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idle thoughts.....and the madness continnnnnnnnues

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by patfanken, Jul 29, 2011.

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  1. patfanken

    patfanken On the Roster

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    This is so much fun that maybe it wouldn't be a bad idea to have some kind of compressed FA period every year. I know the teams and GMs would hate it, but its been really a lot of fun for the fans.

    1. I would be remiss if I didn't comment on Albert Haynesworth. As value addition this was a no brainer. Super high reward, virtually no risk. But I have to tell you. Haynesworth is TRULY a bad guy, regardless of how he performs on the field, and I'm not talking about the stuff that went down with the Redskins. I don't have to list the incidents. Borges and Felger will be telling us all every one...every day, so I won't waste your time.

    This isn't another case of the Pats taking a "malcontent" like Dillon and Moss and maximizing the talent while (for the most part) minimizing the destructive tendencies of players to the lockerroom. Dillon was always a miserable personality, but he always played the game hard. Besides its hard NOT to be miserable if you played most of your career with the Bengals. Moss gave us 3+ years of great value, before his own insecurities caused him to self destruct last season. Haynesworth's list of indiscretions, and bad decisions go well beyond ANYTHING Moss or Dillon brought to the table. That being said, Haynesworth lucked out by coming here. Here he has A CHANCE to at least partially resurrect his sorry legacy, even its only for a single season.

    Bottom line: There's a better than 50-50 chance that Haynesworth's stay in NE will be a brief one. And even then it will have "some" value, in that BB will once again prove that as soon as you prove that you aren't accepting the "patriot way" you will be gone. Its not a bad thing to prove to the rest of the lockerroom every once in a while

    So while I hope for the best, I'm expecting the worst....and I won't be buying any Albert Haynesworth shirts regardless. ;)

    2. One to Chad Ochocinco.- This is more solid acquisition. Chad has always played hard and worked at the game. I'm amazed why the mediots tend to lump him into the "problem player" category. the only issue I have with this addition is, at least IMHO, his skill set duplicates Deion Branch's.Actually I think he's an upgrade on Branch in that he's bigger, tougher over the middle, and less prone to injuries, Neither are the "field stretchers" that common wisdom states we need.

    That makes me think that perhaps there is a scenario where Branch is let go before the season starts. Do we REALLY need both? Just a thought

    3. Matt Light. I'm kind of surprised that the rumor mill is contending that Light back to NE is pretty much a done deal. Don't get me wrong, I'm happy to have him back, but I really don't see the point of him coming back from HIS perspective. While it would be a luxury to have him on the roster so Nate Solder's transition to the starting LT will be smooth and unrushed, I can't see him coming back for just a single season. He would easily command a 2-3 yr contract for probably more money that the Pats will give him from a lot of teams. For example, based on the way the Steelers are shedding OLmen, it would seem a logical spot. Its a good organization, a contender, and just an hour and half plane ride from home.

    So what would make him want to sign back with NE. I can only think of 2 reasons. The first is that he decided that 2011 would be his last year and so he can live with the Solder transition knowing that he would still be a major contributor for his final season. The other is that he is willing to start the the season at LT, but begin the transition to playing G for the remainder of the contract. Nothing else makes much sense

    4. I am over feeling that somehow the Jets manipulated Goodell into getting all the dead money dropped and allowing them to escape the cap hell they and several other teams have gotten themselves into. Clearly this was a legitimate negotiation point for the NFLPA designed to get more money to their players. If the dead money wasn't eliminated, there would have been tens of millions not going into players pockets this season. So it wasn't a "Jets conspiracy", but just ANOTHER win for the NFLPA rewarding badly managed teams to get more for doing less. :rolleyes:

    5. And the madness will continue. In PFT, Florio noted that only 32 of his top 80 FAs have been signed. So there are still many quality FAs still on the market.

    6. It looks to me that its becoming more and more likely that Aso will be going to the Jets. The fit is just too good. He isn't a zone guy, so the Jets D fits his skill set perfectly. He gets to go from a backwater in Oakland to the media capital of the world and a contender besides.

    But I don't know if that really makes then that much better. Dropping the dead money got the Jets out of cap hell, but while Aso might give them a slight discount, he isn't going to want to earn less than he made last season or significantly less than what Revis makes. I think the delay in his signing has been made necessary by the restructures and manipulation of his contract so that it will fit within the cap. Meanwhile the Jets are losing more and more of the parts that helped them get to where they were in the first place.

