How about Cassel for Julius Peppers - My Speculation [merged]

[Box_O_Rocks]

Re: How about Cassel For Julius Peppers - My Speculation

Tom Ashworth and Brandon Gorin send their regards.

 

[Deus Irae]

Re: How about Cassel For Julius Peppers - My Speculation

We didn't get much of a pass rush this season.

I have hopes for Guyton as well on the inside.

1.) Vrabel was injured

2.) Thomas was injured and missed a bunch of games

3.) Pass rush was put on the back burner due to the poor secondary

4.) New England likes to blitz with the ILBs on occasion too, as Bruschi used to do in the past, but that's something that's not really been in the playbook in the past couple of years.

5.) I'm still very wary of Guyton, because he was poor against the run and, frequently, not all that much better against the pass.

 

[billdog3484]

Re: How about Cassel For Julius Peppers - My Speculation

New England needs an ILB starter this year, not an OLB. Vrabel and Thomas are the starters on the outside.

we do have a bunch of draft picks, and historically you can obtain pretty good ILB's in the first and second rounds

 

[Deus Irae]

Re: How about Cassel For Julius Peppers - My Speculation

we do have a bunch of draft picks, and historically you can obtain pretty good ILB's in the first and second rounds

Then why bother overspending on Peppers?

 

[carolinatony]

Re: How about Cassel For Julius Peppers - My Speculation

NO WAY!
Keep Seymour
I watch him every week and he takes too many games off.
PLEASE PASS

 

[condon84]

Re: How about Cassel For Julius Peppers - My Speculation

Love the idea.

Peppers could play OLB. We could move Vrabel or AD inside (preferrebly Vrabel) since both can play that position. We'd have Peppers and AD at OLB and Mayo and Vrabel at ILB in our base 3-4 defense.

For anyone saying Peppers is too big for OLB, keep in mind that AD is 6-2 270 lbs. Peppers is 6-7, 283 lbs and can move. He's got quick feet and I think can play in pass coverage if he needs to (extremely wide wingspan). He was ahtletic enough to play basketball for North Carolina hoops so I don't question his athleticism.

This sounds almost too perfect for both sides so it probably won't happen. Then again, I never thought Randy Moss would become a Patriot so who knows.

 

[Fencer]

Re: How about Cassel For Julius Peppers - My Speculation

This is the exact role I was thinking!

He is very fast for his size. Extremely athletic.

I don't think he would do well as a 3-4 end. Holding the point of attack would be a waist of his types of talents, and I'm not even sure he could do it.

In fact, I just assumed he would be looking to make the transition when I read he wanted to play in a 3/4.

I realize there is a risk, but what the hey, it's the offseason.

OK. That's more interesting.

But for the whole thing to be worth the investment, it involves a LOT of position flexibility. E.g.,

1. Thomas playing some inside.
2. Peppers and Seymour as 3rd-down DL in a 2-4-5
3. Peppers taking some reps as a rotational 3-4 DE despite lacking the size, ala Jarvis Green.

Anyhow, we don't have the cap room to add a player that expensive without painfully letting others walk within a year -- unless the uncapped year kicks in, of course.

 

[Deus Irae]

Re: How about Cassel For Julius Peppers - My Speculation

Love the idea.

Peppers could play OLB. We could move Vrabel or AD inside (preferrebly Vrabel) since both can play that position. We'd have Peppers and AD at OLB and Mayo and Vrabel at ILB in our base 3-4 defense.

For anyone saying Peppers is too big for OLB, keep in mind that AD is 6-2 270 lbs. Peppers is 6-7, 283 lbs and can move. He's got quick feet and I think can play in pass coverage if he needs to (extremely wide wingspan). He was ahtletic enough to play basketball for North Carolina hoops so I don't question his athleticism.

This sounds almost too perfect for both sides so it probably won't happen. Then again, I never thought Randy Moss would become a Patriot so who knows.

1.) Vrabel is nowhere near as good a player when he goes inside

2.) Vrabel has made it clear that he doesn't particularly like playing inside

 

[Disco Volante]

Re: How about Cassel For Julius Peppers - My Speculation

Seward still available?

 

[condon84]

Re: How about Cassel For Julius Peppers - My Speculation

1.) Vrabel is nowhere near as good a player when he goes inside

2.) Vrabel has made it clear that he doesn't particularly like playing inside

1. Vrabel WAS a better OLB but he seems to have slowed down and no longer posses the quickness to get around the edge to apply constant pressure. Vrabel's got the strength to play inside and his decreasing speed won't hinder him as it does outside.

2. Vrabel is a good soldier and if Bill asks him to play inside, he'd do it. You could put Thomas back inside, and keep Vrabel outside, but IMO, if this were to happen, Vrabel inside with Mayo and Thomas outside with Peppers is the best way to maximize production.

 

[MassPats38]

Re: How about Cassel For Julius Peppers - My Speculation

That also assumes the Panthers would want Cassel. Delhomme is not exactly Rex Grossman. He has about an 85 rating career, an 85 rating this year, and played well in 6 of 8 career playoff games (with career playoff states made substantially worse by 1 incredibly bad game this year). I guess Delhomme is getting a little long in the tooth as a starting QB at 33 so that may prompt a search for a younger QB, but I wouldn't expect a much higher return than those numbers from Cassel in a new system. His numbers may well be worse.

