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Hillary v. Giuliani: Can we put aside partisanship for a moment?

Discussion in 'Political Discussion' started by Patters, Nov 9, 2007.

  1. Patters

    Patters Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    http://rawstory.com/news/2007/Russert_Independent_men_flee_from_Hillary_1108.html

    "Tim Russert discussed the poll with Matt Lauer on Thursday's Today Show. "It's remarkable," Russert commented. "Independent men flee from Hillary Clinton and go to Rudy Giuliani." He noted that Clinton leads Giuliani by 53% to 38% among women, while the figures for men are almost exactly the opposite."

    ***

    While some of the difference might be explained in that woman are a little more liberal or perhaps have extra loyalty to their gender, the gap seems awfully large. Obviously many men do not trust Hillary and many women do, and clearly it's not based only on facts. There are emotional issues involved, and I don't think it' a left/right issue; this diagram, which shows which states have had female governors, suggests that red and blue states are roughly equally open to electing women:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_female_state_governors_in_the_United_States

    [​IMG]

    (Purple means the state has at different times had a female Dem and Repub governor.)

    Any thoughts?
  2. Turd Furguson

    Turd Furguson Rookie

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    I cant really speak to that but personally I'm not above voting in a female President. Just not THIS particular female.
  3. Harry Boy

    Harry Boy Look Up, It's Amazing PatsFans.com Supporter

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    The trouble with Russert & Mousy Lauer (lefty neo libs) is they can't believe that there are many Americans that can see right through these Clintons, these Clintons are as much of a threat to America's Safety as the Muslims are, the Clintons are very dangerous people, if one of the Clintons told me the sun was out I would put my raincoat on.

    Turd is right, when the right women comes along the men will vote, but they won't vote for Pant Suit Hillary, Hillary may win the nomination and if she does the Democrats will face the biggest loss and landslide against them that this country has ever seen.

    Also, America now sees what todays new democrats are really all about (11%) approval, the new democrats will sink their own boat again just as they did with the last two fools they ran, Gore/Kerry.
  4. Patters

    Patters Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    But why is there such a big gender gap when it comes to Hillary?
  5. PatsFanInEaglesLand

    PatsFanInEaglesLand Rookie

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    In many situations the man is the bread winnwer in the family, so he is scared of Hillary's tax policies. I don't want a 30% increase.
  6. BelichickFan

    BelichickFan B.O. = Fugazi PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #24 Jersey

    Same with me. Why do married men not like her ? They don't like b!tchy wives and that's EXACTLY the picture Hillary gives off. She's everything that I wouldn't want in a wife and it's not surprising it turns me off her in a candidate.
  7. BelichickFan

    BelichickFan B.O. = Fugazi PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #24 Jersey

    Also, this may not be a gender thing, but one of the reasons I don't want her is that "The Clintons" already had their two terms. You're only allowed two and I am not a big fan of Bill getting to be "President in Law" again. Don't bother arguing, I know it's legal and my feeling is not logical. But it's how I feel. We all get the shot at 8 years in the White House - not 16.
  8. STFarmy

    STFarmy Rookie

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    To quote the great Ron Bennington: "If Hillary wins, they should just change the name of this country to BushClintonia."

    But yeah, I just think she gives off the power-hungry, over-the-top feminist type, which most men don't like. Not that many men aren't power-hungry, but it men react even more negatively to it when it's a trait in a female.
  9. Real World

    Real World Rookie

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    I'm with you Turd. I'd vote for a woman, a minority, or african american if I thought they were the best candidate.

    Hillary does well amongst women in general, but when you disect her female support, the vast majority of it comes from those who are less educated. She's improved those figures I think, but that could revert in a national election when a candidates views are more exposed.
  10. QuiGon

    QuiGon Banned

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    Heh heh... Patters asking everone else to "put aside partisanship"... :rofl:

    Ya really want a non-partisan observation..? Here ya go: It is way too ridiculously early to bother forecasting the 2008 presidential election in such intricate detail.
  11. Turd Furguson

    Turd Furguson Rookie

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    Isnt an african american a minority or are you referring to white people who are American citizens but from say South Africa?


