How good are our corners?

[mayoclinic]

How good are our CBs?

Not god enough if we give Manning, Brees, Rivers and company all day to find their target.

Plenty good enough (with Bodden) if we get some pressure on the opposing QBs.

 

[bostonia3333]

Bodden and Butler are the best things we have. They are good enough to get the job done with a decent pass rush. Bodden was one of the healthier pats this season...maybe the healthiest player on the roster...gotta resign him

Springs should be cut due to age

Jonathan Wilhite is Deltha Oneal bad....even Drew Brees said we "saw some soft spots in that secondary" after that Monday nighter. We know who he was talking about. Wilhite is GONE

 

[The Dynasty]

How good are our CBs?

Not god enough if we give Manning, Brees, Rivers and company all day to find their target.

Plenty good enough (with Bodden) if we get some pressure on the opposing QBs.

100% true.

 

[Deus Irae]

Bodden and Butler are the best things we have. They are good enough to get the job done with a decent pass rush. Bodden was one of the healthier pats this season...maybe the healthiest player on the roster...gotta resign him

Springs should be cut due to age

Jonathan Wilhite is Deltha Oneal bad....even Drew Brees said we "saw some soft spots in that secondary" after that Monday nighter. We know who he was talking about. Wilhite is GONE

Given that Brees was exploiting Bodden and the safeties, I wouldn't be heaping too much scorn on Wilhite based upon those comments.

 

[SyN65]

Bodden - Best CB, would like to be re-signed.

Butler - Good rookie season, should be CB #2 heading into next year.

Wilhite - #3 CB.

Springs - Barely used him this year. He's 34 (35?) I believe. He'll probably be cut.

Wheatly - Tells Slater to stay in the end zone on kick off returns.

 

[captain stone]

Bodden - or a reasonable/better facsimile thereof - needs to be Paid, and kept for more than just one year at a time. Otherwise, we're screwed - again.

Springs - Bill signed this old fart to a 3-year deal? Ridiculous. Because of his cap hit & health permitting, he's coming back next season. He did a good job vs. Andre Johnson in Houston, and could make a decent #4 CB & #2/3 FS.

Butler - Bill's best draft pick since Mankins in '05; future #1 CB.

Wilhite - Bill should've drafted Orlando Scandrick instead. A #5 CB, at best.

Wheatley - a horrible draft pick then, and an even worse one now. A major injury risk who has done nothing, if not more, to confirm his reputation. Must be replaced ASAP.

In conclusion: we need 2 #2/3-caliber CBs; 3, incl. a #1, if Bodden is not re-signed.

Bodden (or similar) - Butler
Higher Draft Pick/Vet FA - Springs
Vet FA/Lower draft Pick - Wilhite

 

[BradyFTW!]

BODDEN
I dunno, depends an awful lot on what he's willing to stay for. Do I think that re-signing him is an absolute necessity? No, but we can't stand pat if we let him walk- would have to replace him with a FA.

BUTLER
I'm comfortable with him being our #2 in 2010. The guy's a player, and I think he'll be our #1 sooner rather than later, whether Bodden stays or not (Bodden should be a #2 on a good team anyways, IMO). I wouldn't like going into 2010 with him as our #1, but if that is how it turns out, I do think it's a reasonable possibility that he might develop into a legit #1 by the end of next year. Either way, it's not going to matter a whole lot unless we fix our pass rush.

SPRINGS
I like him more than most seem to- I have no problem w/ keeping him around, as long as we don't assume that he's going to stay healthy. Have to build your roster on the assumption that he'll miss at least a few games.

WILHITE/WHEATLEY
Not high on either of them. I doubt either one is part of the team's long-term plans, at this point. Wheatley can't even get on the field, and that's especially scary because that means he must be worse than Wilhite, who is pretty bad in his own right.

 

[patsinthesnow]

I want Butler to be our #1 CB in the future. The last memory of him was a bomb to Andre Johnson where he STUCK on him the whole way. His speed is impressive as well.

Everyone on this board knows deep down Bodden won't be back. He will pull a Samuel.

So I say draft a #2 cornerback.

 

[Yfz01]

Butler, Bodden, and Springs are all legit corners that could start for a lot of teams. Springs is older, and i'm not sure he will last a full season, so depth is good to have. Wilhite could be a decent slot corner (probably, he looked pretty bad at times last year...)

