Honest evaluation of the Pats D

[D-Money]

Especially if we play zone.Eventually the holes will open up with all that time.I hope with all this experience they start playing some man to man defense.

 

[andrewgarrr]

Good post. And saying the Pats DBs suck and "can't cover" isn't really a fair assessment. IMO the poor pass defense has more to do with a lack of pass rush and the scheme more than anythings else.

Arrington had a tough time with Wayne, but I've noticed that the Patriots get "exposed" when linebackers and safeties are matched up man-to-man against speedy tight-ends and third/fourth wide receivers.

For the most part I think we can keep Holmes and Edwards quiet, but Keller might be a match-up problem for our defensive personnel.

 

[D-Money]

Butler's play is not helping a well.Butler needs to step it up.

 

[vyrago]

I am reading some of the posts about the Patriots defense and I think I am reading about a reincarnation the 1985 Bears.

Where on this board are you seeing this? All I read is this team can't stop anyone. The defense is the epitome of suckitude. They are an embarrassment.

 

[FloridaPatsFan]

I think the biggest difference between this defense and previous Patriot defenses is the weakness at linebacker...

Now before you get all pissed off....hear me out....

Spikes, Mayo, Guyton, Banta-Cain have been doing about as much as we can expect from them at this point of their careers....and they are going to get MUCH better....but they are still developing as players

Belichicks 3-4 defenses are based on the play at the linebacker position. They are very much the catalysts for how good the defense is going to be. When we had Bruschi and Vrabel..they were litterally Coaches on the field.

I see this group as lacking the kind of football sense that Bruschi and Vrabel had. You could hear them calling out the plays before the snap....and they were often right. And although, like this group, they would sometimes give up a lot of yardage...they would tighten up in the red zone...and were great at preventing touchdowns.

The problem I see with this group is that while excellent athletes and football players...they need more than Wilfork as a leader and theyre red zone defense needs a lot of work.

 

[RodThePat]

Agreed. The defense executed the game-plan in the Steelers game and in the Colts game (giving up the long run to Brown was the only serious mistake). If anything the offense is at fault for the "near collapse" in the fourth quarter of the Colts game, they couldn't sustain a long enough drive to keep Manning off the field (however, I still blame the no PI call on Branch). Even in the Jets game, the offensive turnovers broke the defense's back. People want to blame everything on the defense, but football is a team sport. The offense needs to compliment the defense and vice versa.

Yeah, the offense is at fault for letting Manning drive right down the field 3 times in 9 minutes. So what you are saying is that unless we never punt we can't blame the defense for almost costing us the game? The offense had been outstanding up until that point. They punt twice and the defense ****s the bed and all of a sudden the blame falls on them? That's pretty unfair.

 

[zipster9]

Arrington had a tough time with Wayne, but I've noticed that the Patriots get "exposed" when linebackers and safeties are matched up man-to-man against speedy tight-ends and third/fourth wide receivers.

For the most part I think we can keep Holmes and Edwards quiet, but Keller might be a match-up problem for our defensive personnel.

Out D-line seems to fizzle in the 4th quarter. You cannot assume that our CB will bail out the D-line, with picks. Sooner or later, we'll get burned by the laxed-play of the D-line in the late minutes... I would like the DC to change and call more blitz-plays come the 4th quarter.

 

[ATippett56]

I am reading some of the posts about the Patriots defense and I think I am reading about a reincarnation the 1985 Bears.

Where? Please show me?

Felger is getting slammed for being critical about their play and people are comparing McCourty and Chung to Law and Milloy.

A little premature comparing McCourty and Chung to Law and Milloy and to what year, 2001 perhaps?

Based on what I have seen this season, the Patriots D is definitely a liability. Teams are able to move the ball and score points against them fairly easily. However, I have seen some positive signs in terms of the number of turnovers and the ability to stop the run in critical situations.

The Patriots defense is a liability:

FOOTBALL OUTSIDERS: Innovative Statistics, Intelligent Analysis | 2010 DEFENSIVE EFFICIENCY RATINGS

 

[ausbacker]

In a word improving.

 

[DaBruinz]

We can't rush the passer and we can't cover the middle of the field. That's pretty much it.

Ben "I should be on the Sexual Predator Registry" Roethlingsberger would beg to differ with you. The 5 sacks he took were because of the PASS RUSH.

The Pats actually cover the middle of the field fairly well. What people like yourself discount is the offensive players. I bet you don't give any credit to Manning for his absolutely perfect passes to Blair White, do you?

The Pats are playing a version of the bend, don't break. The league features much more passing than it did 5 years ago. And the Pats have an extremely young defense. And they have gotten better, whether people want to believe it or not.

This team is in the "home" stretch to the play-offs. It's also when they face two of the tougher teams in the league in the Jets and Packers. But, make no mistake. This is not the same team that lined up against the Jets in Week 2. The offense is much more dynamic. The defense is playing with confidence despite the mistakes. And the defense is forcing the other team into mistakes.

