How To Address the Need at Linebacker

[mgteich]

THE MOST COST EFFECTIVE
Perhaps the best is to draft three players with our first three picks on Day Two, moving around if necessary, and using the tradeable 6th and 7th to make trades more even, if necessary.

Any players brought in will need to learn our system, and likely take a lot of work before they are effective. The run-stuffing ILB role is the most likely to be able to filled. There are many players avaiable in the 4th who could help us build the depth in our front seven. We easily have the place for three. At worst, one would be gone before the season starts, and the two would replace Alexander and Klecko on the roster. The third player could be a backup NT or DE instead of a linebacker convert and compete with Wright for a spot (or Claridge or Izzo or Davis).

BOTTOM LINE
I won't panic if we don't pick a linebaker or DL on Day One. BTW, I think aj suggested this very approach a few weeks ago,








mark

 

[Ring 6]

THE MOST COST EFFECTIVE
Perhaps the best is to draft three players with our first three picks on Day Two, moving around if necessary, and using the tradeable 6th and 7th to make trades more even, if necessary.

Any players brought in will need to learn our system, and likely take a lot of work before they are effective. The run-stuffing ILB role is the most likely to be able to filled. There are many players avaiable in the 4th who could help us build the depth in our front seven. We easily have the place for three. At worst, one would be gone before the season starts, and the two would replace Alexander and Klecko on the roster. The third player could be a backup NT or DE instead of a linebacker convert and compete with Wright for a spot (or Claridge or Izzo or Davis).

BOTTOM LINE
I won't panic if we don't pick a linebaker or DL on Day One. BTW, I think aj suggested this very approach a few weeks ago,








mark

I dont remember posting that approach per se, but I agree it is an option.

We are looking at the 2 primary needs as having to be solved in the draft on day 1.

I do not necessarily agree (although solving them on day 1 would be a good thing, and probabyl best case)

WR- There are 2 important questions that we won't know.
What does BB expect from Caldwell.
What does BB expect from Bethel, with a clear path to being able to start?

Add Branch and Brown if the answers to those question are positive and we aren't in such bad shape at all. Childress as a #5 isnt unreasonable.
I could see wanting to added EITHER experience or a youngster who could fit anywhere within that group, or even both. I do not think we are looking for our starting WR on Saturday.

LB.
We have 3 great ones. We play a 4th less than 50% of the snaps.
Beisel or TBC wouldn't be very far behind the '4th best LB' we have own with, which include Phifer, Cox (when he had little left) TJ (I know he is beloved here, but my eyes say Beisel isnt any worse).

Surely we need depth. But the '4th starter' is a part time job. They only play in the base D. Thats is not 100% of 1st downs, because we play nickel on 1st vs some teams. Less than 1/2 of 2nds and none on 3rd. (Yes last year we ffound a way to get 4 LBs on the field all the time, but that is because we wanted to not had to)

I don't have much confidence in the depth, but who had confidence in Chatham, Izzo, Phifer or Cox when we pulled them off the scrap heap, TBC, etc who have all played backup roles here?
Absolutely we need players, but we dont, IMO NEED them to be huge contributors right now.

I am beginning to agree with the outlook that we should be drafting for 07-08 in this draft, and whatever they give us in 06 is gravy (with the exception that the way BB picks and coaches them, they will be ready when called upon).

If we have a draft pick who starts a single game, particualrly before November, unless its due to injury, I wouldnt be surprised at all, and wouldnt be unhappy with the draft, all other things equal.

 

[patsox23]

Good call - 'though I'd still like to take one at #21.

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

"How To Address the Need at Linebacker?"

draft one or two or three or....

 

[bakes781]

At least at WR they have some youth. Where as at LB they're clearly aging. They've passed on selecting a top LB prospect in the past, perhaps with the foresight that this would be the year where the supply would be peaking. I'd be shocked if they didn't draft at least one LB by the end of day one.

 

[dryheat44]

How? You get a proven, perennial Pro-Bowl caliber guy like Donnie Edwards, then you allow yourself to let the draft come to you in order to get younger.

 

[BelichickFan]

I'm sick or typing this and you guys are probably sick of reading it but . . .

We have 3 good full time LB, Vrabel, Bruschi, Colvin. The latter two are locked in at ILB and ROLB. Vrabel can play LOLB or ILB.