    They are going to lose Taylor, Ellis and Poole. They still have to pay Harris. The rest of their LB core is getting old and are on the downside. Their DL will look more like the Pats DL did after Warren,Brace,Wright, and GWarren were gone. They will be thin at S, and their best S is marginally talented to begin with, and is coming back from a serious injury. Yes they will have the 2 best CBs in the league. That will be a challenge to every team they face, but at what cost?

    Who is going to back up Sanchez? Who is going to play opposite Holmes, The great OLs of the past few years might be weaker this year. the fact they gave Wayne Hunter 3MM/year to be their Woody replacement tells us that Vlad is another Jet bust. So while Mangold and DBrick are among the best at their positions, Moore is aging, Hunter is untried, and Slauson is the Jets version of Dan Connolly. In other words, competent, but someone you are always looking to upgrade. And those are just the starters. Their depth on both sides of the ball will be filled by minimum wage guys.

    Bottom Line, The more I think about it, I'll be more afraid if they DON'T sign Aso and use the money to improve depth and resign some of the guys they had last season.

    7. This preseason right into the first 4 games of the season really won't mean much. It will take a couple of more weeks before the bulk of the FA are absorbed into their new teams. As it is a lot of guys under contract, like Sammy Morris can't get on the field until NEXT Thursday. Most of the next 2 week practices are pretty much useless since so many guys are missing. Add all that to the ridiculous new practices limitations and its going to be a while before teams will be ready to play anything close to what was formerly NFL caliber football. If you can sense my disgust of the new practice rules, congratulations.... you have a "keen sense of the obvious". ;)

    8. Is anyone else but me disturbed that our top 3 draft picks are STILL unsigned and not on the field? Just checking.

    OK have to rap this up. Suffice it to say that before all the dust clears most NFL teams will have undergone the most radical roster changes in memory, so this season could very well be one of the more surprising and interesting in many years.




    4.
  2. strngplyr

    strngplyr Rookie

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    I have to strongly disagree on point 7.

    The early season will mean more than it ever has in my opinion, the teams that hit the ground running right out of the gate will be in an excellent position when everything starts to come together. Its one reason that I am very optimistic about this season, we're almost entirely intact in every core position.

    If we start out 4-0 or 3-1 while other teams are struggling to insert new pieces for the first quarter of the season we'll have a clear advantage when everyone on our team looks back to perfect form and our opponents are only just coming together.

    Make this even more important considering we are facing some divisions going over the biggest makeovers in the NFL, the AFC West and NFC North. The very first things we heard after the lockout ended was these divisions dumping half their players for salary cap reasons and signing several new players who have to learn new systems.
  3. IcyPatriot

    IcyPatriot ------------- PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Since Vollmer has been here Bill has been rotating the tackles. I think this will continue as i think both Bills like it this way. Keeps them healthier and perhaps it keeps the defense guessing a bit? I think Light plays LT - Vollmer plays both and I think Solder learns to play some RT before he becomes the everyday LT. Even for a few years I think this scenario is a healthy approach to the position. Tackles don't last a season and guards who can play tackle don't cut it ... too slow.

    Love the patfanken threads btw ... always a fun read bet you are happy to type them again.

    Of course anything but Kaczur made me happy last year.;)
    Last edited: Jul 29, 2011
  4. BlueThunder

    BlueThunder PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    This..............:rocker:
  5. PatsWickedPissah

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    When BB signed Ocho, I thought that Branch was most at risk. My major assumption is that Price and especially Tate show strong signs of development at WR. If one of them pulls a Chad Jackson, it's history.