    If I were Bill, I'd be hitting every other woman in sight too. The thought of that shrew in my bed makes muh ding-uh-ling shrivel like a frightened turtle.
  12. QuiGon

    QuiGon Banned

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    I would not be surprised to see Hillary's support among women turing out to be weaker than many are predicting. I know this is anecdotal, but I am going to throw it out there anyway... It has been my experience that women are more sexist than men when it comes to office politics. So many women have the "queen bee syndrome" and a woman manager, director or VP gets more flack from her female subordinates than from the male ones.

    My wife (who ain't exactly quite the conservative I am) echoes those sentiments. She's an asst. VP at her company and has told me time and again that throughout her career, she has had 10 times the problems from the other women in the office than from the other men.
  13. Stokes

    Stokes Rookie

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    Interesting, never underestimate how catty women can be. On a somewhat related note I remember reading that Fred Thompson was polling high among women, and they thought it was because he projects an image of himself as a man's man. Talking tough, smoking the stogie, etc.

    I know I would have a hard time voting for someone that comes off as so unlikeable to me as Hillary. Tough to say though, that may be my opinion of her politics clouding my thoughts, I mean, Margaret Thatcher wasn't exactly a sweetheart, but I definitely would have voted for her.
  14. Real World

    Real World Rookie

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    HA! She is looking kinda nasty. She's had a lift too, allegedly. She disappeared for 2 weeks at some point a couple of years ago, and the rumor mill said she had her face lifted. I believe it cuz she looked worse before than she does now. I've got no problems with her doing it, it's a sign of the political times unfortunately. What did Andre Agassi used to say? Appearance is everything?
  15. Real World

    Real World Rookie

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    Women detest each other more so than men. Men are very competitive, but women are down right ruthless. I'm speaking very generally of course. The vast majority of women I've met in my lifetime, have all said the phrase "I get along better with men, than I do with women". Men tend to keep the same handfull of friends over time, while women change their circle like we do underwear. About once a week. :D
  16. Real World

    Real World Rookie

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    I was watching Hardball as I usually do, and they were talking about the GOP race, and were trying to handicap it. They don't think Thompson has any chance. They actually think that Romney, via the sling shot theory, is going to win the GOP primary. They think his probably wins in Iowa and NH will lead him over the rest of the lot. I pray that isn't the case. Imagine a Romney vs. Hillary match-up? [​IMG]
  17. QuiGon

    QuiGon Banned

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    Man that hits the nail on the head. I agree 100% with the above.
  18. PressCoverage

    PressCoverage Banned

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    leave it to this drone above to pollute the requested civil demeanor and chime in first with personal jab at another poster...

    anyhow, very well... not buying the "just not THIS woman" rationale at all... something tells me you Righties would be saying that about ANY democratic female candidate, from now to the end of time...
    Last edited: Nov 9, 2007
  19. Real World

    Real World Rookie

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    That comes from years and years of intimate , female relations, and very thorough hands on analysis. :rocker:
  20. Real World

    Real World Rookie

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    Would you vote for Condoleeza Rice if she were the GOP nominee? nope. Could I then say it's cuz because of (fill in the blank)? I think it's highly likely that people are being honest here, and one needs to look no further than Hillary's high negativity rating to see why. She simply is a very polarizing woman, and there are lots of people out there who do not like her at all. So when people say they would vote for a woman, but just not her, I believe most of them. Her negatives aren't just made up of white conservative men you know.
  21. Patters

    Patters Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    But, it still doesn't explain the great gender disparity. If Condi ran, it's likely we'd see a similar disparity, but it would be hard to determine to what extent it had to do with her and to what extent it had to do with her gender.
  22. wistahpatsfan

    wistahpatsfan Rookie

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    Can't stand Hillary, but Rudi's much worse IMO...can't stand his voice, grandstanding, cross-dressing (not that there's anything wrong with it...just seems weird to me, unless it's Harvey Korman, in which case it's unbelievably funny), but above all his complete disloyalty and lack of respect for his family. This will be his undoing before the primaries. Once another republican who really wants to win...like Mitt or Fred...decides he's had it with this fraud, he'll unleash Holy Hell on him and make Rudi's completely fu-ked up personality the central issue. McCain won't do it because he has too much class to be president.