Optimally we'd all love the draft "the 4th starter". But we could get this done cheaply by using two guys who could be had cheaper - a TJ type run stopper and a guy who can rush the passer. The over the top optimist would say that if Claridge could fill the TJ role and TBC could be a pass rusher, we could not have any hole and do this :

Run Downs :
OLB - Vrabel, Colvin
ILB - Bruschi, Claridge

Pass Downs :
OLB - TBC, Colvin
ILB - Bruschi, Vrabel

I don't want to do the above, I would draft a ILB like Schlagel to compete for the TJ role and perhaps a pass rusher at OLB depending if we think TBC can fulfill that role. But by utilizing the strengths of the players we could rotate one spot, move Vrabel around and get this done very cheaply.

 

[patsfan13]

OLB is a position where we need a very talented athelete, these are hard to find (remember BB comment about big, fast people, and the fact there aren't too many). I agree with Andy that a LB likely won't be a contributor this year. we need to groom a OLB. Since this draft has a lot of candidates, I hope we are in a position to draft a future OLB.

There are good candidates available on day 2 for an ILB role. Also It will be interesting to see how Claridge and Beisel contribute this year.

 

[Ring 6]

I'm sick or typing this and you guys are probably sick of reading it but . . .

We have 3 good full time LB, Vrabel, Bruschi, Colvin. The latter two are locked in at ILB and ROLB. Vrabel can play LOLB or ILB.

Optimally we'd all love the draft "the 4th starter". But we could get this done cheaply by using two guys who could be had cheaper - a TJ type run stopper and a guy who can rush the passer. The over the top optimist would say that if Claridge could fill the TJ role and TBC could be a pass rusher, we could not have any hole and do this :

Run Downs :
OLB - Vrabel, Colvin
ILB - Bruschi, Claridge

Pass Downs :
OLB - TBC, Colvin
ILB - Bruschi, Vrabel

I don't want to do the above, I would draft a ILB like Schlagel to compete for the TJ role and perhaps a pass rusher at OLB depending if we think TBC can fulfill that role. But by utilizing the strengths of the players we could rotate one spot, move Vrabel around and get this done very cheaply.

We dont use 4 LBs on passing downs. Really we use 1 or 2. But we have in the past also used OLBs at DE on 3rd down.

For nickel/dime, we need Bruschi and Vrabel. On top of that OLBs can play DE if needed.

 

[BelichickFan]

We dont use 4 LBs on passing downs. Really we use 1 or 2. But we have in the past also used OLBs at DE on 3rd down.

For nickel/dime, we need Bruschi and Vrabel. On top of that OLBs can play DE if needed.

Right but McGinnest and Colvin are on the field a lot on passing downs. We would still need the pass rusher there, whether it's TBC, Green or someone else with Vrabel at LB.

 

[nickw308810]

I would like a round 1 LB just because there doesn't seem like many better options at 21. If we trade up or down we can get away from LB, but at 21 it seems the most likely. I do feel that there are plenty of mid to late round guys that could come in and provide youth and depth at LB and STs. Maybe even push TBC or Beisel/Claridge for a starting spot. I mention Claridge just because everyone else thinks he can be ready, but as of now I would assume that Beisel is miles ahead of him. If we could get a playmaker on offense (Addai or Chad Jackson) or even Michael Huff at S, I would rather go that route. Though if we do go LB Bobby Carpenter seems to be the guy because of his versatility, though I think he is the best fit for ILB.

 

[patsfan13]

When we're in the nickel, We have 4 LB who can rush Colvin, Vrabel, Bruschi & TBC, 3 of the 4 will be in. We are fine at LB for passing situations. I would like a OLB for development & depth this year.

 

[BelichickFan]

When we're in the nickel, We have 4 LB who can rush Colvin, Vrabel, Bruschi & TBC, 3 of the 4 will be in. We are fine at LB for passing situations. I would like a OLB for development & depth this year.

Agreed which means we just need a TJ type for run downs with Vrabel at OLB.

 

[Pats726]

Beisel or TBC wouldn't be very far behind the '4th best LB' we have own with, which include Phifer, Cox (when he had little left) TJ (I know he is beloved here, but my eyes say Beisel isnt any worse).

Surely we need depth. But the '4th starter' is I don't have much confidence in the depth, but who had confidence in Chatham, Izzo, Phifer or Cox when we pulled them off the scrap heap, TBC, etc who have all played backup roles here? Absolutely we need players, but we dont, IMO NEED them to be huge contributors right now.

