How About A Wide Receiver at 22

[VJCPatriot]

The problem then is if Moss is gone after 2010 then you're counting on a rookie to replace him. If you think Thomas is a #1 potential WR, even if he's not Green or Jones of 2011, I'd take him here and have him a year in when Moss is gone.

If you correctly drafted a stud WR in the 1st round of 2011 he should be able to contribute right away. There's no difference in drafting him a year earlier or in 2011.

And don't forget that we'd still have the guy we drafted in round 2 of the 2010 draft to play a 'Deion Branch' role, plus we'd have a healthy Welker, a more mature Edelman, and perhaps a blossoming Brandon Tate. The Pats did WIN a couple of superbowls with a Deion Branch type playing 1st fiddle and nobody the caliber of Welker playing 2nd fiddle.

 

[bbell31]

Vollmer has the chance to be a HOF tackle. Oher has the chance to make a handful of pro-bowls. There is no tackle drafted in the past three years I would rather have than Vollmer.

I think your on to something, although i wish he was a couple years younger in his debut as a pat

 

[bbell31]

2011 is a MUCH better year for wide receivers. If you want to spend a 1st round pick for a WR stud, save it for then. In 2010, I just want to stop the bleeding and get a competent #2. Damian Williams or someone of his caliber should be able to step in and do that in round 2.

The Pats need a Deion Branch type from the 2010 draft, not a Randy Moss because... we still have Randy Moss. We can go fishing for a #1 type in 2011 when there will be a lot more studs to try to reel in.

dude we have like a zillion number '2's'-welker, edelman, tate, aiken, slater, if you can run fast, good routes, and can catch the dam$ ball then it duznt matter and they all can do that. i dont understand a number 2, 3, 4 receiver completely. a number 1 yes but there is no difference in 2-whatever to me. just the way i c it. Now a number one is obvious, fitz, andre johnson, moss, rice, marshall, t.o., etc...alot of our problem is pass pro breakdown, bad te hands, and brady making bad throws or reads. Well, last year that was the case.

 

[VJCPatriot]

dude we have like a zillion number '2's'-welker, edelman, tate, aiken, slater, if you can run fast, good routes, and can catch the dam$ ball then it duznt matter and they all can do that. i dont understand a number 2, 3, 4 receiver completely. a number 1 yes but there is no difference in 2-whatever to me. just the way i c it. Now a number one is obvious, fitz, andre johnson, moss, rice, marshall, t.o., etc...alot of our problem is pass pro breakdown, bad te hands, and brady making bad throws or reads. Well, last year that was the case.

And who stepped up to fill the void when Welker went down? This offense sputtered badly once that happened and the Pats got routed by the Ravens last time I checked.

I really don't see your point. You disagree with me that we shouldn't spend a 1st round pick on a WR?

 

[jeffbiologist]

Vollmer has the chance to be a HOF tackle. Oher has the chance to make a handful of pro-bowls. There is no tackle drafted in the past three years I would rather have than Vollmer.

I would have to say Clady, Jake Long and Joe Thomas are far better than Vollmer on his best day. He will be lucky to make a pro bowl with such Ts in the AFC no matter how good he is. He is a decent player but he couldnt beat out Matt frigin Light last year....

 

[bbell31]

And who stepped up to fill the void when Welker went down? This offense sputtered badly once that happened and the Pats got routed by the Ravens last time I checked.

I really don't see your point. You disagree with me that we shouldn't spend a 1st round pick on a WR?

brady, oline, oc, and te's are more to blame than any of the wr's..if your wanting to point fingers at a wr then it should be randy moss with his occasional slacking and poor arse run blocking...the only way i would pick a wr in the first would be if dez bryant fell to us and thats a huge maybe...demaryius would be a real nice gamble at 44 bc of his potential 1 wr status with his size, speed, hands, and he's prolly a solid run blocker but at 22 theres no way im intrigued by a wr pick, and def wouldnt think it would be the organizations wisest decision for the team. my opinion and i stand by it strongly.

 

[jays52]

I would have to say Clady, Jake Long and Joe Thomas are far better than Vollmer on his best day. He will be lucky to make a pro bowl with such Ts in the AFC no matter how good he is. He is a decent player but he couldnt beat out Matt frigin Light last year....

Why? Because Clady zone blocked in a three step drop scheme? Because Long had chip help in his first year of pass pro? Is it because Thomas got the hype of a 3rd overall while blocking a short drop, vanilla, minimal WR screen O that didn't challenge his legit athleticism? Or is it because the so called experts who never played a meaningful down told you to think that?

I know my football, dude. When I saw Vollmer workout for the first time, I had a top 5 grade on him. This was after he was drafted, of course, but it was a legit grade. Let's watch his career play out before we cite relative studs. If Vollmer played in the SEC or Big 10, he would have gone top 5. Disagree? I'm sure you will. Let's just wait until all the careers are over until we question the dude.