Seriously. How many games have the Steelers won when Big Ben has taken 5 sacks? How many times has Peyton Manning thrown 3 picks in a single game?

People say that the Pats don't have a pass rush but they are the same ones that seem to think that the number of sacks is indicative of the pass rush and it's not. I really wish the NFL had the number of QB pressures kept as a stat because the one thing I continue to see each week since Cleveland, is constant pressure on the QB. Not every time is ending in an incompletion, interception or sack, but that speaks more to the level of competition they are playing and the youth of the defense than it does anything else.

 

[Ring 6]

Ben "I should be on the Sexual Predator Registry" Roethlingsberger would beg to differ with you. The 5 sacks he took were because of the PASS RUSH.

The Pats actually cover the middle of the field fairly well. What people like yourself discount is the offensive players. I bet you don't give any credit to Manning for his absolutely perfect passes to Blair White, do you?

The Pats are playing a version of the bend, don't break. The league features much more passing than it did 5 years ago. And the Pats have an extremely young defense. And they have gotten better, whether people want to believe it or not.

This team is in the "home" stretch to the play-offs. It's also when they face two of the tougher teams in the league in the Jets and Packers. But, make no mistake. This is not the same team that lined up against the Jets in Week 2. The offense is much more dynamic. The defense is playing with confidence despite the mistakes. And the defense is forcing the other team into mistakes.

Seriously. How many games have the Steelers won when Big Ben has taken 5 sacks? How many times has Peyton Manning thrown 3 picks in a single game?

People say that the Pats don't have a pass rush but they are the same ones that seem to think that the number of sacks is indicative of the pass rush and it's not. I really wish the NFL had the number of QB pressures kept as a stat because the one thing I continue to see each week since Cleveland, is constant pressure on the QB. Not every time is ending in an incompletion, interception or sack, but that speaks more to the level of competition they are playing and the youth of the defense than it does anything else.

What the Patriots are doing is playing a very conservative style of defense.
Because of this they are not giving up big plays, and because of that they are more susceptible to the routine play being executed against them.
BB has always believed that the best way to win football games is to not shoot yourself in the foot by being too aggressive and to do the things your players can do well.
We do not have players that are good pass rushers. If we rely on rushing the passer, we will give up huge plays. Instead, we rely on zone coverage, that requires the other team to execute very well, and puts our guys in a tougher position to defend a well executed play, but in a good position to capitalize on the other teams mistakes.
The amount of Ints, tipped passes in copverage, and receivers hit while catching the ball is higher than ever, because the defense is adapting to this scheme.
We will successfully rush the passer when our guys beat the man blocking them.
Scheming to get more pass rush means scheming to have less coverage and fewer tacklers after the catch. It suicide to blitz ineffective pass rushers.

 

[Brady2Welker]

My theory on the fourth quarter:


We use our 'bigs' to pass rush. Who commands double teams? Guys like Wright and Wilfork. Being that size and being forced to play that much has really gassed them. And once their push is gone, all teams have to worry about is two 'meh' OLBs.

 

[Ring 6]

My theory on the fourth quarter:


We use our 'bigs' to pass rush. Who commands double teams? Guys like Wright and Wilfork. Being that size and being forced to play that much has really gassed them. And once their push is gone, all teams have to worry about is two 'meh' OLBs.

None of our DLman play an inordinately large amount of snaps.

 

[pblmax99]

Key for Pats is stopping Jets run D...I saw some huge holes on Turkey day for the Lions...Jets will run until you can stop it....

 

[DaBruinz]

Key for Pats is stopping Jets run D...I saw some huge holes on Turkey day for the Lions...Jets will run until you can stop it....

That because the Pats only had 4 D-linemen dressed. They also played their "Big Nickel" Sub-Package the entire time. Don't expect that to be the same against the Jets.

 

[Ring 6]

Key for Pats is stopping Jets run D...I saw some huge holes on Turkey day for the Lions...Jets will run until you can stop it....

That was against nickel and dime. Jets wont be seeing that.

 

[Brady_to_Moss]

Stack up against the run and make sanchez beat you in...without a run game..hes will make some terrible decisions

 

[DaBruinz]

Stack up against the run and make sanchez beat you in...without a run game..hes will make some terrible decisions

As I have said before. Use the same gameplan that they used against the Steelers. Blitz heavy, contain Sanchez in the pocket, Jam the receivers at the line. Pound them when they catch the ball.

 

[FCB02062]

That because the Pats only had 4 D-linemen dressed. They also played their "Big Nickel" Sub-Package the entire time. Don't expect that to be the same against the Jets.

HAHAHAHA! I remember when the Pats "big nickel" circa 2002 was supposed to be an impenetrable force...Victor Green, baby...

Anyway, this year their defense is marginal at best, but the great mitigating factor is all of football, especially defense, is plus/minus....right now Pats are #2 in the NFL at +10 (I think)...

 

[D-Money]

I agree.They have to disguise some blitzes out there if they cant get pressure with the d-line.Cant let Sanchez have all this time.