    If you put a gun to my head and frced me to choose between Rudi and Hill, I'd pick Hill, but I might die from the anxiety attack before I can finish the ballot.
    Last edited: Nov 10, 2007
  23. Harry Boy

    Harry Boy Look Up, It's Amazing PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Anybody or Anything is better than Hillary, if the those grinning Bush Haters give the nomination to Hillary Mitt Romney will be the next President, I thought Thompson would shoot to the top but he has disappeared, he doesn't even come out of his house, if you want to see him you have to rent one of his movies.
    :bricks:
  24. Harry Boy

    Harry Boy Look Up, It's Amazing PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Yup, me too, I started studying Females just as soon as I found out I enjoyed wrestling with them more than I did fishing.

    Wouldn't it have been great if we could have had a Female "Neo Con" to run against Pant Suit, the news media would have gone insane.

    Cat Fights:
    I never could understand why Pant Suit didn't have Monica "Whacked" but of course she must have been used to it by the time Monica came along.
    :bricks:
  25. PressCoverage

    PressCoverage Banned

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    for all your inane babbling, do you have any real evidence the Clinton's had anyone "whacked?".... you know, a Downing Street Memo, or countless intelligence officials declaring it so? perhaps a forged document by Italian intel, or former weapons inspectors insisting they killed someone?

    if not, please think about shifting gears and present something tangible and/or convincing for once in your posting life... you're wasting your own precious remaining time....
    Last edited: Nov 10, 2007
  26. Patters

    Patters Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Can the righties give, say, examples of four or five women they would seriously consider for president. For instance, among the Democrats, I think you have Hillary, Feinstein, Boxer, McCaskill, and Pelosi, anyone of whom would be a legitimate contender in the Democratic primaries, meaning that, whether you like them or not, they're well spoken and have a commanding presence.
  27. Harry Boy

    Harry Boy Look Up, It's Amazing PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I didn't say they "whacked" anyone I said I didn't understand why Lovely Hillary didn't whack Monica Hot Lips.

    I have heard though that they had three professional hit men from NY "whack a little kitty".

    Phone Ringing---ding ding ding dingy ding ding :singing:
    "Hi, is this Pant Suit"
    "My name is Hillary Rodham President Clinton, who's this"
    "My name is Jake, I'm the Cat Whacker, I just whacked the cat"
    "OK, I may need you again"
    "Why"
    "This pain in the a$s kid Barooko Booma is giving me a lot of sh!t and he's got a dog"
    "Is that the kid with the Big Ears"
    "Yeah"
    "OK, whats the dogs name"
    "I don't know his f-cking name, for christ sake he's a dog"
    "How the hell can I whack him if I don't know his name, he won't come when I call him""
    "Ok, I'll find out his name and call you back"

    ding, ding, ding a ding ding
    "hello"
    "is this Oprah Winfrey"
    "yes this is Oprah"
    "this is President Commander In Chief Hillary"
    "what the hell do you want you white b!tch, I ain't votin for you"
    "calm down, I just want to ask you something, whats Babooka's dogs name"
    "Leroy"
    Click

    ding ding a ding ding ding
    "Hello Jakes Whacker Co, Jake speaking"
    "Its me General President Commander Hillary, the dogs name is Leroy"
    "whats his last name"
    "f-ck you"
    Last edited: Nov 10, 2007
  28. Stokes

    Stokes Rookie

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    I don't think there are too many out there at the moment, I already said I would have voted for Thatcher if she was American back in the day, how about Elizabeth Dole, I'd vote for her. Maybe Condi, though I'd have to hear her personal stance on issues before I knew that. I don't think there are too many other conservative women that are at the level of thinking about running. Am I forgetting some? I'm sure I am, but I can't for the life of me think of who right now.
  29. Harry Boy

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    Ann Coulter :rocker:
  30. Harry Boy

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    I've been drinking I jost fell off my f-cking chair again

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