I think Phifer was a much better LB than many think. TJ. I believe was as well, but obviously more in stopping the run and plugging the middle. Beisel is far from that, although I know he was brought in more as a TB type LB. The team CAN have a 4th LB of lesser ability and get by. My thoughts are no NEED..maybe not, but should the team take an opportunity when it is there and use it to restock the LB corp?? They have a fairly low pick for a playoff team andit concides with a LOT of talent at LB. My thought is that this IS the year to do that. Granted it doesn't HAVE to, but wouldn't that be smart?? How are the LBs on 07 and 08??? Not as strong??

 

[mgteich]

And as many times as you've posted this, I remembered it was aj. Keep reminding us of this analysis.

I'm sick or typing this and you guys are probably sick of reading it but . . .

We have 3 good full time LB, Vrabel, Bruschi, Colvin. The latter two are locked in at ILB and ROLB. Vrabel can play LOLB or ILB.

Optimally we'd all love the draft "the 4th starter". But we could get this done cheaply by using two guys who could be had cheaper - a TJ type run stopper and a guy who can rush the passer. The over the top optimist would say that if Claridge could fill the TJ role and TBC could be a pass rusher, we could not have any hole and do this :

Run Downs :
OLB - Vrabel, Colvin
ILB - Bruschi, Claridge

Pass Downs :
OLB - TBC, Colvin
ILB - Bruschi, Vrabel

I don't want to do the above, I would draft a ILB like Schlagel to compete for the TJ role and perhaps a pass rusher at OLB depending if we think TBC can fulfill that role. But by utilizing the strengths of the players we could rotate one spot, move Vrabel around and get this done very cheaply.

 

[patsfan13]

Agreed which means we just need a TJ type for run downs with Vrabel at OLB.

So the options are Beisel, Claridge or drafting a guy to fill that role (assuming that Alexander, Izzo & Davis are ST except in an emergency). Maybe Schlagel, OSU or Hoyte NCST as a mid round draftee.

I like the OLB at #21 though.

 

[jimmyjames]

I agree with the sentiment that any draft at linebacker this year should be made with an eye to 2007 over an immediate impact player. Just to elaborate a little it would seem that that the next great Patriots linebacker is proabbly not a linebacker...yet

Tedy, Vrabel, Willie (Rosie too?) and even Beisel all played on the line in college. Just seems like the tweeners thrive in the Patriots system, just takes a little while to get it. But they are for confusing the opposing QB, fighting off blockers, moving all over the place and tend to "play mean" Don't be surprised to see a couple more DL drafted especially on day two . We may just see a couple of them walking upright in a year or two.

 

[Pats726]

Don't be surprised to see a couple more DL drafted especially on day two . We may just see a couple of them walking upright in a year or two.

I would agree about that..late picks and some UDFAs...DE tweeners... They let one go from the PSqd..Andre Torrey, who is looking pretty good in NFLE. I saw him in TC and he was just a machine tackling..VERY impressive for a rookie...esp in a one on one tackling situation.
Yes, whatever they do the late picks/UDFAs maybe some projects.

 

[Ring 6]

OLB is a position where we need a very talented athelete, these are hard to find (remember BB comment about big, fast people, and the fact there aren't too many). I agree with Andy that a LB likely won't be a contributor this year. we need to groom a OLB. Since this draft has a lot of candidates, I hope we are in a position to draft a future OLB.

There are good candidates available on day 2 for an ILB role. Also It will be interesting to see how Claridge and Beisel contribute this year.

Look at the guys we have and when they were drafted. IIRC (could be off) Bruschi was a 3, Vrabel was 3 or 4, Colvin I think was a 5.

IT IS NOT WHO YOU DRAFT IT IS WHAT YOU DO WITH THEM AFTER DRAFTING THEM.
This is more true than ever dealing with LBs under BB. OBVIOUSLY, the higher they are picked the better the chance they will work out, but once they are on the team, what they become depends on what they do AFTER everyone decided to draft or not draft them.

 

[Ring 6]

Right but McGinnest and Colvin are on the field a lot on passing downs. We would still need the pass rusher there, whether it's TBC, Green or someone else with Vrabel at LB.

Colvin, Vrabel, Green, TBC, Warren, Hill, Klecko can all fill that nickel/dime DE role. Seymour is normally inside.
I dont worry much that we we can be effective there with only McG subtracted from the rotation, since I have some confidnece that Green and Warren at the least can be effective there.