 

[bbell31]

Why? Because Clady zone blocked in a three step drop scheme? Because Long had chip help in his first year of pass pro? Or is it because the so called experts who never played a meaningful down told you to think that?

I know my football, dude. When I saw Vollmer workout for the first time, I had a top 5 grade on him. This was after he was drafted, of course, but it was a legit grade. Let's watch his career play out before we cite relative studs. If Vollmer played in the SEC or Big 10, he would have gone top 5. Disagree? I'm sure you will. Let's just wait until all the careers are over until we question the dude.

wouldnt it be amazin if we picked veldheer and he had the same potential as vollmer..finally send kaczur walkin his overpaid, overrated hind end 2 the chiefs or something.

 

[jeffbiologist]

And who stepped up to fill the void when Welker went down? This offense sputtered badly once that happened and the Pats got routed by the Ravens last time I checked.

I really don't see your point. You disagree with me that we shouldn't spend a 1st round pick on a WR?

Filled the void when Welker went down? Like in game 2, Edleman's 2nd game EVER as a WR, he had about 100 yds right? He went down again in the last game of the year and we played how many games after that? 1? And that game we were down by 24 in the first half right?? Maybe that has something to do with the defense?? Maybe you want to spend the first rd pick on D?? The other thing is contract status...Moss is ending, Welker is hurt, Tate should be ready and we did spend a 3rd on him last year....and we still had Galloway and Lewis on the roster so he wasnt even supposed to contribute at all, redshirt if you would. He and Edleman need time to develop. If you draft a WR #1 you are basically giving up on Tate, wasting another draft pick. Do we need another WR? Sure, but a vet coming in on a 1 yr "prove it" deal makes much more sense. Vet WRs will continue to get cut right up to June, all we need is a servicable #3 with upside and he and Tate can compete for #2. Dont get me wrong, next year we will be looking for another #1 but we have another #1 next year to worry about that....and I really think if Randy has a good year fences will mend and he will be back. Anyone really have doubts about Randy Moss in a CONTRACT YEAR?? Please!

 

[BelichickFan]

If you correctly drafted a stud WR in the 1st round of 2011 he should be able to contribute right away. There's no difference in drafting him a year earlier or in 2011.

I don't think anyone seriously believes that a rookie vs. a second year player makes "no difference". The timeline for replacing Moss highly favors it happening this year vs. next.

If you want to argue that Thomas is a reach at #22 and you like someone else at #22 + WR with Raider pick next year as opposed to Thomas and someone else with the Raider pick next year, I can see that argument.

 

[jeffbiologist]

Why? Because Clady zone blocked in a three step drop scheme? Because Long had chip help in his first year of pass pro? Is it because Thomas got the hype of a 3rd overall while blocking a short drop, vanilla, minimal WR screen O that didn't challenge his legit athleticism? Or is it because the so called experts who never played a meaningful down told you to think that?

I know my football, dude. When I saw Vollmer workout for the first time, I had a top 5 grade on him. This was after he was drafted, of course, but it was a legit grade. Let's watch his career play out before we cite relative studs. If Vollmer played in the SEC or Big 10, he would have gone top 5. Disagree? I'm sure you will. Let's just wait until all the careers are over until we question the dude.

I only have 2 words for you...Matt Light. Close the door on the way out, LMAO!

 

[Nonentity]

Filled the void when Welker went down? Like in game 2, Edleman's 2nd game EVER as a WR, he had about 100 yds right? He went down again in the last game of the year and we played how many games after that? 1? And that game we were down by 24 in the first half right?? Maybe that has something to do with the defense?? Maybe you want to spend the first rd pick on D?? The other thing is contract status...Moss is ending, Welker is hurt, Tate should be ready and we did spend a 3rd on him last year....and we still had Galloway and Lewis on the roster so he wasnt even supposed to contribute at all, redshirt if you would. He and Edleman need time to develop. If you draft a WR #1 you are basically giving up on Tate, wasting another draft pick. Do we need another WR? Sure, but a vet coming in on a 1 yr "prove it" deal makes much more sense. Vet WRs will continue to get cut right up to June, all we need is a servicable #3 with upside and he and Tate can compete for #2. Dont get me wrong, next year we will be looking for another #1 but we have another #1 next year to worry about that....and I really think if Randy has a good year fences will mend and he will be back. Anyone really have doubts about Randy Moss in a CONTRACT YEAR?? Please!

WR was a hole last year, it hasn't been filled, so it's still a hole this year.

If this is Randy Moss's last year with the Patriots, we need to have someone ready to step into the breach in 2011. Last year he had 83 receptions for 1264 yards with 13 TDs. If we don't have him in the team, it's a huge void which we would find very very hard to fill.

Veteran free agents? It's a crapshoot, you've got to be very lucky. We don't run a simple route tree, I get the impression it's all option routes based entirely on how the defense is reacting as the play unfolds. Which is why Joey Galloway busted here - all he understood was running pre-set deep routes and not adjusting on his way down the field. That was a 1 year "prove it" deal, and it lasted 3 games into a 16 game season.