If I was the Patriots, I wouldn't hate the depth at corner right now. There are more pressing needs on that defense and even a couple needs on offense. OLB, DE, OG, and WR all before corner.

 

[37Harrison]

With coaching, Wilhite would be greatttt. Give the kid some time. He is always where the ball is.

If you mean behind the WR who is catching the ball then you are correct. I have said this many times this past year but I guess it's worth repeating to those who believe he has "good coverage"... It doesn't matter how tight his coverage is if the WR he's covering consistently catches the ball anyways? That is not good enough coverage.

Maybe he will learn to get his head turned around and pick up the flight of the ball quicker as time goes on so he can make plays but that remains to be seen. The odds are against him though.

 

[The Dynasty]

If you mean behind the WR who is catching the ball then you are correct. I have said this many times this past year but I guess it's worth repeating to those who believe he has "good coverage"... It doesn't matter how tight his coverage is if the WR he's covering consistently catches the ball anyways? That is not good enough coverage.

Maybe he will learn to get his head turned around and pick up the flight of the ball quicker as time goes on so he can make plays but that remains to be seen. The odds are against him though.

Wilhite was by far our worst CB this season...

 

[Jangles]

as a whole?

somewhere between average and poop

 

[BillBelichickFan79]

These expectations for a 4th round pick in 2008 are absurd. Samuel didn't come in an play like a Pro Bowler immediately even with a better pass rush. Butler got chopped up on occasion like when they consistently picked on him in the Miami game.

There are many things to like about Wilhite and I can see why Bill drafted him. He's great at staying with his guy in man to man coverage due to his very fluid hips. However, he doesn't locate the ball well in coverage and often has his back to the QB. A lot of CB's have these issues early on. With some good coaching he'll be able to improve and hopefully become more of a ball hawk. He had his ups and downs just like a lot of young corners. Guys like Revis and Hall didn't come into the league and have immediate succss. Revis actually had the same problem that Wilhite had where he'd stick with his guy very well but would give up a lot of catches b/c he didn't locate the ball. Obviously Revis has worked and improved on that and become the best CB in the league. I'm not saying WIlhite is going to be Revis. But I do see a lot of potential in the kid.

I think he's going to put the work in this offseason and come back and take a big step forward in 2010. I expect him to silence a lot of his critics, especially with a (hopefully) better pass rush.

 

[Kontradiction]

If Butler realizes his potential this year and we're able to retain Bodden, then we have a pretty solid CB corps. Butler as a true #1, Bodden as a true #2, and either one of Wilhite or Wheatley in as the nickel corner. Personally, I think Springs is gone next season. If he isn't, and everything above comes to fruition, our CB corps is that much stronger. Our secondary can stand to improve still (outside of the safeties), but it's the front seven that this team should be concerned about headed into free agency and the draft.

 

[Patspsycho]

I would be real happy if Springs was gone. He can go join AD wherever he ends up.

 

[nashvillepatsfan]

These expectations for a 4th round pick in 2008 are absurd. Samuel didn't come in an play like a Pro Bowler immediately even with a better pass rush. Butler got chopped up on occasion like when they consistently picked on him in the Miami game.

There are many things to like about Wilhite and I can see why Bill drafted him. He's great at staying with his guy in man to man coverage due to his very fluid hips. However, he doesn't locate the ball well in coverage and often has his back to the QB. A lot of CB's have these issues early on. With some good coaching he'll be able to improve and hopefully become more of a ball hawk. He had his ups and downs just like a lot of young corners. Guys like Revis and Hall didn't come into the league and have immediate succss. Revis actually had the same problem that Wilhite had where he'd stick with his guy very well but would give up a lot of catches b/c he didn't locate the ball. Obviously Revis has worked and improved on that and become the best CB in the league. I'm not saying WIlhite is going to be Revis. But I do see a lot of potential in the kid.

I think he's going to put the work in this offseason and come back and take a big step forward in 2010. I expect him to silence a lot of his critics, especially with a (hopefully) better pass rush.

:yeahthat:

Im not sure why, but im a little shocked at all the "Wilhite sucks" comments. These are probably the same people who said Assante sucked in his 2nd year, then 2 years later were screaming for Bill to cough up 6mil a year for the guy. Bottom line, give the guy some more time, and he could really be a great corner. If he puts in the effort, and learns to locate the ball, I see him being very good.