As for Peppers, he is taller than both Warren and Seymour and significantly lighter. In fact, he is 5 inches taller than Adalius and listed as 13 pounds heavier. If he said he was looking to play in a 3-4 scheme, I would be amazed if he meant conversion to LB. He is probably too light to hold a point of attack like Seymour and Warren, and at the price tag he will carry a pretty expensive LB conversion project assuming he would want to do so. Maybe he could add some weight and move into a Seymour-type role, but would he be as effective at that weight? Who knows.

It would seem like a fairly unwise business decision on both sides.

 

[Deus Irae]

Re: How about Cassel For Julius Peppers - My Speculation

1. Vrabel WAS a better OLB but he seems to have slowed down and no longer posses the quickness to get around the edge to apply constant pressure. Vrabel's got the strength to play inside and his decreasing speed won't hinder him as it does outside.

Vrabel didn't look much, if any, slower in coverage last season than he did the season before. Where he looked as if he had 'declined' was in the physicality department, which is precisely what a bum shoulder would do, and is also precisely what's called for in an ILB.

2. Vrabel is a good soldier and if Bill asks him to play inside, he'd do it. You could put Thomas back inside, and keep Vrabel outside, but IMO, if this were to happen, Vrabel inside with Mayo and Thomas outside with Peppers is the best way to maximize production.

Both Vrabel and Thomas have been much better players on the outside during their careers. Why on earth would you think it a good idea to move one inside, where he's a lesser player, to bring in a project player making $10+ million a year?

 

[condon84]

Re: How about Cassel For Julius Peppers - My Speculation

Vrabel didn't look much, if any, slower in coverage last season than he did the season before. Where he looked as if he had 'declined' was in the physicality department, which is precisely what a bum shoulder would do, and is also precisely what's called for in an ILB.

Vrabel did not show the same speed to get around the edge to apply pressure. That's what we need and that's what Peppers can bring.

Both Vrabel and Thomas have been much better players on the outside during their careers. Why on earth would you think it a good idea to move one inside, where he's a lesser player, to bring in a project player making $10+ million a year?

Agreed that both Vrabel and Thomas are better OLBs, but Bill has shown that he'll put the best LBs out there. Thomas was played inside his first year because the best group of LBs we could put out there was Bruschi, Thomas, Vrabel and Colvin. I'm sure Thomas wanted to play outside, but Bill convinced him that was best for the team.

Also, this debate is stipulated that Bill wants Peppers.

 

[PittPatriot]

Re: How about Cassel For Julius Peppers - My Speculation

I have followed Julius Peppers since his Freshman year at UNC. The kid may be the greatest athlete I have seen. The 2000 Final Four team would have gotten killed inside had it not been for Peppers. What he gave up in inches to other ACC bigs he made up for with strength, speed, agility, toughness, and heart.

I have always been intrigued by the possibility of him being converted to an OLB in a 3-4. He has the physical attributes to become THE dominant player at that position. If he can handle the Carolina playbook as a freshman, I think he is mature enough to make the conversion into an intricate system like ours.

 

[ALP]

Re: How about Cassel For Julius Peppers - My Speculation

i understand that he would LIKe to play in a 3-4...but that doesnt mean he CAN

 

[carolinatony]

Re: How about Cassel For Julius Peppers - My Speculation

The man is invisable in some game. Not worth the $$$$$

 

[SHOWTIME15]

Re: How about Cassel for Julius Peppers - My Speculation

peppers is an UFA. he wants out of carolina, and chances are that the panthers are going to let him walk. otherwise, they'd risk losing JOrdan Gross too who's an UFA.

therefore, i'd wait until peppers is free to sign with anyone. then we can trade cassell for picks. we can have our cake and eat it too.

 

[Gridiron Renegade]

Re: How about Cassel For Julius Peppers - My Speculation

New England needs an ILB starter this year, not an OLB. Vrabel and Thomas are the starters on the outside.

Vrabel would move to ILB. Peppers and Thomas would be on the outside, and the Pats can draft someone at OLB this year for the future. This would also buy Guyton time to really learn the system as the Pats will have Vrabel, Bruschi, and Mayo at ILB.

Its definitely something that Belichick has to think about and explore.

 

[billdog3484]

Re: How about Cassel For Julius Peppers - My Speculation

Then why bother overspending on Peppers?

well, im not saying i would, but when you think about it. if he were able to transition into a 3-4 OLB, he could potentially be the best pass rushing olb since LT. i dont know if hes as athletic as LT to play out in coverage, but he could sure get to the QB. i personally doubt it will happen, but you have to at least think having peppers on the outside is intriguing

 

[DaBruinz]

Re: How about Cassel For Julius Peppers - My Speculation

Who would you let go to make room for him -- Seymour?

Cutting Seymour only clears about 3 million in cap space. And there is no need to CUT anyone.