Randy Moss in a contract year? What if his back goes on him again, like it did last year?

You then said that if we draft a #1 WR, we are giving up on Tate. That's not true at all. We run a 3 receiver offense - think of the Cardinals (Fitzgerald/Boldin/Breaston) as an good comparator. The Colts almost run a 4 receiver offense because Dallas Clark releases down the field more often than he stays into block - Wayne/Collie/Clark/Garcon.

Who did we have last season? Randy Moss at flanker running deep routes, Wes Welker in the slot running short routes and at split end....who? No-one.

Yes, it could be Tate. I would love it to be Tate. He fits the bill for a No. 2 receiver. I love the pick and I love his potential. But he's never taken a NFL snap and we need to have a contingency plan. The Saints proved that if you find a way to double Moss AND Welker, you can make our offense look totally impotent.

I only have 2 words for you...Matt Light. Close the door on the way out, LMAO!

This doesn't even make sense.

 

[VJCPatriot]

I think some people are misreading what I'm typing. I've been saying all along that I don't think we need to spend a 1st to get a good receiver in the 2010 draft. Then I have two different people ranting at me about how we don't need a receiver. Are you guys honestly saying the Patriots don't need another receiver in this year's draft AT ALL?

If that's the case then I completely disagree. Have you guys perhaps watched this years Superbowl AT ALL? To recap, the two teams that made it to the Big Dance had the most explosive passing offenses in the National Football League. Their WR cores were deep and able to make plays at any time. You couldn't shut down any single WR, because the 3rd and 4th and maybe even 5th options all could make plays. The Saints and Colts had the deepest and most talented wide receiver groups in the NFL and the NFL has become a Passing league. Last years Superbowl was proof of that.

In my opinion, there are two main ways to win based on the most recent of championship games - 1) build a juggernaut passing offense that can't be shut down or 2) build a stud defense that can shut down the passing game or at least contain it and force turnovers or 3) do both of the above.

I think the Saints offense and defense were best on Super Sunday. And their coach also had the balls and creativity to make some big calls. Brees also had a lights out performance but he couldn't have done what he did without the receivers that he had. (And yes of course his OL played well, that goes without saying).

 

[BritPat]

Number of Superbowls won by the Pats with an average D and superstar wideouts - zero.
Number of Superbowls won by the Pats with a top class D and average wideouts - three.

Spend the #22 pick on D please.

I think there's much better value further down for wide receivers.

 

[Ochmed Jones]

A) I presume Odrick is gone, otherwise, I expect us to jump at the chance to get him.

B) While we ABSOLUTELY need an OLB, I suspect that those available at 44 may be as good prospects as those available at 22.

C) We could certainly trade down if Odrick and the blue-chippers are gone.
========

D) I would certainly be fine if we drafted Bryant, Thomas or Tate at 22.

This is an intriguing possibility. WR is a need position and a three down is a possibility. My thinking is if we trade down 3-7 spots and pick up a third, then WR makes more sense in the first round.

 

[mgteich]

Consider a 2010 wide receiver corps of
Moss, Branch, Thomas/Bryant/Tate, Edelman, Tate

We would also be fine going into 2011.

This would NOT be using a lot of resources, just one of our first four draft choices. Add Hughes, Gerhart and Carrington in the second and we'd be in reasonable shape.

This is an intriguing possibility. WR is a need position and a three down is a possibility. My thinking is if we trade down 3-7 spots and pick up a third, then WR makes more sense in the first round.

 

[HarkDawg]

BB likes TE's @ 1.




JERMAINE GRESHAM...... could he be our 1?

 

[Kontradiction]

I would love to see Golden Tate at #22. The kid is smart and versatile. He can line up out of the backfield, split wide, or in the slot and would cause a lot of match-up problems for opposing defenses. He's also played in our type of system before. The only thing that worries me is that Kansas City just might take him with their first round pick (despite the fact that they have more problems outside of the receiver position). If they don't, I can easily see him falling to us at #22.

 

[TriplecHamp]

Number of Superbowls won by the Pats with an average D and superstar wideouts - zero.
Number of Superbowls won by the Pats with a top class D and average wideouts - three.

Spend the #22 pick on D please.

I think there's much better value further down for wide receivers.

The Steelers are the only team thats won with a Great D and average wideouts, the NFL is changing to a league where you want your D to complement the offense. I however do agree that Defense should be first but two guys who I wouldnt mind being selected with 22 or a small trade-up are Dez Bryant and CJ Spiller and of course an OT.

 

[HarkDawg]

I would love to see Golden Tate at #22. The kid is smart and versatile. He can line up out of the backfield, split wide, or in the slot and would cause a lot of match-up problems for opposing defenses. He's also played in our type of system before. The only thing that worries me is that Kansas City just might take him with their first round pick (despite the fact that they have more problems outside of the receiver position). If they don't, I can easily see him falling to us at #22.

I would be shocked.... if KC passes over him.
Cassel plus promising WR= must get
not too mention the hard on Weis has for Goldy