    Between having strong community roots and team comradship, I think Light is prepared to make less than he could if he maxed out in FA. I would in his place. Money is not everything to everyone, just to most people.
  6. Ice_Ice_Brady

    Ice_Ice_Brady Rookie

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    Nice post. I couldn't have said it better about Asomugha, everything you wrote about that situation, and I also believe the hangup is trying to structure the contract to sign more players this year. I have a feeling the Jets will be celebrating in August this year... but, Jets fans overreact as usual. Teams are not stupid and will make plenty of adjustments to exploit weaknesses; simply because the two are both cornerbacks, to me, does not mean that much. They are two parts of an eleven man defense. Are they really more dominating than Troy Polamalu and James Harrison, who are both the best at their position and on the same defense? I think the answer is debatable, but this is not going to be "the best defense of all-time." Way too many holes; I think the Ravens and Steelers will still have more effective units because they have the domination up front.
  7. Professor Frink

    Professor Frink Rookie

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    Good stuff as usual, I'm always excited to see an idle thoughts thread.

    1. As far as Haynesworth goes, I don't care about the stuff players do before they get here. Well, that's not true, I would be upset if the Patriots traded a 1st rounder for him. But since they didn't make a significant investment into him, I'm willing to give him a fresh start. All I care about is what he does while he is here. As long as he shows up and plays hard I'll be happy. I'm sure there are plenty of players on the Patriots' roster I wouldn't get along with.

    2. I had the same thought with Branch, I think he might be a suprise cut. Reiss blogged today that he felt Price had an uphill climb, but I think cutting Branch makes more sense because he is older and only signed for this year. Especially if Julian Edelman can win the #3 spot.

    3. I'd be thrilled to get Matt Light back, it would take care of the biggest question mark on the offensive side of the ball. My thinking is that because of this crazy free agency, teams are hesitant to give a lot of money to a player that is older and doesn't know their system. When you are in your 30s the first year of your contract is more important, and if teams don't think they can get good value they will only offer small money. Maybe the Patriots are willing to give him a short deal at good money, and he can become a free agent again next year under more normal circumstances. Win win for both sides.

    4. This Goodell loves the Jets and is trying to help him conspiracy bu!!***** needs to stop. Seriously, it's embarrassing. Roger Goodell is in charge of a 9 BILLION dollar business. He's gonna do what is best for the business, not what's best for the Jets, or any other team.

    5. I say let the good times keep rollin'. I'm still holding out hope we sign Shaun Ellis

    6. Agreed, Aso or no Aso, the Jets are in trouble.

    7. It's hard to believe preseason is gonna suck more than it already did, but you're right. Most teams will barely have done any hitting before the games, I expect it to be ridiculously sloppy, and the rookies probably won't be able to do anything.
  8. Triumph

    Triumph Rookie

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    Branch was Bradys go to guy before Welker ever met Tom Brady. Brady and Branch dont even need to speak to know what the other is thinking in terms of route selection and ball placement.

    Tate and Price? I dont know. Tate has the speed and is a damn fine KR. Price has been hardly given the chance to fail. To me, they are the youing guns in the pipeline ready to step up when the older NE WRs move on.
  9. AzPatsFan

    AzPatsFan Rookie

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    As I said elsewhere, the solution to a dilemma of Revis & Asomougha is... the obvious "Greatest Show on Turf" answer.

    Two Great ones can't be in Three or More places at once. 3 + Recievers. The Ochocinco signing ensure that Pats can field three great Wrs, and two good TEs and have even more besides... It got the Rams to two consecutive Superbowls and a Ring.

    Meanwhile ther Jets continue to weaken every where else. Their momentary opportunity, while BB was rebuilding a faded Superbowl club grown old and slow, has passed.

    It was tied two years ago at 11-5. Last year it was a three game separation,14-2 vs 11-5; and has widened already to perhaps 5 or more games, as Jenkins, Taylor, Ellis, Woody, and and maybe Braylon have or are departing. Meanwhile the Pats continue to add pieces. 13-3 vs 8-8.

    Buh Bye Rex...
  10. sarge

    sarge Rookie

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    Great post as usual Ken

    I am sure I am in the minority and will get flamed big time for what I am about to say, but after a day to think about it and getting past the initial exitement, I don't like either signing.

    I absolutely hope I am wrong, but I don't see Chad what ever his last name is this week working out.

    He will not stretch the field like Moss did, and is known for poor route running. And on top of that is probably one of the biggest primadona's in the league. I enjoy watching the guy play and actually like him, but not for this team.

    I surely hope I am wrong, but I have a bad feeling Brady will have a few interceptions this season due to Chad not being where he is suppose to be.

    Would have prefered a more humble solid route runner.