 

[Steamer86]

they need to re-sign Bodden, they can't keep going in to the draft every year takeing a CB on the first day. there are to many holes on this team to keep fixing the same spot over and over again.


Shawn Springs, will be 35 nuff said.



wilhite, gets burned to much to be a nickel back



Terrence Wheatley, is not even wort talking about


butler. may step up and be the #1 or #2 next year if not he is no worst then a good nickel back.


IMO butler is going to be great next year. and if Bodden, is back with a real pass rush dose 2 will be fun to watch. but the rest of the guys are all ? they can use some more dept at CB maybe sign a JAG and a 4th round pick.

I agree - can't keep going into drafts and using the early picks on d-backs (merriweather, chung, wheatley, butler....). when we were at best we were using those picks on Warren, Wilfork, Seymour.....need to keep drafting a stud DL, OL or OLB early every year - need the big uglies...finally looks like we hit with SeaBass, but Brace may have been a reach.....let's hope a full year of working out NFL style has him ready to contribute. When teams pick DB and WR (see Detroit) every year, they start getting soft.

 

[BillBelichickFan79]

:yeahthat:

Im not sure why, but im a little shocked at all the "Wilhite sucks" comments. These are probably the same people who said Assante sucked in his 2nd year, then 2 years later were screaming for Bill to cough up 6mil a year for the guy. Bottom line, give the guy some more time, and he could really be a great corner. If he puts in the effort, and learns to locate the ball, I see him being very good.

Couldn't agree with you more. I really like Wilhite as a prospect and I think he's going to have a very good 2010 and surprise a lot of people on this board. Once he learns to locate the ball and stops getting caught with his back to the QB, I think he will be a great corner for us.

I equated it to the maturation process of Revis because I live in NY and see many Jets games in person and on TV. Revis had the same issue early in his career where he stayed with the WR's easily but didn't locate the ball well. Obviously he has worked on and fixed this. Hopefully Wilhite can do the same. I'm not comparing Wilhite's pure skill level to Revis, but pointing out that even the best CB in the league struggled in the same area early in his career.

 

[mayoclinic]

:yeahthat:

Im not sure why, but im a little shocked at all the "Wilhite sucks" comments. These are probably the same people who said Assante sucked in his 2nd year, then 2 years later were screaming for Bill to cough up 6mil a year for the guy. Bottom line, give the guy some more time, and he could really be a great corner. If he puts in the effort, and learns to locate the ball, I see him being very good.

I agree with you to a large extent. Particularly early in the year, I thought Wilhite was getting good coverage even when he got beat. Against the Colts, for example, he got beat twice for TDs in which he had excellent coverage on his man, but Manning made a perfect throw and the receiver made a great catch. I can't fault him for that.

Later in the year he seemed to develop "Maroney syndrome" and seemed a little shell-shocked. Perhaps his confidence had taken a hit. But I wouldn't give up on him this soon, by any means.

 

[upstater1]

These expectations for a 4th round pick in 2008 are absurd. Samuel didn't come in an play like a Pro Bowler immediately even with a better pass rush. Butler got chopped up on occasion like when they consistently picked on him in the Miami game.

There are many things to like about Wilhite and I can see why Bill drafted him. He's great at staying with his guy in man to man coverage due to his very fluid hips. However, he doesn't locate the ball well in coverage and often has his back to the QB. A lot of CB's have these issues early on. With some good coaching he'll be able to improve and hopefully become more of a ball hawk. He had his ups and downs just like a lot of young corners. Guys like Revis and Hall didn't come into the league and have immediate succss. Revis actually had the same problem that Wilhite had where he'd stick with his guy very well but would give up a lot of catches b/c he didn't locate the ball. Obviously Revis has worked and improved on that and become the best CB in the league. I'm not saying WIlhite is going to be Revis. But I do see a lot of potential in the kid.

I think he's going to put the work in this offseason and come back and take a big step forward in 2010. I expect him to silence a lot of his critics, especially with a (hopefully) better pass rush.

Son you think Wilhite has more hope than Butler?

Butler got taken to task early in the first half of the Miami game, but in the second half, they threw at him 10 times and he batted down 5 of them, and not a single one was completed. He actually knocked down 4 straight passes on 4 straight plays at one point over two series. And then on the final time they threw at him (the 11th) he gave up a 10 yard first down to Hartline on the sidelines.