for free in Cincy.

Lots of ways to justify either way. My guess it's in Randy's court.

 

[patchick]

I think the idea of how many rookies are playing is a sound metric for the success or failure of a draft may be overstated. If we look at the 2006 or 2007 drafts (failures by this metric) we have a bunch of rookies trying to make one of the most talented teams ever, with a defense that had Wilfork, Sey, Warren, Bru, Vrable, Rodney, AD, Seau, Asante, etc. and an offense that was about to go 16-0 and break scoring records.

How many rookies can you even put on that 2007 roster?

I think you may be selling the 2009 class short. Here are some names from the 2007 week 1 defensive roster.

Corey Mays
Rashad Baker
Mel Mitchell
Eric Alexander
Santonio Thomas
Kareem Brown
Willie Andrews
David Herron

How many of of this year's week 1 defensive rookies would those guys bump off the roster?

McCourty
Cunningham
Spikes
Deaderick
Love
Fletcher

Zero seems like a very possible number.

 

[aluminum seats]

I think you may be selling the 2009 class short. Here are some names from the 2007 week 1 defensive roster.

Corey Mays
Rashad Baker
Mel Mitchell
Eric Alexander
Santonio Thomas
Kareem Brown
Willie Andrews
David Herron

How many of of this year's week 1 defensive rookies would those guys bump off the roster?

McCourty
Cunningham
Spikes
Deaderick
Love
Fletcher

Zero seems like a very possible number.

Correct--the fact is, if guys you draft are good players, you'll find room for them on the roster 99% of the time.

 

[bbobbo]

i would have liked to start a separate thread instead of hijacking this one, but my post count isn't high enough yet. plus, this does fall into the category of "idle post game thoughts".

my question is this: is there some rule about kneeldowns being only 1-yard losses (or maybe half-the-distance-to-the-goal), regardless of where the qb actually kneels down?

i noticed at the end of the first half, the patriots had the ball at their own 3-yard line, the o-line was standing on the 2-yard line, and tom brady was standing around 1.5 yards from the goal line. see here:



however, although brady knelt down at around 1.5 yards, the ref spotted the ball at the 2-yard line. same thing happened on the second kneel down--ball at the 2-yard line, o-line at the 1-yard line, and brady knelt at 0.5 yards, but the ball was spotted at the 1-yard line.

the reason i ask is this: after the second kneel down, the ball was at the 1-yard line and there were about 17 seconds left. if minnesota had used their final time-out, they would have forced new england to run an actual play since brady wouldn't have had enough room to kneel down again without taking a safety.

am i missing something? lots of bad possibilities for the patriots running a play from the 1-yard line, no real downside for the vikings. why not call the time out?

 

[mgcolby]

i would have liked to start a separate thread instead of hijacking this one, but my post count isn't high enough yet. plus, this does fall into the category of "idle post game thoughts".

my question is this: is there some rule about kneeldowns being only 1-yard losses (or maybe half-the-distance-to-the-goal), regardless of where the qb actually kneels down?

i noticed at the end of the first half, the patriots had the ball at their own 3-yard line, the o-line was standing on the 2-yard line, and tom brady was standing around 1.5 yards from the goal line. see here:



however, although brady knelt down at around 1.5 yards, the ref spotted the ball at the 2-yard line. same thing happened on the second kneel down--ball at the 2-yard line, o-line at the 1-yard line, and brady knelt at 0.5 yards, but the ball was spotted at the 1-yard line.

the reason i ask is this: after the second kneel down, the ball was at the 1-yard line and there were about 17 seconds left. if minnesota had used their final time-out, they would have forced new england to run an actual play since brady wouldn't have had enough room to kneel down again without taking a safety.

am i missing something? lots of bad possibilities for the patriots running a play from the 1-yard line, no real downside for the vikings. why not call the time out?

Its the position of the ball when his knee makes contact. Not where his knee makes contact.

 

[bbobbo]

Its the position of the ball when his knee makes contact. Not where his knee makes contact.

okay, that makes sense. so if the ball were spotted an inch from the goal line, the o-line were 1 yard into the endzone, and the qb was 1.5 yards into the endzone, there could conceivably be not enough room to take a kneel down.

 

[Water Boy]

Ken's right though, he's mostly a Front Office problem in NE.

That's because they shipped his ass out before things got bad.

He got in Bill O'Briens face during the Miami game, he was an ass during a team meal belittling the people serving the food, and he called out his coach in a press conference after the NE Minnesota game. You don't think this behavior ultimately negatively effects the locker room?

 

[mgcolby]

okay, that makes sense. so if the ball were spotted an inch from the goal line, the o-line were 1 yard into the endzone, and the qb was 1.5 yards into the endzone, there could conceivably be not enough room to take a kneel down.

Yes. They would probably run a QB sneak in that scenario.

 

[convertedpatsfan]

Yes. They would probably run a QB sneak in that scenario.

I think they only do that when they want to blow multiple chances to ice a huge game and drive me insane...

I'll be okay. Just have to go get my meds :bricks:

 

[5 Rings for Brady!!]

Sorry, but I have to disagree about Moss coming back to New England. Won't happen.

BB loves him and all is well between them, but he fully realizes that Randy is like a tall tree in the forest that blocks all the sun from the younger, healthier trees that are trying to grow.

BB's best move this year was ripping down those dynasty photos inside Gillette and telling the young fellas that this is THEIR time to grow.....and they're not only doing it, but they're blasting the muther down.

Brilliant analogy.

Ken, at least you flip flopped about the Moss thing but really...he is gone forever and we are 6-1.

 

[patfanken]

I can't disagree with Smessey's logic, and I totally agree with his comment about this team building its OWN legacy. However as unlikely at it is, I don't think any Pats fan (with Felger being the exception ) who wouldn't see Moss coming back under these new circumstances as a negative thing. Just as I see Mankins return, not as a negative thing, but not an impactful thing, at least in the short term.