    Don't like the Albert Haynesworth move either. Dude is just a straight up dirtbag. He may dominate when he wants to, but I suspect he is going to not want to at the worst possible time. Nevermind the fact that he goes on trial next month.

    I know the whole in bill we trust...

    The last quarter I saw this Pats team play, that mantra took a hit.

    Not only were we running the ball every play down two scores in the 4th. We were also running the play clock down to nothing every single play only to run the ball.

    This with Tom Brady under center.

    That game plan in the last qtr against the Jets in the playoffs was just inexplicable and inexcusable. It got to the point that even if the Pats had scored, there would have been little time for another possesion.

    I surely hope I am wrong regarding the signings. I would love nothing more then for everyone here to tell me I told you so. Would love eating that crow.

    But look at it from a realistic perspective. And if you try justifying it with "In Bill we trust", remember the clock killing offensive plays down two scores in the 4th in the last playoff game.
  11. PatsWickedPissah

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    was is a very important word. Small quick receivers aren't as quick or durable as the years pile on. BB has shown that IF (another important word) a player is about to go past his shelf life, he's gone. Usually sooner than before, e.g. Vrable. Again IF as you say the young guns continue to show improvement then Branch could be at risk.
  12. DarrylS

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    I agree with the comments on Nmadi and Revis... while they are the best, they cannot cover the whole field.. they cannot provide an offensive punch, and tying up this much cash amongst them and Sanchez, does not provide for a lot of quality in other necessary positions..

    Sounds like the Redskins Lite..
  13. QB12

    QB12 Rookie

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    or as someone else said, the New York Heat.
  14. Tippett56

    Tippett56 Rookie

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    Ken, as always a great thread. I hope you are wrong on Haynesworth but your insight is usually spot on.

    The main surprise for me was the reigning of Sammy Morris - not sure how he fits in with all the TEs being signed.
  15. Boston Boxer

    Boston Boxer U.S. Air Force Retired PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I think you are very wrong about Chad...he is a solid WR and a very good route runner.
  16. patsox23

    patsox23 Rookie

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    Chad is considered one of the BEST route runners in the NFL.
  17. patfanken

    patfanken On the Roster

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    I'm going to repeat 2 questions and looking for responses.

    1. Why isn't anyone concerned that we haven't signed ANY of our top 3 draft picks. Isn't this the year that its even more critical that rookies get EVERY rep they can?

    2. WHY is Matt Light signing back with us? I know why WE would do it, but what's in it for HIM? Why sign here were he, at BEST, would only start one year, at a hometown discount, when he can sign with any number of teams a multi year deal, be a starter, and get more money? I can't figure it. The only reasons I can think of are the ones I mentioned in the post.....and both of them are stretches. So what's up.
  18. BlueThunder

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    Maybe one question you pose is tied to the other in regard to Solder....
    Light coming back might mean Solder gets eased into lineup during latter part of season...gets mentored by Matt...Maybe Light likes the area and is happy to retire after another season ?

    As far as Dowling, the Pats are pretty well set at DB and he doesn't have to start ....

    Vereen's position isn't as tough to intergrate into and they already have most of last year's backs signed, as well as Ridley...

    I'm sure that BB/Casario will get them signed shortly.....



    I don't worry too much about it at this stage...If it drags out more than another week, then I'd be a bit more concerned.....JMHO
    Last edited: Jul 30, 2011
  19. borg

    borg Rookie

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    Possible issues in no particular order:
    1) Too busy dealing with veteran contract issues
    2) Waiting to see where team finances are against the cap before structuring the higher priced rookie contracts (front load/back load)
    3) Seeing how other teams work the new slotting system before jumping in.
  20. patsfan13

    patsfan13 Hall of Fame Poster PatsFans.com Supporter

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    The top picks always take longer to sign. I am not expecting a lot from Solder this year. If they aren't signed by nest Wed I will be concerned. Dowling need the reps more than a RB like Vereen IMO. The sooner the better obviously.



    Perhaps his family likes it here he may not want the kids changing schools ect. He may be planning on only playing another year or two and the difference may not be worth it to him. I could see him switching to guard for a year or two if Solder becomes the starting LT. Hard to know what motivates a person. I would think he knows the situation and has a plan in mind IF he does resign (I hope he can finish his career here).
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